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Thread: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room[W:829]

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    10 to 15% is not rare. 18% of single custodial parents are fathers. That isn't rare. And that is numbers from the census, but I'm not looking it back up for you. You can find it yourself since you are the one that continues to insist that it is rare for mothers to be forced to pay child support.
    Oh I'm sure there are occasional instances where the dad isn't incarcerated, but the woman is (where that 18% probably comes from). And even if 10-15% is accurate, it's still too low.

    If you cannot provide for your children yourself, maybe you don't need custody at all. Good way to punish women who pump out kids to milk the system.

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Oh I'm sure there are occasional instances where the dad isn't incarcerated, but the woman is (where that 18% probably comes from). And even if 10-15% is accurate, it's still too low.

    If you cannot provide for your children yourself, maybe you don't need custody at all. Good way to punish women who pump out kids to milk the system.
    No, there are plenty of incidents where the father has custody of the child. My own best friend's father had custody of her until he died, then his parents ended up raising her. She still has contact with her mother but she was never interested in raising a child with special needs. There are then some mothers who simply leave and/or don't want to take care of a kid. There are all sorts of circumstances that can lead to a father being given primary custody over a child and the mother having to pay child support.
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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Which means what? She's already denying him access to the child. If she's going to go that route, then he should be free to deny her any support as well. You can't have it both ways.
    No she is not. She is denying access to the birth - a situation where mom and fetus are still connected. Her body - her choice. When the baby is disconnected from her body it would be entirely reasonable to see the baby in short order. If she is denied this after birth, she is being an ass.

    But like I said....what father who actually cares about the baby she is trying to give birth to would actually intentionally put her in a position to make her more uncomfortable and physiologically more stressed? If he could think beyond himself for a second, he would realize that taking her to court over this was really not something that would be a net positive for the child, let alone the mom.

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    No she is not. She is denying access to the birth - a situation where mom and fetus are still connected. Her body - her choice. When the baby is disconnected from her body it would be entirely reasonable to see the baby in short order. If she is denied this after birth, she is being an ass.

    But like I said....what father who actually cares about the baby she is trying to give birth to would actually intentionally put her in a position to make her more uncomfortable and physiologically more stressed? If he could think beyond himself for a second, he would realize that taking her to court over this was really not something that would be a net positive for the child, let alone the mom.
    As far as the law is concerned, she's denying access to both. The law recognizes fetuses CHILDREN past the 1st trimester. So she is in fact denying him access to the child - born or unborn in a nuance that is irrelevant as far as the law is concerned. That said, your argument basically boils down to: She was stressed - so this was good. When in reality, we know that this was done as a move to spite the father after what seems like a ****ty breakup. What is weird about it all is that you somehow think telling the kid when he's 5 "Your mommy didn't want your daddy present when you were born" - will somehow look better than "Your mom and dad were both present when you were born". This was a self-serving act on the part of the mother. Nothing more.
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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No, there are plenty of incidents where the father has custody of the child. My own best friend's father had custody of her until he died, then his parents ended up raising her. She still has contact with her mother but she was never interested in raising a child with special needs. There are then some mothers who simply leave and/or don't want to take care of a kid. There are all sorts of circumstances that can lead to a father being given primary custody over a child and the mother having to pay child support.
    It's as I said before - the only time a father gets physical custody is in a situation like that. If a man has custody, you can bet every dollar in your pocket that the mother is 1) gone, 2) jailed, or 3) addicted to something bad. Dad could be father of the year - if the mom isn't beyond incompetent, he'll never have custody. He could be the better parent to raise them - it won't matter. Plain and simple.

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    This thread has been a real eye-opener... and not in a good way. The animosity, ignorance, misogyny and sheer venom heaped upon this woman, and basically spread around throughout the thread to all women, has been extraordinary.

    I've come to expect this kind of hatefulness from some of the posters in this thread; others, sadly, were a real surprise. I will never feel the same about them again.

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    No she is not. She is denying access to the birth - a situation where mom and fetus are still connected. Her body - her choice. When the baby is disconnected from her body it would be entirely reasonable to see the baby in short order. If she is denied this after birth, she is being an ass.

    But like I said....what father who actually cares about the baby she is trying to give birth to would actually intentionally put her in a position to make her more uncomfortable and physiologically more stressed? If he could think beyond himself for a second, he would realize that taking her to court over this was really not something that would be a net positive for the child, let alone the mom.
    He was allowed to see the child very shortly after birth, so the speculation to the contrary that other posters have been making is pure poppycock, meant only to vilify her and victimize him.

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    This thread has been a real eye-opener... and not in a good way. The animosity, ignorance, misogyny and sheer venom heaped upon this woman, and basically spread around throughout the thread to all women, has been extraordinary.

    I've come to expect this kind of hatefulness from some of the posters in this thread; others, sadly, were a real surprise. I will never feel the same about them again.
    I think you overlooked the unkind words directed at the man or are you arguing from the position that men should be able to take such abuse but it's never permissible to say anything negative about women?

    Your omission and double standard also says something.

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    It's as I said before - the only time a father gets physical custody is in a situation like that. If a man has custody, you can bet every dollar in your pocket that the mother is 1) gone, 2) jailed, or 3) addicted to something bad. Dad could be father of the year - if the mom isn't beyond incompetent, he'll never have custody. He could be the better parent to raise them - it won't matter. Plain and simple.
    In many such cases where the parents are equally able to raise the children or situated, it is likely that the parents will share custody. There is definitely some favoritism toward women in the system when it comes to child custody, but there is simply no easy fast fix to that. You can rant and rave all you want, but it won't solve the problem. And there is little the courts or any of us can do for many of them because frankly there is no way to really know who is the best parent to raise the child in most cases. Court employees aren't prescient or all knowing or mindreaders. They simply can't know which parent is best. And what are they supposed to do when both parents work jobs or one works a job and the other doesn't because the other parent was the caregiver for the children up til the divorce? What are they supposed to do if one parent (usually the father) has a job that has them working very long hours? Should they take into account who left whom? What about if one of them already has found someone else (whether they were married or not) when custody is considered? Other children of both from other people? There are simply so many things and unfortunately most people are going to say that children need their mothers more than their fathers. Sure, it would be nice to have more research done by family courts to see this, but that would also take time where the child(ren) still have to spend time with their parents and living their lives.

    Plus, believe it or not, some fathers don't want their children either. My own father only wanted to try for joint custody to avoid paying child support for four children when he divorced my mother. After he was contested on his request, he went almost completely opposite and asked for so little visitation that it was truly pathetic.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Re: New Jersey Judge Blocks Dad From Delivery Room

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    I think you overlooked the unkind words directed at the man or are you arguing from the position that men should be able to take such abuse but it's never permissible to say anything negative about women?

    Your omission and double standard also says something.
    It should be a no brainer that the woman had the right to privacy.

    He created his own drama.

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