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Thread: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

  1. #171
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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    I'll repost this here:

    lol seriously? It'd actually be more impressive if the guy that took control of the country was someone that State Department folks hadn't ever met/hung out with. What do you think foreign service people of all nations get paid to do? They're supposed to hobnob with local/national/regional players and have the inside scoop of who's power is waxing and who's power is waning. That's like...ya know...one of their vital functions?

    You think because he was mentioned, that means he was put in charge. It's the converse: it was because he was a person who could (and, it turns out, would) be in charge that he was mentioned in the first place. You mistook for the effect for the cause. Important people get mentioned in important conversations; as opposed to being mentioned in an important conversation and then becoming important.
    I tried to tell that earlier. They just can't get past their tin foil hat rage against the US, the CIA, the NSA and maybe even Disneyland.
    Everything in your life is a reflection of a choice you have made. If you want a different result, don't blame someone else, or expect others to make a change, you should stop complaining and make a different choice. Remember, the circumstances of your birth don't determine the outcome of your life.

  2. #172
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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    I tried to tell that earlier. They just can't get past their tin foil hat rage against the US, the CIA, the NSA and maybe even Disneyland.
    You're definitely 100%. Misinformed, that is. What I said about bozone and osteopornosis is/was prescient, don't you think? That's not rhetorical.

  3. #173
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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    It's almost like you're not sure of what a "country" is.

    I want to again specify- because you seem to be unable to understand what I'm saying- that I'm not saying Russia is particularly "wrong". I'm very much an IR neorealist. It's all subjective. But the pains some of you are going through to try to make Russia look like a saint in comparison to the evil US is just laughable.
    Well, it's laughable to see some of you take such great pains to be relevant and yet post absolutely nothing worth responding to. lol

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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Well, it's laughable to see some of you take such great pains to be relevant and yet post absolutely nothing worth responding to. lol
    Love it when someone shoots themselves in their own foot (because I'm not a nice person):

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    If you had a good arguement you wouldn't need to resort to such low brow tactics.
    Such low brow tactics, Moot. It'd be much nicer if you had a good "arguement".
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    My, my. You must really hate the US.
    I don't think I hate the US anymore than you do.

    What evidence do you have that the US installed these guys? None. It doesn't exist because it didn't happen.
    I provided a link to a hacked phone conversation of a US diplomat chosing which man the US wanted for leader of Ukraine and now he is. But I guess if you don't want to see it then of course it must not exist.


    Did the US invade Ukraine? No.
    Supporting the opposition by proxy is typical of US invasions. It worked quite well with Pinochet.

    Did the Russians invade Ukraine? Yes.
    Thats debatable.

    Jeez Louise. Get it straight.
    Take it easy, pal..its just a forum.

    Diplomats discuss all the time who they'd like to see in power. Russia wanted Obama. Putin was quoted as saying so. Did Russia put Obama in power?

    Can you see how silly this is?
    Yeah, that was a pretty stupid false equilvent that you posted there. lol Obama was elected president...Yats was not. Big difference wouldn't you say?


    Whats intersting about Nuland's hacked phone call is the that US hasn't denied a single word she said and much of it has already come to pass. Yats is now officially a US puppet.
    Last edited by Moot; 03-17-14 at 01:25 AM.

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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    I provided a link to a hacked phone conversation of a US diplomat chosing which leader the US wanted for leader of Ukraine and now he is.
    What you have is a US diplomat talking to another about the two players and which one they preferred, and which one they thought would come out on top. Apparently, in bizarro world, it's better for diplomats to be wrong- I guess that makes them look innocent. If you're right? You're evil. If you're wrong? You're dumb. Very convenient.

    Supporting the opposition by proxy is typical of US invasions. It worked quite well with Pinochet.
    lol, so that's a no. Difficult to admit, we see.

    Whats intersting about Nuland's hacked phone call is the that US hasn't denied a single word she said and much of it has already come to pass.
    Would you believe it if they did? So what does it matter?

    She gave her opinion on which of two would be better, and she was right. SHOCKER.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    The US wanted Yats to be leader of Ukraine....and look...now he is.
    The participants in the telephone conversation thought he was the best man for the job and he might well be. We'll see.

  8. #178
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    Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    I don't think I hate the US anymore than you do.

    I provided a link to a hacked phone conversation of a US diplomat chosing which leader the US wanted for leader of Ukraine and now he is. But I guess if you don't want to see it then of course it must not exist.


    Supporting the opposition by proxy is typical of US invasions. It worked quite well with Pinochet.

    Thats debatable.

    Take it easy, pal..its just a forum.



    Yeah, that was a pretty stupid false equilvent that you posted there. lol Whats intersting about Nuland's hacked phone call is the that US hasn't denied a single word she said and much of it has already come to pass. Yats is now officially a US puppet.
    Then if you don't hate the US, why are you so quick to assume hypercritical conspiracy theories that have no basis in fact other than people believe it's possible since the US is awful and does these type things everywhere (which they do not)? You give way to much credit to the US if you think we actually could have coordinated this event. The only time this type event has even come close to occurring with the help of the US it involved an armed insurrection which this was not. Pinochet is a non-sequitur.

    Your linked phone call shows nothing more than a typical discussion between two diplomats. Nothing more. I would suggest doing some research on International Affairs. IR is accomplished by every country with the sole goal of what is in the best interest of that country. Have anything else?

    Of course the US isn't going to deny the conversation. Nor should they. And it's not a ridiculous comparison between what you say and what happened with Putin saying he hoped Obama was elected; that is unless what you say happened is ridiculous, which it is (which means they both are). That's why I stated it. To demonstrate the illogical and unrealistic jump from the phone call to saying there is proof the US put them in power.

    Do you feel that any country has the right to invade another country and impose their chosen and hand picked person over that government? You accuse the US of doing that with no proof yet support Russia doing that very thing while denying it happened against empirical evidence that they did?

    Why? If not out of hatred for the US?
    Everything in your life is a reflection of a choice you have made. If you want a different result, don't blame someone else, or expect others to make a change, you should stop complaining and make a different choice. Remember, the circumstances of your birth don't determine the outcome of your life.

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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    What you have is a US diplomat talking to another about the two players and which one they preferred, and which one they thought would come out on top. Apparently, in bizarro world, it's better for diplomats to be wrong- I guess that makes them look innocent. If you're right? You're evil. If you're wrong? You're dumb. Very convenient.
    lol, so that's a no. Difficult to admit, we see.
    Would you believe it if they did? So what does it matter?
    She gave her opinion on which of two would be better, and she was right. SHOCKER.
    That these two people in the conversation were actually able to overthrow the Ukrainian government must rank as the greatest diplomatic coup of the ages. I'm certainly impressed.

  10. #180
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    Re: Crimea parliament declares independence from Ukraine ahead of referendum

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The participants in the telephone conversation thought he was the best man for the job and he might well be. We'll see.
    From what I've read about Yats, he is very qualified and a moderate. I totally agree with the US picking Yats over Olag and the other guy, the boxer. But it's still US interference anyway you slice and dice it.

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