Page 6 of 15 FirstFirst ... 45678 ... LastLast
Results 51 to 60 of 143

Thread: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

  1. #51
    Sage
    RiverDad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    04-20-14 @ 02:16 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    5,039

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    What I find surprising about the American aspect of this issue is how bumbling we've been. Where are the realists in the State Dept? Why wasn't this scenario gamed out long before?

    Instead we've been championing World World Gay against the Russians, patting ourselves on the back for sending Billie Jean King to Sochi. Oh, that will show the Russians.

    From the outside it sure looks like a smug group think has metastasized in our foreign policy establishment. The days of annexation are far past, no one would do this. Why not? What are the downsides? What effective stick can be wielded to deter such annexation? If there is no effective deterrent, then why would countries refrain? Because the new standards of international affairs frown on this and because it hasn't happened in a long while. Well, why hasn't it happened in a long while? If those deterrent conditions change, then why expect a behavior to remain checked?

    Everyone in the world doesn't think like a Westerner nor like a liberal Westerner.

  2. #52
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Last Seen
    08-18-15 @ 09:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,974

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Finally, to maintain military credibility in a world in which the balance of power is dynamic, the President and/or Congress need to abandon planned drastic cuts in military expenditures and manpower, even if that means reducing other expenditures, larger budget deficits than would otherwise be the case, or some combination of reallocated spending/larger budget deficits. Otherwise, the U.S. will be perceived as a great power, but one with declining capabilities. That outcome would rightly worry American allies. It could invite challenges to peripheral American interests by hostile actors.
    The problem with what you are putting forward here is that the US is going to find it impossible to continue to spend one trillion dollars on defense. It has been able to do so only because of the dollar. However, after the financial crisis of 2008, the dollar's power is on the wane as countries move away from using it as a reserve currency. What the US needs to do is focus more on developing relationships with countries, especially some that it has previously viewed as hostile, that could serve to hinder Russia's influence in the world. Iran would be a great place to start. If the US and Europe had good relations with Iran, Russia would be completely thrown off balance, especially in the Middle East.

  3. #53
    Sage


    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    IL
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:52 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    36,762

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Or maybe, the US and NATO pulled a stunt that backfired.
    Got a link for that Montecresto?
    Actions of KGB Komrade Putin have consequences and have kicked off Cold war 2.0 .
    Physics is Phun

  4. #54
    Sage


    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    IL
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:52 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    36,762

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Putin said Russia has no intention in taking eastern Ukraine.....
    What about Putin's actions so far in power, such as his massacres in Georgia, would lead you to believe that?
    unless the ethnic russians are attacked.
    How do you and Putin, the same or differently, define an ethnic Russian?
    For it's part, Ukraine parliment voted to over turn a law banning the russian language and moderate leaders are trying to soften the far right nationalists image and warning Right Sector to behave themselves so as not to give Putin an excuse for invading.
    What does this have to do with the Crimean invasion?
    If push comes to shove, they want to make it look like Russia is the aggressor.
    So in your mind, sinking ships in a harbor to blockade the Ukrainian Navy is not the act of an aggressor, just for beginners .
    Physics is Phun

  5. #55
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Ft. Campbell, KY
    Last Seen
    12-31-14 @ 08:37 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    12,177

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    From CNN:



    Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine - CNN.com

    This development is not surprising for a number of reasons:

    1. Russia has long viewed Crimea as constituting a crital national interest (naval base, majority ethnic Russian population, history).
    2. The balance of power favored Russia in moving to regain control of Crimea. Ukraine lacked the military power to impose high costs.
    3. Neither the U.S. nor Europe have sufficient interests at stake to consider military options.
    4. A military approach would be impractical under any reasonable circumstances.
    5. The costs of non-military measures are not likely to be so high relative to the gains Russia perceives it will make so as to reverse Russian policy. Russia also has capabilities of retaliating ranging from restricting access to its resources to withdrawing cooperation on major geopolitical matters e.g., Iran's nuclear program. It expects that its ability to complicate U.S. geopolitical goals will constrain the degree of U.S. economic and other non-military sanctions.
    6. Past precedent concerning Kosovo's being separated from Serbia with NATO military force playing a role during what amounted to a civil war.

    In his national address, Russian President Putin has cited a number of those factors. He did disavow intentions to become more broadly involved in Ukraine, but he has shown a willingness to act decisively where he perceives major Russian interests are at stake.

    This development also speaks anew of the need for the U.S. to develop a clear and coherent foreign policy doctrine and relearn how to engage in contingency planning (military and broader foreign policy). It needs to tighten its integration with existing NATO members so as to make clear that NATO members will be safeguarded under any circumstances, even if the use of force is required. In Asia, the U.S. needs to strengthen ties with its leading allies. Japan and South Korea need to know that American commitments to their security are reliable.

