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Russia Slams Violation of Media Freedoms in Ukraine

Yeah, right. One of the more horrific acts of the USA in WWII was not allowing German, Italian and Japanese reporters in the USA.

The claim of Russia is absurd. Every Russian reporter should be arrested as a spy if not wearing a uniform and as a POW if wearing a Russian uniform. Russia has gone to war again Ukraine and militarily invaded their country.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
What the hell are you talking about?
Are you saying silencing reporters is ok?
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"Reporters" from the country that has gone to war against your country and militarily invaded that country. Hell yeah. Do more than silence them. Imprison them.
 
Fallenangel said:
You quoted my post where I posted a report from the BBC, I assume you didn't see/read it - or it is probably also some-kind of a propaganda.

Moreover, in one of your previous posts you mentioned that no ethnic tensions existed until the Russian intervention - you really need to stop watching YouTube videos and read some of Ukraine's history, old and modern.

Fallen.
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I wasn't referring to the BBC report, other than it is questionable IMO, given that Russians and specifically cossaks are doing a lot of what Ukrainians are being blamed for.

I am very aware of the history of Ukraine. And the history of that entire region for that matter (Black Sea, Balkans, Urals, etc.). I spent over a year on the ground their working hand in hand with many of the ethnic groups in that region. I had to study their history, and got first hand accounts and knowledge of their lives both historically and currently.

I didn't say that no ethnic tensions existed at all. I said:
Beaudreaux said:
... But Russia is playing to the ethnic tension and creating ethnic tension where none existed. ...
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There is of course tensions between ethic groups that spans millennia. But Russia is inflaming it to a dangerous fevered pitch, and creating major ethnic tensions where none currently existed. An example of this is that the Tartars that were run out of Crimea by Stalin in WWII have started returning to Crimea in the last few decades. They have been reintegrating back into society with very little problems... until now.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
My opinion is this:
Whats going on is very confusing. Its almost clear that the vast majority of whats going on in Kiev and western Ukraine is clearly Western friendly and that they want to be part of the EU and want to move on from the BS. What is not so clear is the eastern Ukranian area, espeially focusing on Crimeia. There have been reports that the Russian gov overan the vote in the Crimeian parliament to force them bascially move the vote to go to the people in a resolution for them to direclty vote on. This is also all speculation.
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I agree with your assessment. It's very difficult to know exactly what's happening and who's doing ti to whom.

Did you see the video of the Russian Special Forces blowing the doors down to the Crimean Parliament using explosives and storming the building? This occurred the same day that the guy that his party (pro-Russian party that got only 3% of the vote in the last election) was put in power (by Russia) and that guy was made the head of the Crimean Parliament.

There is proof of certain things that we can know as fact. Such as the video I mentioned, as well as other video and interviews with Russian soldiers admitting they are Russian.

Here's the bottom line...

No matter what has happened or is happening in Ukraine, Russia did not have the right to invade. Period.

Put troops on the border? Sure. That would be prudent for any government to do. But invade? Hell no.
 
Beau, you think that the US has greater concerns in the Ukraine than Russia?
 
Beaudreaux said:
I wasn't referring to the BBC report, other than it is questionable IMO, given that Russians and specifically Cossaks are doing a lot of what Ukrainians are being blamed for.
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What?

Btw. Here is some info regarding some more "freedom":
OSCE media freedom representative concerned about new steps to restrict media plurality in Ukraine - Representative on Freedom of the Media

Beaudreaux said:
I am very aware of the history of Ukraine. And the history of that entire region for that matter (Black Sea, Balkans, Urals, etc.). I spent over a year on the ground their working hand in hand with many of the ethnic groups in that region. I had to study their history, and got first hand accounts and knowledge of their lives both historically and currently.
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Great, and for some reason though you go own to write, what you've written below.

Beaudreaux said:
I didn't say that no ethnic tensions existed at all. I said: ".. But Russia is playing to the ethnic tension and creating ethnic tension where none existed. ..."

There is of course tensions between ethic groups that spans millennia. But Russia is inflaming it to a dangerous fevered pitch, and creating major ethnic tensions where none currently existed. An example of this is that the Tartars that were run out of Crimea by Stalin in WWII and have started returning to Crimea in the last few decades. They have been reintegrating back into society with very little problems... until now.
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Actually, the thing that made these tensions visible than ever before is not Russia, but the latest revolution and the sides that people willingly/unwillingly decided to take in it. These tensions, in some cases existed for centuries other are more recent, but they never went away, they were simply moderated by the daily life people have to live next to each other - but they did not disappear, and so "Moskal" in the west, is still "Moskal".

For example, the Tatars you mentioned are of course scared (especially elderly people) - it is understandable - hence the Medjlis calls for boycotting the referendum.
However, there are already negotiators talking to them both from Crimea and even from Russia in order to try and assure them that no harm would be made to them. Would they be satisfied? probably not, but there is no way in which a revolution could please all the people that are involved/affected by it.

Fallen.
 
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Montecresto said:
Beau, you think that the US has greater concerns in the Ukraine than Russia?
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Our concern is no less than Russia's. With the exception that Ukraine violence could have spilled over the border into Russia. The problem is that the violence stopped before Russia invaded. They could have closed the border and placed troops along the border to prevent it. They didn't. They invaded Crimea and it looks like they're moving into the eastern region as well.
 
Beaudreaux said:
Please watch this video and tell me which side is attacking journalists:

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Yep, I was just about to post that, watched it on youtube this morning.

harsh ****.
 
Fallenangel said:
Already posted this but here it is anyways, watch the video report as well.

BBC News - Ukraine crisis: Kiev tightens grip on Donetsk in east

Cheers,
Fallen.
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The elderly woman there states in that video that "Love for Russia never ended, just that generations have grown to believe that Ukraine is independent from Russia." Yet they compare Ukraine with Dardania?

When did we ever loved Russia?! It has been the sole supporter of Southern Slavs that have brought our demise on our own native lands since from middle aged 7th century till 1999 (with a few centuries of pause from terror during Ottoman Empire).
 
Beaudreaux said:
Please watch this video and tell me which side is attacking journalists:

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Cheeses! The Russian blue uniforms are identical with Serbian paramilitary thugs!

Google Image Result for http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-iVeisGPr39E/ULKHy9_eEmI/AAAAAAAASWA/proDia2mtQg/s1600/pigs.jpg

Google Image Result for http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/7412/976/320/Nebojsha%2520Minic_War%2520Criminal3.jpg

The reporters were indeed lucky! They were only accused of holding fiction weapons such as "knives" and "guns" that was enough to warrant a search.

Wonder what would happen to the civilians of Ukraine if Russians accused them of fiction atrocities against other Russians also?
 
Beaudreaux said:
Our concern is no less than Russia's. With the exception that Ukraine violence could have spilled over the border into Russia. The problem is that the violence stopped before Russia invaded. They could have closed the border and placed troops along the border to prevent it. They didn't. They invaded Crimea and it looks like they're moving into the eastern region as well.
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Yes the reporter said that they have moved further from Crimea!
 
DDD said:
The elderly woman there states in that video that "Love for Russia never ended, just that generations have grown to believe that Ukraine is independent from Russia."
Yet they compare Ukraine with Dardania?

When did we ever loved Russia?! It has been the sole supporter of Southern Slavs that have brought our demise on our own native lands since from middle aged 7th century till 1999 (with a few centuries of pause from terror during Ottoman Empire).
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> What are you talking about?

EDIT: People at least Google Chonhar in Google map before you talk about "Russian invasion" to the East.

Fallen.
 
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Fallenangel said:
> What are you talking about?
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Yeah! I could not believe it myself. But Russians in Chrimea officially refer us about their unilateral independence. As if we are the same situation!

Fallenangel said:
EDIT: People at least Google Chonhar in Google map before you talk about "Russian invasion" to the East.

Fallen.
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CONHAR DEVELOPMENTS LTD. Free business summary taken from official Companies House information. Free Alerts.

How about you provide some insights?
 
Beaudreaux said:
Our concern is no less than Russia's. With the exception that Ukraine violence could have spilled over the border into Russia. The problem is that the violence stopped before Russia invaded. They could have closed the border and placed troops along the border to prevent it. They didn't. They invaded Crimea and it looks like they're moving into the eastern region as well.
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Yeah. Well, we disagree that the Ukraine has the same significance to the US as it does to Russia. But, besides that, the US started this, not Russia. Having been working in the Ukraine, as we have elsewhere, to encourage and support the overthrow of the elected government by force, the president under fire as his caravan was fleeing, is hardly a democratic process, and regardless of Western propaganda to the contrary, the "new government" was not elected, nor representative of all the Ukrainian people. I've been telling you for a long time that Russia and China (as well as many other smaller, less powerful countries) are tired of US interference and "regime change" in countries that we wish to influence and control. Our ambassadors have been run out of Venezuela for the same thing, we forced the Bolivian presidents plane to the ground and detained it on the field for 8 hours searching through it for Snowden, how stupid was that, and something that Americans would be screaming bloody murder,was an act of war, should it have happened to our president on Air Force One. At any rate, I can't hardly blame Russia for calling bull**** on the US for our subservience in trying to pull Ukraine into the Western orbit, and only makes sense that they would be pulling it back.

