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Thread: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

  1. #171
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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    The fourteenth amendment deals with states, not the private sector. Do you need me to quote it for you?
    This is a state law dude. I get it that you hate homos, but you'll have to try better than that to pass unconstitutional laws.

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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    In fact, they show they don't understand logic at all.
    Says the man quoting an anarchist. Tell me, exactly how do you ensure the consistency in application and free exercise of rights in an anarchistic society? In fact, how do you guarantee the existence of any rights at all?

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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by Napoleon View Post
    Do you know why the founders left the Constitution open to interpretation? Because, even then, there was considerable disagreement on what it actually meant. We are not bound by 18th century meanings which not even the founders or the first Congress could gain a consensus for. Especially when 18th century values are in direct conflict with 21st century values. Keep that in mind while you're quote mining the federalist papers.
    So classical liberal philosophy is in conflict with 21st century values? Interesting. You know, that is wrong.

    I don't buy for millisecond that you foolishness was intended nor do I buy that you can defend anything using it. Furthermore, to argue and frankly lie that agreement was not, so that you can twist words with modern definition is blatantly transparent. However, you are right on one thing; in that, there was plenty of disagreement before the papers were signed.

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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by Napoleon View Post
    Says the man quoting an anarchist. Tell me, exactly how do you ensure the consistency in application and free exercise of rights in an anarchistic society? In fact, how do you guarantee the existence of any rights at all?
    He wasn't always an anarchist and he always maintained a compromise to protect human rights. I'm not sure how that disputes his logic though. If you care to take on the quote, do so, but don't attack him as a person as if that somehow matters to his words.

    Oh and btw, anarchy was never tried, so to argue as if it is a failure is pretty stupid.
    Last edited by Henrin; 02-27-14 at 01:09 AM.

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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    I don't buy for millisecond that you foolishness was intended nor do I buy that you can defend anything using it.
    Apparently you'll never be a lawyer, judge, or politician. But you should take some law classes.

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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by Napoleon View Post
    Apparently you'll never be a lawyer, judge, or politician. But you should take some law classes.
    This is an exercise of history and logic and it's not my fault you lied on one front and failed on the other.

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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    He wasn't always an anarchist and he always maintained a compromise to protect human rights. I'm not sure how that disputes his logic though. If you care to take on the quote, do so, but don't attack him as a person as if that somehow matters to his words.
    I'm not attacking him as a person, I'm challenging your attacks and his position. You spoke of being illogical, well, an anarchistic society with protections for any rights is about as contradictory and illogical as it gets.

  8. #178
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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor - chicagotribune.com




    back up links:

    Arizona governor vetoes anti-gay bill
    Arizona Governor Jan Brewer Vetoes Anti-Gay Bill - NBC News
    Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer vetoes so-called anti-gay bill - latimes.com
    Arizona governor vetoes controversial bill allowing denial of service to gays
    Arizona Governor Vetoes Bill Seen Discriminating Against Gays - Businessweek
    Jan Brewer Announces Veto Of Arizona Anti-Gay Bill SB 1062
    Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer vetoes anti-gay bill | MSNBC
    Arizona governor vetoes anti-gay bill - Chicago Sun-Times


    vetoed just like i thought and said it would be


    equality wins again


    again it shows the panic and fear of the bigots and those that support discrimination and are against equal rights. They see the writing on the wall, they know equal rights is winning and is going to win the war so they are getting desperate.

    The best part is, even if they win some of these little battles its things like this that are actually HELPING equal rights. The majority of the public eye judges it as wrong and see how nuts it is. But it establishes something that can be challenged in courts just like the state bannings. The vast majority of the lawsuits exist BECAUSE of state bannings lol. The bannings HELPED, its sweet poetic justice.

    THeres some other state trying these i hope they get some momentum behind them to draw more of the public eye on this insanity.
    I was in Chapter for my fraternity when i got an update on my phone from AP. I literally just smiled and nodded. Two great equal rights news came today; Texas and Arizona. The bigots are finally losing.


  9. #179
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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    No that is what you read into it. I almost never say ALWAYS, because the reality is that those choices require context. The only somewhat inflexible position I hold is that humans should always be kind to one another. (definition of kind being somewhat subjective)




    Okay, so let me draw back for a minute to create a broader context. I try to establish what is fair based on what I could live with.

    If I were a devout Christian (which admittedly I't not) and I wanted to have the freedom to practice my faith without limitations it would require that everyone around me either be of the same faith or submit to my interpretation of the religious doctrine I have chosen. Well, I would not want to have to submit to the doctrine of any other faith so maybe some limitations are necessary.

    I would then most likely chose to draw that back to being able to state my interpretations of my religious doctrines freely rather than force everyone to live by and exhibit devotion to the same.

    So an idea that is more universally applicable and maintains a basis of equality, regardless of who has more power would be, you are free to think, state openly and believe as you chose but not practice acts of exclusion based on those beliefs.
    Ok, so do you believe religious leaders should be required to perform same sex weddings even if they oppose them on religious grounds?

  10. #180
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    Re: Arizona anti-gay bill vetoed by governor

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    I was in Chapter for my fraternity when i got an update on my phone from AP.
    Oh the irony here is rich. You belong to a elitist and discriminatory organization like a fraternity and you're applauding a law which stamps out freedom of association. Hey, time to open the doors to your fraternity and admit everyone, whether they attend your school or not, whether they're men or women, whether they can pay the dues or not.

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