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US prepares $1B aid package for troubled Ukraine.....

apdst said:
We got'er done, either way. That's all that counts.

How well do you think the Euros are going to do defusing this one?

Ukraine: UK rules out Russia trade curbs? - BBC News | UK Fresh News - thenews-uk.com
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And that hillbilly'esque attitude about just shooting the **** out of anyone that doesn't agree with how we want things handled is why we are reviled. Americans always believe our own hype and then get pissed when almost everyone else looks at us and shake their head.

You make the mistake of assuming that I consider kicking Russia out of the Crimea as "diffusing" the situation. That isn't going to happen. If Russia pulls out of the Crimea it will be because they choose to. Diffusing this, at this point, means avoiding an escalation to the point of a shooting war between Ukraine and Russia. Containment and pulling back from the brink of war, calming the markets, and letting Kiev and Moscow handle the issue of Crimean autonomy is diffusing the situation. The U.S. strutting about and flexing military muscle isn't going to accomplish that. NATO forces massing in Poland and Romania and anywhere else along the western Ukrainian border isn't going to accomplish that.
 
Lerxst said:
You make the mistake of assuming that I consider kicking Russia out of the Crimea as "diffusing" the situation. That isn't going to happen. If Russia pulls out of the Crimea it will be because they choose to. Diffusing this, at this point, means avoiding an escalation to the point of a shooting war between Ukraine and Russia. Containment and pulling back from the brink of war, calming the markets, and letting Kiev and Moscow handle the issue of Crimean autonomy is diffusing the situation. The U.S. strutting about and flexing military muscle isn't going to accomplish that. NATO forces massing in Poland and Romania and anywhere else along the western Ukrainian border isn't going to accomplish that.
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Oh, so you believe appeasement is the answer?

It's useless to continue talking to you on this subject.
 
apdst said:
Stalin had it under control, too! :lamo
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First we compared him to Hitler, now Stalin, next who. It's beyond comprehension that Putin having killed no one or destroyed any property in this issue, and he gets compared to Hitler and Stalin. Lmao.
 
Montecresto said:
First we compared him to Hitler, now Stalin, next who. It's beyond comprehension that Putin having killed no one or destroyed any property in this issue, and he gets compared to Hitler and Stalin. Lmao.
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Yeah because Putin has started ethnic cleansing and deporting the Tartars lol. :)
 
apdst said:
Oh, so you believe appeasement is the answer?

It's useless to continue talking to you on this subject.
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I believe in letting the Europeans deal with this. You are so tough.
 
Lerxst said:
You obviously have no idea about who Stalin or Putin are, or you are just being obtuse.
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Not only do I know who Stalin and Putin are, I know who Neville Chamberlin was, too. He believed that appeasement was the answer to hostile expansion.
 
Lerxst said:
I believe in letting the Europeans deal with this. You are so tough.
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No, you believe in letting the Euros ignore the situation and hope it goes away by itself. :lamo
 
Lerxst said:
Yeah because Putin has started ethnic cleansing and deporting the Tartars lol. :)
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"tatars", nor tartars. In the interest of accuracy.
 
Montecresto said:
First we compared him to Hitler, now Stalin, next who. It's beyond comprehension that Putin having killed no one or destroyed any property in this issue, and he gets compared to Hitler and Stalin. Lmao.
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Pol Pot?
 
That 1 billion dollars could sure help a lot of poor Americans struggling to eat and keep warm.
 
apdst said:
No, you believe in letting the Euros ignore the situation and hope it goes away by itself. :lamo
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Hahah...no. I believe in letting the Europeans handle a European issue...preferably diplomatically.

You like seeing bomb laden U.S. jets take off from aircraft carriers from the comfort of your living room and say stuff like "we gonna git er done!"

People like you put no value on the human cost of war. Russia hasn't killed a single person in this operation yet. You talk mad **** about Russia sending troops into the Crimea yet romanticize all the warfare the U.S. has exported around the world.

You epitomize everything the world sees wrong with my country.
 
apdst said:
Not only do I know who Stalin and Putin are, I know who Neville Chamberlin was, too. He believed that appeasement was the answer to hostile expansion.
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Except Putin engaged in no hostilities. Stop with the ridiculous comparisons.
 
Grant said:
Relax! There's global warming and food stamps to make everything right.
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Well I sure hope global warming comes back, because it is really cold right now.
 
apdst said:
"tatars", nor tartars. In the interest of accuracy.
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I'm sorry what is the point of your post? That I capitalized Tartars? It was appropriate.
 
apdst said:
Not only do I know who Stalin and Putin are, I know who Neville Chamberlin was, too. He believed that appeasement was the answer to hostile expansion.
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You sound like the super smart people who **** their pants when Kennedy refused to start bombing Cuba and sinking Russian ships bound for Havana.
 
Lerxst said:
You sound like the super smart people who **** their pants when Kennedy refused to start bombing Cuba and sinking Russian ships bound for Havana.
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You sound like the super smart people that thought Kennedy should sit back and do nothing.
 
Lerxst said:
You sound like the super smart people who **** their pants when Kennedy refused to start bombing Cuba and sinking Russian ships bound for Havana.
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Do you have a link to that?
 
Lerxst said:
Really? In European issues we have a track record of diffusing situations? Like what? Cuba? Well that wasn't really a European situation, that was a Caribbean situation involving Russia and the US. But okay...that's one. What other situations have we diffused?

How did we diffuse the situation in Kuwait? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation with Iraq/Saddam Hussein? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation with Afghanistan/Taliban? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation with Panama? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation in the Balkans? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation in Vietnam? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation in Korea? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation in Grenada? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation in Libya? Militarily.
How did we diffuse the situation in Somalia? We didn't.
How did we diffuse the situation in Syria? We didn't.
How did we diffuse the situation in Egypt? We didn't.
How did we diffuse the situation in Mexico? We didn't.

That's not really diffusing anything. That's shooting and bombing ****. Pretty much the antithesis of diffusion. But I see where you get the idea we have a really good track record. Yeah we haven't gone to war with Canada lately.

And "we" as in the U.S., did not win the Cold War all by ourselves. If you think we did you are quite wrong. We had a lot of help...much of it European. Oh...and Mikhail Gorbachev had a big role as well. Maybe look up Perestroika and Glasnost. To say "the U.S. won the Cold War" is to betray a lack of understanding of the Cold War, who "fought" it, and how it was "fought."

But please, show me some more examples of how we have successfully "diffused" situations.
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awesome post!


No, you have not been to war with us Canadians for 202 years. And you are not likely to, as we are the only nation on earth who successfully repelled an American invasion. We are really sorry about burning down the Capital and Mr. Jefferson's new White House. You can have some free maple syrup since that comes from Ontario and we have oil which you have to pay for because of our carbon taxes.

No, the US no more won the cold war than they won WWII, despite the propaganda of 3,107 John Wayne movies. There was that small matter in Poland you may recall that required the Kremlin to be "invited" to send tanks to kill some Polish people who responded by refusing to work or sell food to soldiers. Lech Walensa and Solidarity, the docks shut down and and a crumbling economy. It cost the Russians so much to be there they could not afford to pay their soldiers, who, if they wanted to eat, had to be nice to Poles. I was a journalist guest of Solidarity at that time, it was astonishing to see women spit at Russian soldiers, they particularly liked giving them trhe finger.

It was what, a year later the Berlin Wall came down while similar unpaid soldiers stood by gaping like morons. You may recall that that wall coming down was a complete surprise to the CIA who it is now claimed "Won" the cold war.

The cold war would not have ended had it not been for a Roman Catholic Priest who admired Ronald Reagan who became the Priest of Rome who shamed the priests of Poland for their silence about Russian attrocities and who defied the Kremlin's warning not to interfere. His name was Karol Józef Wojtyła, or to non Poles Pope John Paul the second.

It was later, much later that Ronald Reagan issued the famous line: "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!", which is you really want to know was written by a Canadian.

I ask of Obama's defenders to name one war in which the US was a clear victor in a necessary war..

In closing there was one conflict which the US, with the help of Kaiser Wilhelm did solve without military force, although Canadian/British marines stood off against Americans:

On June 15, 1859, exactly thirteen years after the adoption of the Oregon Treaty, the ambiguity led to direct conflict. Lyman Cutlar, an American farmer who had moved onto the island claiming rights to live there under the Donation Land Claim Act, found a large black pig rooting in his garden.[2][6][8] He had found the pig eating his tubers. This was not the first occurrence. Cutlar was so upset that he took aim and shot the pig, killing it. It turned out that the pig was owned by an Irishman, Charles Griffin, who was employed by the Hudson's Bay Company to run the sheep ranch.[2][6][8] He also owned several pigs which he allowed to roam freely. The two had lived in peace until this incident. Cutlar offered $10 to Griffin to compensate for the pig, but Griffin was unsatisfied with this offer and demanded $100. Following this reply, Cutlar believed he should not have to pay for the pig because the pig had been trespassing on his land. (A possibly apocryphal story claims Cutlar said to Griffin, "It was eating my potatoes." Griffin replied, "It is up to you to keep your potatoes out of my pig."[8]) When British authorities threatened to arrest Cutlar, American settlers called for military protection.

Pig War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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The only casualty was a pig. Even then I think we were growing BC Bud
 
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