Is the Ukraine of such value to you that you would be willing to risk hostilities with Russia, or in any way spend our blood and treasure on it?
 
DDD said:
Yeah! I could not believe it myself. But Russians in Chrimea officially refer us about their unilateral independence. As if we are the same situation!
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Again, what the hell you are talking about, and how it is related to the topic of the OP?!?


DDD said:
CONHAR DEVELOPMENTS LTD. Free business summary taken from official Companies House information. Free Alerts.

How about you provide some insights?
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You were talking about Russians moving into the East of Ukraine - both checkpoints in the Vice video are on two opposite sides of Chonhar - use G-o-o-g-l-e M-A-P to find its location in Ukraine.

Fallen.
 
Since Russia still insists there are no Russian troops in Crimea, I'm not inclined to believe a damned thing they say.
 
DDD said:
Sometimes you surprise me how you cannot catchup Fallen.

http://rt.com/news/crimea-parliament-independence-ukraine-086/

Can you at least connect this link with what I wrote before?
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And I ask you again how the hell it has anything to do with the topic of this thread? i.e. generally freedom, freedom of press in Ukraine and specifically "Russia Slams Violation of Media Freedoms in Ukraine"?!?

btw..I see you managed to Google the approx location of the town and the checkpoints.


Fallen.
 
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Fallenangel said:
And I ask you again how the hell it has anything to do with the topic of this thread? i.e. generally freedom, freedom of press in Ukraine and specifically "Russia Slams Violation of Media Freedoms in Ukraine"?!?

btw..I see you managed to Google the approx location of the town and the checkpoints.

Fallen.
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Something in your resource mentioned something and made me reply. You must have Fallen too low these days. Forget it.
 
Fallenangel said:
What? Btw. Here is some info regarding some more "freedom": OSCE media freedom representative concerned about new steps to restrict media plurality in Ukraine - Representative on Freedom of the Media
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I actually included that link in my opening post. Seems no one noticed. The simple reality is that Western media are not going to pay nearly as much attention to these things as it conflicts with the desired narrative. Coverage that portrays the Ukrainian government as anything but the innocent victim of ebil Russian aggression is simply not in the cards. There is only one lord of the world and it does not share power, let alone blame.
Beaudreaux said:
The problem is that the violence stopped before Russia invaded.
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No, it didn't. Crime was in the midst of unrest and several people had died during clashes outside the regional parliament. Pro-Kiev demonstrators had even briefly broken into the Crimean parliament and threatened lawmakers. Afterwards Crimean Tatars were talking about arming themselves and the Crimean Russians were also arming themselves. We don't know how it would have played out, but there was a significant risk of the situation turning into a bloody ethnic conflict. Any intervention by the Kiev government would have been ineffectual and probably only inflame the situation. It was right after that battle outside the regional parliament when Russian forces began securing various strategic locations across the peninsula.
 
Montecresto said:
Yeah. Well, we disagree that the Ukraine has the same significance to the US as it does to Russia. But, besides that, the US started this, not Russia. Having been working in the Ukraine, as we have elsewhere, to encourage and support the overthrow of the elected government by force, the president under fire as his caravan was fleeing, is hardly a democratic process, and regardless of Western propaganda to the contrary, the "new government" was not elected, nor representative of all the Ukrainian people. I've been telling you for a long time that Russia and China (as well as many other smaller, less powerful countries) are tired of US interference and "regime change" in countries that we wish to influence and control. Our ambassadors have been run out of Venezuela for the same thing, we forced the Bolivian presidents plane to the ground and detained it on the field for 8 hours searching through it for Snowden, how stupid was that, and something that Americans would be screaming bloody murder,was an act of war, should it have happened to our president on Air Force One. At any rate, I can't hardly blame Russia for calling bull**** on the US for our subservience in trying to pull Ukraine into the Western orbit, and only makes sense that they would be pulling it back.

Is the Ukraine of such value to you that you would be willing to risk hostilities with Russia, or in any way spend our blood and treasure on it?
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Monte... as to the majority of your post my friend... Wow, just.... Wow.

As for the last sentence/question, I will answer with a question. Where should we draw the line? At our borders? If so, it would be too late then.
 
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