• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Kerry condemns Russia's 'incredible act of aggression' in Ukraine

apdst said:
When did "modern Russia" begin? What ever date is most convenient to support your weak argument?
Click to expand...

Do you really think modern Russia is exactly the same as fifty years ago?
 
PeteEU said:
Eh? Are you paranoid much? How the hell is it the EUs fault for the political instability in Ukraine? Are you seriously saying that the EU, as an organisation, is responsible for the political divide between the western part of Ukraine and the eastern part? That they are at fault for the Ukrainian politicians on both sides for being utterly corrupt? Are you saying that it is the fault of the EU that the now former President seems to have disappeared with billions? What is next.. you gonna blame the EU for you not waking up because your alarm clock is busted?
Click to expand...

When you stick a hornet's nest it is stupid to accuse the hornets for the attack. It is much more intelligent to figure out what went wrong.
 
Paleocon said:
Do you really think modern Russia is exactly the same as fifty years ago?
Click to expand...

The head honcho in Russia joined the KGB 40 years ago, so I would say that not much has changed.
 
Montecresto said:
Sure seems a lot of people willing to risk war with Russia to defend the interests of only half of Ukrainians and against the interests of the rest. Classic definition of the pro-war crowd.
Click to expand...

How do you figure, "only half of Ukrainians?
 
Montecresto said:
Yes, agreed, but in you're post that I quoted, you were talking about Syria. I'm no defender of Obama's foreign policy, I just don't think there was anything he could do overtly in Syria, nor do I think there is anything he could or should do in Ukraine. And I'm definitely not interested in getting into a military confrontation with Russia. And I totally agree with you about Obama's hypocrisy regarding SA and Bahrain.
Click to expand...
Thats the point. He should stop making foolish statements he has no intention nor will to back up, be it in Syria, Ukraine, Detroit, Guantanamo Bay...
 
Montecresto said:
Sure seems a lot of people willing to risk war with Russia to defend the interests of only half of Ukrainians and against the interests of the rest. Classic definition of the pro-war crowd.
Click to expand...
Thats the problem with stirring up revolution. Egypt is feeling that. So is Libya. However, in the Ukraine, their country already had a declared path and investment...closer and stronger ties with the EU. It was not 'half' that decided to abandon those ties...it was their president.
 
apdst said:
The head honcho in Russia joined the KGB 40 years ago, so I would say that not much has changed.
Click to expand...

He's not a KGB member anymore.

Not that I expect anything to dissuade you from your blind hatred of all governments outside America and Western Europe (and westernized parts of Africa and Asia).
 
NIMBY said:
Once a KGB, always a KGB.
I'm with apdst on this one .
Click to expand...

I'm with Christ on this one. You can be obstinate in your secular phariseeism if you want.
 
So when you lose the discussion with apdst, you play the Christ card.
Do you think Putin is playing Christ with you or against you ?
Paleocon said:
I'm with Christ on this one. You can be obstinate in your secular phariseeism if you want.
Click to expand...
 
Deuce said:
No, what's really happening is that you guys know full well that there's no good outcome to US military action here. You know full well that the best course (well, only course really) the US can take is to issue disapproving diplomatic statements, get fellow NATO members to do the same, and put forward economic sanctions. Which is exactly what's happening.

You know all of this, but Obama is doing it so you have to find a way to be mad about it. So you've invented a fantasy where someone who looks tougher could totally just have talked Russia out of securing a major strategic asset.
Click to expand...

Nonsense. You can stretch all you want to try to prop up this president, but he's boneless and inept. My estimation of his diplomatic skillset isn't at all just centered on this most recent event.

A great president would have been working to head this off at the pass diplomatically months ago and wouldn't be blaring out empty threats. Those sanctions Obama is threatening now, that you're suggesting - empty bluster and Putin knows it. Once again, Russia is a chief security council member and will just veto any sanctions, just as the US does.
 
NIMBY said:
So when you lose the discussion with apdst, you play the Christ card.
Do you think Putin is playing Christ with you or against you ?
Click to expand...

Summary dismissals are not valid refutations. So are you admitting that Christ would disagree with you, and simply saying that you don't care, or are you actually arguing that he would have held it against someone that they used to commit a specific type of immorality?

I don't understand the question.
 
apdst said:
How do you figure, "only half of Ukrainians?
Click to expand...

He might be referring to the fact that about half the population of Ukraine are native Ukrainians while the other half are Russian, who speak Russian, and who would not be adverse to being under Russian rule again.

Greetings, apdst. :2wave:
 
VanceMack said:
Thats the point. He should stop making foolish statements he has no intention nor will to back up, be it in Syria, Ukraine, Detroit, Guantanamo Bay...
Click to expand...

Oh I agree with that. He may have been caught off guard in Syria, but appears to not have learned his lesson.
 
polgara said:
He might be referring to the fact that about half the population of Ukraine are native Ukrainians while the other half are Russian, who speak Russian, and who would not be adverse to being under Russian rule again.

Greetings, apdst. :2wave:
Click to expand...

Hi Polgara, Yep it's that and the poll I quoted in the other thread on this topic that showed a 50/50 split in Ukrainian loyalty between EU and Russia. Putin has some legitimacy in this despite the fact that many people don't like it. Just so he doesn't go too far!
 
VanceMack said:
Thats the problem with stirring up revolution. Egypt is feeling that. So is Libya. However, in the Ukraine, their country already had a declared path and investment...closer and stronger ties with the EU. It was not 'half' that decided to abandon those ties...it was their president.
Click to expand...

And half are with their president.
 
Montecresto said:
And half are with their president.
Click to expand...
And there was some sort of election that allowed for that to happen? Or did the president simply decide on his lonesome in opposition to their Constitution.

And...just so we are clear...you are good with any direction a country goes, just so long as around 50% of them think it should be done?
 
VanceMack said:
And there was some sort of election that allowed for that to happen? Or did the president simply decide on his lonesome in opposition to their Constitution.

And...just so we are clear...you are good with any direction a country goes, just so long as around 50% of them think it should be done?
Click to expand...

No, I'm just saying there's no consensus. The country has a split loyalty.
 
shrubnose said:
That's what I'm going to do.

Hopefully this will eventually get settled in a way that's favorable for the Ukraine.
Click to expand...

I would agree. Unless the West covertly supports (or overtly for that matter) those that overthrew the government and seized control of the military, I would expect Putin to secure the country, install a government to his liking and get the hell out with less loss of life then when we tend to do these types of actions.
 
clownboy said:
Nonsense. You can stretch all you want to try to prop up this president, but he's boneless and inept. My estimation of his diplomatic skillset isn't at all just centered on this most recent event.

A great president would have been working to head this off at the pass diplomatically months ago and wouldn't be blaring out empty threats. Those sanctions Obama is threatening now, that you're suggesting - empty bluster and Putin knows it. Once again, Russia is a chief security council member and will just veto any sanctions, just as the US does.
Click to expand...

Really. You think a great president of the United States was going to stabilize Ukraine?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom