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Thread: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Why shouldn't there be a comparison to Hitler? Are we not supposed to learn from history, and Russian's history as well?
    Because Putin moving to secure his assets on the peninsula, is not paramount to imperialism, and the comparisons are foolish, and unnecessary.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Because Putin moving to secure his assets on the peninsula, is not paramount to imperialism, and the comparisons are foolish, and unnecessary.
    His 'assets' were part of the Ukraine. There are other ways of solving these problems rather than an invasion.

    The important thing is what he does next.

    And of course it is imperialism. Thats the history of the Russian empire.

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    His 'assets' were part of the Ukraine. There are other ways of solving these problems rather than an invasion.

    The important thing is what he does next.

    And of course it is imperialism. Thats the history of the Russian empire.
    The Black Sea fleet and the rest of his belongings in his rented port belong to the Ukraine? This was not a US style invasion, and you know that its not, and your claims of imperialism and comparisons to Hitler are insane.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Hmm... I'm wondering how much the Snowden information influenced Putin's move.
    Unfortunately, he is in a situation to have more access than anyone else. But, even aside from what Snowden might have, there were stories going back 10 years to when this Orange Revolution first started, that listed the American N.G.O.'s that were operating and trying to manipulate events on the ground, all under the cover of providing charity and aid. The same organizations...one unfortunately started by the same guy who's got Greenwald and Scahill on board now, has been active behind the pro-western movements in the Ukraine. It was recognized to be a divided nation right when it first became independent; so any moves to carve Ukraine away from Russia's influence and into the U.S. and possibly NATO alliance, would obviously be treated as a hostile move by Putin or any Russian president. I would bet that any Russian president...even the most compliant like Boris Yeltsin would have been moving troops from their base in Crimea to prevent a western government from taking over.
    Why should our nastiness be the baggage of an apish past and our kindness uniquely human? Why should we not seek continuity with other animals for our "noble" traits as well?
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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The Black Sea fleet and the rest of his belongings in his rented port belong to the Ukraine? This was not a US style invasion, and you know that its not, and your claims of imperialism and comparisons to Hitler are insane.
    The Crimea belongs to the Ukraine. As you say, the port is "rented". Does the tenant have the right to overthrow the landlord?

    It also doesn't matter if it is a "US style invasion" or a German style of invasion. It is an invasion.

    You also need look up the word "imperialism" and German activities immediately prior to WWII.

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Commie View Post
    Unfortunately, he is in a situation to have more access than anyone else. But, even aside from what Snowden might have, there were stories going back 10 years to when this Orange Revolution first started, that listed the American N.G.O.'s that were operating and trying to manipulate events on the ground, all under the cover of providing charity and aid. The same organizations...one unfortunately started by the same guy who's got Greenwald and Scahill on board now, has been active behind the pro-western movements in the Ukraine. It was recognized to be a divided nation right when it first became independent; so any moves to carve Ukraine away from Russia's influence and into the U.S. and possibly NATO alliance, would obviously be treated as a hostile move by Putin or any Russian president. I would bet that any Russian president...even the most compliant like Boris Yeltsin would have been moving troops from their base in Crimea to prevent a western government from taking over.
    There is a conspiracy section elsewhere on these boards.

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The Crimea belongs to the Ukraine. As you say, the port is "rented". Does the tenant have the right to overthrow the landlord?

    It also doesn't matter if it is a "US style invasion" or a German style of invasion. It is an invasion.

    You also need look up the word "imperialism" and German activities immediately prior to WWII.
    The mob that started burning **** overthrew Putins landlord, you'd do good to not twist the facts. Securing his belongings has nothing to do with Hitler, imperialism, WW2 or any of the other rubbish you're bringing up.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The mob that started burning **** overthrew Putins landlord, you'd do good to not twist the facts. Securing his belongings has nothing to do with Hitler, imperialism, WW2 or any of the other rubbish you're bringing up.
    So let's see here. If you are the leftist in the US demonstrating against "American hegomony" then it's all good with you, but a Ukrainian demonstration now against Russian hegomony well then it's just a mob...I think we see where you stand.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by MadLib View Post
    I love it when the apologists for Russian expansionism support the idea of Putin forcibly restoring Yanukovych to the presidency. That would be political and diplomatic suicide for Moscow: there's no way that the Ukrainian people would stand even a few more months of that crook's regime, and whatever existing support for Russia amongst Ukrainians would vanish.
    Prince Metternich knew quite a bit about frustrating the popular will, but he observed that while one could do many things with bayonets, one could not sit on them. In others words, rule by force alone is untenable.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Ukraine accuses Russia of Occupation calls for help from US/UK

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So let's see here. If you are the leftist in the US demonstrating against "American hegomony" then it's all good with you, but a Ukrainian demonstration now against Russian hegomony well then it's just a mob...I think we see where you stand.
    Good try. You loose your status as protesters and become a mob of thugs when you start destroying public property and injuring police. See the distinction?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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