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Thread: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Heya Monte. I figured they were the ones from Post 114 unless someone can find something else......Sounds like Obama tried to put some bass in his voice. Then got called on it. So Obama came back with the only thing he could. Willing to send in monitors.

    Which Putin knows that's a UN call. So he pulled his Ambassador after they allowed that open Security Council Session. IMO!

    Both Powers and Rice have been played and made to look like fools. So the Russians aren't sweting them. Same deal with Kerry as Lavrov has him cowled.
    Your saying Russia pulled their ambassador to the US?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Your saying Russia pulled their ambassador to the US?
    Well, more like confirming what Maggie already had on it from Fox.

    Parliament has also requested that the Russian Ambassador be recalled from the United States in light of President Obama's remarks yesterday.....snip~


    Although, despite what Samanatha Powers is saying this is what Team Obama told Barbara Starr of CNN Earlier.



    UPDATE: Apparently the Obama administration isn't calling thousands of troops landing on the ground in Crimea and "invasion," but rather an "uncontested arrival."

    Admin officials tell CNN's Barbara Starr this is an "uncontested arrival" not necessarily "an invasion" and that this distinction is "key.".....snip~

    BREAKING: Obama on 2000 Russian Troops Landing in Ukraine "There Will Be Costs For Military Intervention" - Katie Pavlich
    Last edited by MMC; 03-01-14 at 10:19 PM.

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Will Putin go into the rest of the Ukraine, besides their Crimean base ?




    Russia Ups the Ante in Crimea by Sending in the ‘Night Wolves’

    On Friday afternoon, the regular flight from Moscow touched down in the Crimean capital of Simferopol, in the south of Ukraine, carrying the leader of a Russian motorcycle gang known as the Night Wolves. Alexander Zoldostanov, an old friend of Russian President Vladimir Putin, was wearing his usual get-up – a flaming wolf’s head stenciled onto his black leather vest – but for once he was not the most intimidating figure on the scene. Since the morning, dozens of masked troops had been sauntering around Crimea’s main airport, armed to the teeth but refusing to identify themselves. In some ways, they seemed to have the same goal as Zoldostanov, who goes by the nickname The Surgeon. They were sending a signal to the revolutionary government in Ukraine that there were no longer in charge on this peninsula.

    The troops in green uniforms were in charge, whoever they were. By Friday evening, they had set up patrols around the Crimean capital. They put up checkpoints on the roads leading to the Russian military base, the home of the Black Sea Fleet, on the southeastern tip of the peninsula. Sometimes the troops seemed almost benign, sitting down at a cafe inside the airport and calmly looking around, their grenade launchers and automatic weapons by their side. At other times, as when they set up a cordon around the Crimean TV tower, they looked like an occupying force.

    Because their uniforms and vehicles had no identifying markers of any kind, the troops patrolling the streets, highways and airports of the Crimea could at least plausibly have been part of local militia forces, which locals have been forming to defend against the revolution. That allowed Moscow to deny any knowledge as to which troops were part of the regular movements of the Black Sea Fleet and which ones weren’t. This meant that on Friday, the only identifiably Russian force descending on the Crimea were the Night Wolves.

    Since 2009, they have been one of the defining elements of Russian soft power in Eastern Europe. Their biker rallies and mass rides through countries like Ukraine, Estonia, Serbia, Romania and Bosnia serve to promote Slavic pride and Russian patriotism in Moscow’s former Soviet dominions. President Putin has often joined them on these rides, although he usually plays it safe by choosing a three-wheeler.

    In 2012, when he came to Ukraine on an official visit, he spent several hours riding around the Crimea with Zoldostanov and the Night Wolves while President Yanukovych was kept waiting for him in Kiev. (Since his ouster, Yanukovych has clearly not won him any more respect from the Russian President. At a press conference on Friday in the Russian city of Rostov, where he has fled to escape charges of mass murder in Ukraine, Yanukovych said that Putin has so far refused to meet with him. He expressed surprise that the Russian President was “remaining silent” on the crisis in Ukraine.).....snip~

    Russia Ups the Ante in Crimea by Sending in the

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by soccerboy22 View Post
    Oh man. This is a very hot situation with only one right answer and about a hundred wrong ones. I am sure the White House is a very tense place right now.
    *Spoiler Alert*

    Not really. Obama will draw a red line and Putin will do what he wants. Then Obama will declare victory.

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I think he should have reminded the world that Russia signed a treaty in support of non-interference by anyone in Ukraine. And that the United States, Great Britain and many in the rest of the world are disappointed to see this so-obvious violation of that treaty by one of the very countries who signed it. He could have said that the United States and other signers will be weighing their options and hope to keep in constant and close contact with Russia as this moves forward toward the goal of understanding why they have chosen to take military action and what ramifications that action will have in the rest of the world.
    I have no idea what the cold war was like. Were words enough to keep Russia from doing crazy ****? I guess I just don't know how close we can get to the border without crossing it with respect to actions and war.

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    I posted this from a friend on another thread.
    1) Immediately have the US and the EU confer with Ukraine and tell them to NOT attack the Russian troops in the Crimea. Have them immediately mobilize their forces to their borders and take up positions and prepare and make any further Russian aggression have to come through their prepared positions. Right now the Crimea is lost, and attacking them there will only invite a much larger invasion and the potential loss of all of the Ukraine.
    Good points, but we have to consider that half of their military brass is of the Russian language group. They probably didn't like the revolt to begin with. I don't think we have to worry about them not wanting to see action against who they see as their brothers in arms. As for Crimea, it was Russian to begin with, having only been given to Ukraine to administer as a paperwork shuffle in 1954 by Kruschev. Not worth dying for.


    2) The US should immediately start flying C-17s into Kiev (the Ukraine Capitol) loaded with advisors, provisions, trainers, and a a security force for those people. We cannot get enough people there to stop Putin at this point, but we can show him that the price for taking the Ukraine has now gone up and would be too steep for him.
    Bold, but we won't do that, because it will escalate the situation. It will be viewed as an hostile act. This is not Iraq, and Saddam's allowing us to slowly build up forces in Kuwait over a year or two before he is to be attacked. Every C-17 will fly within only a few miles of overwhelming Russian air power and air defense systems. Each US special forces soldier will also be in the midst of Ukranian soldiers, half of whom will be Russian speaking and most likely waiting for the orders to garrote them in their sleep. These are not Iraqis and Afghanis we are playing with here, but the sons and grandsons of men who knocked the hell out the German army in WW2 all the way to Berlin, and would have gone further had we not had the bomb. I don't think the Russians will think it too much of a price to pay if they decide whatever they decide, but I think they will just let Ukraine return to the fold on its own. Their former leader that was just released from prison is going to see Putin this coming Monday. They had a good relationship before when she was in power. I believe they will come to an understanding. Russia this far has only had to say, "Boo!" and the West jumped.

    Goodness, I just had an epiphany. Putin never liked the guy they just toppled. He always got along with her, though. Could this not have been the plan all along, going back a couple of years or more, to bring out the EU just so far, and see what they would do to test their mettle, letting the rest of eastern Europe see just how unreliable NATO, the US, and EU will be in the long run compared to holding their cards fast with the Russians. Hmmm, that would make Putin one hell-ova strategist.

    3) Have the NATO and European countries (Germany, France, the UK, Italy, Spain) do the same thing (Number 2) at other critical points throughout the Ukraine.
    Any such actions will be seen as an offensive act and will only escalate the situation. A country has to be able to back up such moves, especially against a nation like Russia. The US and NATO have neither the men or material to fight a large modern land war in Europe as would be the case necessary here to stop any Russian offensive. We have had a hard enough time just containing cave dwellers in Afghanistan.

    4) Immediately move to make the rest of the Ukraine a part of NATO.
    Okay, not sure what this would do. I suspect, that would just encourage the more prosperous and productive east Ukraine to break off into its own country. I don't think that is what Russia wants. They just want a stable Ukraine that is within their sphere of interest.

    5) Hasten the Ukraine's entry into the EU.
    Again, it would just lead the eastern Ukraine, which is the more Russian speaking, productive, and prosperous, to break off into its own country.

    Not sure if any of this could or will be done.
    Sound thoughts, all in all, but I don't think it can or will be done. EU took a gambit on trying to draw away Ukraine, and it did not work out. They will not fight a major land war in Europe over them. They will be back in bed dealing with the Russians like nothing happened within months. Most of the leaders of this revolt will slip into irrelevance and disappear once Yulia Tymoshenko comes back into the fore and makes amends with Putin on Monday.
    Last edited by SayMyName; 03-02-14 at 02:24 AM.

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Although personally I am against intervention I feel that the US has lost a lot of moral and political high ground in this. Other than a threat of economic sanctions against Russia our government has barely said anything else, this is just bad leadership on our part. Europe wont do anything without US lead since they always get timid everytime Russia is involved. Our current allies are probably thinking twice now whether we could be truly depended on should another rising superpower, like China for example, decides to do this to the other countries in the Pacific region.

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by PoS View Post
    Although personally I am against intervention I feel that the US has lost a lot of moral and political high ground in this. Other than a threat of economic sanctions against Russia our government has barely said anything else, this is just bad leadership on our part. Europe wont do anything without US lead since they always get timid everytime Russia is involved. Our current allies are probably thinking twice now whether we could be truly depended on should another rising superpower, like China for example, decides to do this to the other countries in the Pacific region.
    Good thoughts. Could have been part of the plan all along. I never cease to be surprised by the underestimations of Putin. He was a career KGB agent. You didn't get far unless you mastered maneuvering your way around the intrepid pit of the Kremlin and the communist world during the Cold War.

    Monday, though, is the big day of revelation. Yulia Tymoshenko, the former leader of the Ukraine just released from prison, is going to meet Putin in Moscow. Their relationship was always good, compared to the now deposed leader hiding out in Russia. That she is going at this present time, is rather surprising in itself. Yet, perhaps not.

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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainman05 View Post
    You can't do anything. Nobody can. You can counter the russian invasion. Not the USA. Not the EU. Nobody. Why? Because it's Russia and you don't want this cold war 2.0 to become a really, really hot war.

    So if the russians will want Crimea, they'll take Crimea. if they'll want to take Kharkiv Oblast, Luhasnka Oblast and/or Donestk Oblast... they'll tkae them all. They can take even Zaporishnya which is a very beautiful city and a lot of the East and SE regions which are Russian speaking predominantly...
    Easy. Handing over Crimea at the cost of Ukrain's integrity because the people there are predominantly Russian speaking is just an excuse for us amateur politically primed peers. Officials may not think so and thereby this may not be applied that easily and on those grounds. Much less generalized over other countries also.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainman05 View Post
    You know, for me, this is quite defeating, spiritually. It reminds me of why the Republic of Moldavia exists and why transnistria exists.
    It reminds me how lucky we are to exist. We would probably be not free and under Serbian/Russian dictatorship and oppression still if it was not for Clinton, Tony, Schreoder, and Yeltsin mostly.

    I bet things would have been different with different leaders in Ukraine, USA, Russia, and EU countries. But perhaps there still is hope. Things may develop for the better.
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
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    Re: Russian Parliament Wants Ambassador Recalled

    Quote Originally Posted by SBu View Post
    I have no idea what the cold war was like. Were words enough to keep Russia from doing crazy ****? I guess I just don't know how close we can get to the border without crossing it with respect to actions and war.
    I doubt we've ever come closer to nuclear war than the Cuban Missile Crisis. Mere words? No.

    In October 1962, an American U-2 spy plane secretly photographed nuclear missile sites being built by the Soviet Union on the island of Cuba. President Kennedy did not want the Soviet Union and Cuba to know that he had discovered the missiles. He met in secret with his advisors for several days to discuss the problem.

    After many long and difficult meetings, Kennedy decided to place a naval blockade, or a ring of ships, around Cuba. The aim of this "quarantine," as he called it, was to prevent the Soviets from bringing in more military supplies. He demanded the removal of the missiles already there and the destruction of the sites. On October 22, President Kennedy spoke to the nation about the crisis in a televised address.

    No one was sure how Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev would respond to the naval blockade and U.S. demands. But the leaders of both superpowers recognized the devastating possibility of a nuclear war and publicly agreed to a deal in which the Soviets would dismantle the weapon sites in exchange for a pledge from the United States not to invade Cuba. In a separate deal, which remained secret for more than twenty-five years, the United States also agreed to remove its nuclear missiles from Turkey. Although the Soviets removed their missiles from Cuba, they escalated the building of their military arsenal; the missile crisis was over, the arms race was not.
    A link to what JFK told the American people in the midst of the crisis: Modern History Sourcebook: John F. Kennedy: Address on the Cuban Crisis October 22, 1962

    JFKs speech to the American people lays out the actions that went with the words.

    I think the American people and all of congress were completely behind the President's decisions regards Cuba. Rattling sabers re the Ukraine? Not even close.
    Last edited by MaggieD; 03-02-14 at 08:39 AM.

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