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Thread: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I believe you're right on target. We have a president that hates America, opposes American exceptionalism and believes that all the bad things that have happened in the past 100+/- years are the fault of The United States.
    The first part is false and the rest is hyperbole.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Carjosse View Post
    The Western powers have to at least place sanctions on Russia if they are not going to help Ukraine. We cannot let Russia invade whoever they want.
    It's just the US that gets that job.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The Russians and the Chinese never stopped wanting to rule the world. They would have pulled it off, if not for The United States.
    Who doesn't want to rule the world, the US?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The same IC that got it wrong in Iraq, the same IC that gets everything wrong. In my business, I fire people like that.
    Two things, again remembering that I'm not at all a patriot.
    First, we don't know whether our IC knew about this or not, and secondly, predicted or not, what different actions to date do you think should've been taken? I can't think of one appropriate action to have taken up to now, and it seems that the isolation idea may work pretty well since so many nations are seemingly on board. That's beside the point though, what actions do you think we should've taken that we haven't?

    All this super excitement over our response to this just seems way overblown to me. I sure didn't see anyone here getting their panties in a wad when Russia didn't respond aggressively when we invaded and occupied Iraq, which is a whole lot less "understandable" than Russia going into Crimea where they already had a base of operation and local cooperation.
    jallman: "It's all good. At least you have a thick skin and can take being poked fun back at without crying. "

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    In a global poll, the US is seen as the biggest threat to world peace, so this may be seen as a good development.
    In a perfect world, I might find myself agreeing with you. In the imperfect world, with nations who still operate as little more than tribal war grounds, and where oppression is still the law of the land, I will have to disagree. We aren't living in a world made up entirely of western democratic nations, and as is necessary, playing to the lowest common denominator means that someone has to wield the big stick.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    Two things, again remembering that I'm not at all a patriot.
    First, we don't know whether our IC knew about this or not, and secondly, predicted or not, what different actions to date do you think should've been taken? I can't think of one appropriate action to have taken up to now, and it seems that the isolation idea may work pretty well since so many nations are seemingly on board. That's beside the point though, what actions do you think we should've taken that we haven't?

    All this super excitement over our response to this just seems way overblown to me. I sure didn't see anyone here getting their panties in a wad when Russia didn't respond aggressively when we invaded and occupied Iraq, which is a whole lot less "understandable" than Russia going into Crimea where they already had a base of operation and local cooperation.
    None whatsoever. At this point, I don't believe Putin has acted out of line. But I still have no confidence in our IC.

    And I totally agree with your second point!
    Last edited by Montecresto; 03-03-14 at 05:32 PM.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia
    if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine


    Obama threatens to

    Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the time for warnings is over. The article says they are considering what steps to take. Why don't they already KNOW what steps to take? Why are no contingency plans for this in place already? If our intelligence didn't see this coming? Why not?

    I blame our intelligence community. We spend billions​ of dollars to get a heads up on this type action. What happened?
    Personally, I think US and other intelligence knows all about what's going on over there through satellite imagery and ground intelligence. They also have contingency plans in place for various possible scenarios. I think what's happening now is the normal build up of public opinion that is needed to gel opposition in places like Europe, America itself, Canada, and other western allies. The movement to cancel participation in the G8 in Sochi by the G7 is just such a move to increase awareness in the public that this is a serious "crisis" that is escalating.

    I don't think there's anything that can be imminently done here - considering that it took months to get the world behind taking back Kuwait after Iraq invaded and it took the better part of a year to get coordinated movement to move into Afghanistan, etc. And look at the years and years of discussion/debate needed to move on sanctions against Iran and their nuclear aspirations.

    Unless this drastically escalates on the Russian side, or if the western Ukrainians and the government rise up against this Russian action, I don't see anything happening any time soon.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    In a perfect world, I might find myself agreeing with you. In the imperfect world, with nations who still operate as little more than tribal war grounds, and where oppression is still the law of the land, I will have to disagree. We aren't living in a world made up entirely of western democratic nations, and as is necessary, playing to the lowest common denominator means that someone has to wield the big stick.
    That's the whole point. Lately its been the democratic nations that are a threat to global peace. I still don't see this as a bad development.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Obama, still playing small ball.

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    Re: Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia
    if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine


    Obama threatens to

    Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the time for warnings is over. The article says they are considering what steps to take. Why don't they already KNOW what steps to take? Why are no contingency plans for this in place already? If our intelligence didn't see this coming? Why not?

    I blame our intelligence community. We spend billions​ of dollars to get a heads up on this type action. What happened?



    http://news.yahoo.com/obama-says-rus...-politics.html

    http://news.yahoo.com/us-russia-thre...175954373.html

    http://news.yahoo.com/u-sanctions-ru...4--sector.html


    Here ya go Maggie. Here is what our Former CIA Chief said.




    Ex- CIA Chief: Why We Keep Getting Putin Wrong.....


    Blame a myopic mindset—and an intelligence corps focused on terrorism, not Moscow.

    The last time Russian troops invaded one of its neighbors, the U.S. intelligence community was also caught off guard.

    The year was 2008 and the country was Georgia instead of the Ukraine. And just as in 2014, back then there were early signs that Moscow was serious—it was issuing visas to ethnic Russian speakers inGeorgia, like it's doing now in Ukraine. U.S. analysts just didn’t believe Russia would go as far as it did.

    Today, as in 2008, American policy makers have found themselves burned after trying to make Vladimir Putin a partner when Putin himself sees America as a rival. This has often led Republican and Democratic led administrations to find themselves flat footed in the face of Russian aggression and U.S. intelligence analysts racing to explain how they misread Putin’s motivations.

    “This is less a question of how many collection resources we throw at Russia and more broadly about the analytic challenge of understanding Putin’s mind set,” said Michael Hayden, a former CIA director and NSA director under President George W. Bush. “Here our Secretary of State is saying this is not the Cold War, it’s win-win and it’s not zero sum. But for Vladimir Putin it is zero sum. That’s what we need to understand.”

    For the last 13 years, the way you got ahead in America's intelligence services was to specialize in stopping terrorists. Compared to al-Qaeda, the Russians were seen as has-beensalbeit nuclear-armed has-beens. Spying on Moscow was considered a second-tier priority. Sure, the Russian intelligence agencies were (and are) one of the world's most sophisticated; competing against the sons of the KGB was one of the toughest challenges for an American operative or analyst. But the stakes just weren't that high. It was like having a chess match against your grandfather, while everyone else played Call of Duty for money.....snip~

    Ex- CIA Chief: Why We Keep Getting Putin Wrong - The Daily Beast

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe...2014-a-23.html
    Last edited by MMC; 03-03-14 at 05:33 PM.

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