    Finally, to maintain military credibility in a world in which the balance of power is dynamic, the President and/or Congress need to abandon planned drastic cuts in military expenditures and manpower, even if that means reducing other expenditures, larger budget deficits than would otherwise be the case, or some combination of reallocated spending/larger budget deficits. Otherwise, the U.S. will be perceived as a great power, but one with declining capabilities. That outcome would rightly worry American allies. It could invite challenges to peripheral American interests by hostile actors.
    These are conflicts where strict military power is of little importance, Russia is grossly outmatched by NATO but that clearly hasn't stopped them in the past in going after non-NATO nations. What we need instead of military power is economic and deployment power, we need to provide Ukraine with monetary aid and expertise so their economy doesn't collapse and they can run a working government. Russia can and will use every criminal means to expand its power in Ukraine, undermining the local and national government to prevent the government from standing on its own and moving out of its sphere.

    Seriously Russia aint going to back down from this ****, and now its time to fight for Ukraine and give them all the support they need.

  6. #56
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    12-03-17 @ 03:32 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Yes, and France formed an government submissive to Germany in the Vichy government during Germany's military occupation of France too. Same thing with Crimea.

    And the same as with the Vichy government, the actual federal government of Ukraine has declared those of the Vichy-pro-Russian Crimean government to be traitors who will ultimately be brought to justice.

  7. #57
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    12-03-17 @ 03:32 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    These are conflicts where strict military power is of little importance, Russia is grossly outmatched by NATO but that clearly hasn't stopped them in the past in going after non-NATO nations. What we need instead of military power is economic and deployment power, we need to provide Ukraine with monetary aid and expertise so their economy doesn't collapse and they can run a working government. Russia can and will use every criminal means to expand its power in Ukraine, undermining the local and national government to prevent the government from standing on its own and moving out of its sphere.

    Seriously Russia aint going to back down from this ****, and now its time to fight for Ukraine and give them all the support they need.
    We need to put a nuclear arsenal with delivery systems in the Ukraine and American forces on the ground in Ukraine, put American troops in Ukraine controlled Crimean military bases, and offer an military alliance and forces with former Eastern and South USSR block nations to call Putin's bluff. If he is willing to go to war with the USA, that then would be his decision.

    Since this was a done-deal with the USA prior to it happening in my opinion, I don't expect anything but words until Americans get bored with their fruit-fly attention span.

  8. #58
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Ft. Campbell, KY
    Last Seen
    12-31-14 @ 08:37 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    12,177

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    We need to put a nuclear arsenal with delivery systems in the Ukraine and American forces on the ground in Ukraine, put American troops in Ukraine controlled Crimean military bases, and offer an military alliance and forces with former Eastern and South USSR block nations to call Putin's bluff. If he is willing to go to war with the USA, that then would be his decision.

    Since this was a done-deal with the USA prior to it happening in my opinion, I don't expect anything but words until Americans get bored with their fruit-fly attention span.
    That would be a ridiculously escalation, and you know we can launch a nuke anywhere on Earth they don't really need to be in Ukraine to be more effective. Russia just declared Crimea to be part of their territory and you want us to forcibly enter it?

    But I agree with bringing Ukraine into NATO

  9. #59
    Sage
    RiverDad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    04-20-14 @ 02:16 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    5,039

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    What we need instead of military power is economic and deployment power, we need to provide Ukraine with monetary aid and expertise so their economy doesn't collapse and they can run a working government.
    What's with you interventionists always stomping around the world getting the US involved in conflicts that don't affect our national interest? My kids are already on the hook for the reckless spending of previous generations, they don't need to take on more debt so that you can feel good about yourself for being a buttinski. If you feel so strongly about this, buy a plane ticket and go over there to fight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    But I agree with bringing Ukraine into NATO
    Because we need to remain strong against the awesome power of the Warsaw Pact. Wait, what, there's no Warsaw Pact anymore? Then what's the purpose of Nato?

    Besides, there's nothing like antagonizing Russia by screwing around with their Near Abroad. I'm sure the US would have always been happy, and will be happy in the future too, if Russia ever wanted to put nukes into our neighborhood, say in, oh I don't know, Cuba.

  10. #60
    Sage
    Higgins86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    England
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:55 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    13,248

    Re: Kremlin: Crimea and Sevastopol are now part of Russia, not Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Got a link for that Higgins, or is this just more WW2/Hitler fear mongering?
    Keep defending Putin. First death today in his 'peaceful revolution'...
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

Page 6 of 15 FirstFirst ... 45678 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •