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Texas Gay Marriage Ban Latest to Be Struck Down[W:97]

WCH said:
You know, I'm tired of this merry-go-round of questions. Let's just conclude this with I have my opinion that says not matter what the reason you give, I'm not going to support Gay marriage.

You have whatever opinion you want.
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No, you keep moving the goal posts when you cannot answer. You are certainly entitled to your opinion and your beliefs. What I'd like to understand is why you think your personal beliefs should end up depriving others of something.

And I've brought up comparable examples...perhaps you dont have explanations and choose not to admit to hypocrisy or just plain bigotry. I dont know but that's my perception when I dont see a reasonable explanation.
 
Deuce said:
Yes, you do need the State license to get the benefits. But you aren't forced to get married. You did choose that, and you can choose to end that at any time. That doesn't bother anybody. You're right, you don't need the intermediary.

So what's the problem? Does two dudes signing that same legal contract somehow make the sanctity of your marriage diminished? Does it harm your relationship with God? Does it reduce any of those legal benefits? I honestly have a really hard time understanding why it bothers you so much that two dudes would sign the same legal contract. Whether or not God approves of their union is an entirely separate discussion, not at all relevant to the state benefits.

Gay people are asking for the right to sign that contract. They are not asking for the right to your God's approval, or your approval. And they aren't harming your marriage. Please, help me understand your stance on the issue.
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I won't support their sinful relationship so why would I support SSM?

Like I said in my previous to Lursa. Y'all continue this conversation without me. Thanks for the good time.
 
WCH said:
Pedophilia already has come up.
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Pedophilia is harmful.

No one has yet been able to show any harm to marriage by SSM.
 
Lursa said:
No, you keep moving the goal posts when you cannot answer. You are certainly entitled to your opinion and your beliefs. What I'd like to understand is why you think your personal beliefs should end up depriving others of something.

And I've brought up comparable examples...perhaps you dont have explanations and choose not to admit to hypocrisy or just plain bigotry. I dont know but that's my perception when I dont see a reasonable explanation.
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NO what you don't understand is that I DO NOT support people or actions that I consider sinful. That's it.
 
WCH said:
NO what you don't understand is that I DO NOT support people or actions that I consider sinful. That's it.
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OK. I understand that.

But if you (general "YOU" as well as you personally) didnt object to fornicators and adulterers marrying...which are sinners of the same level according to the Bible....why is it necessary to refuse it to gays?

That is a hypocritical stance IMO. You dont have to support it, but to deny them by law is hypocritical. You even said you chose marriage thru the state for the benefits and privileges it provides....seems mean and selfish to deny others that, not very Christian....unless you have good reason. Reason beyond 'I dont support sinners.' Cuz all the other sinners are getting them.
 
WCH said:
NO what you don't understand is that I DO NOT support people or actions that I consider sinful. That's it.
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You are entitled to your opinions and beliefs, as wrong as they may be and as inanely as you want to hold to them.
 
WCH said:
I won't support their sinful relationship so why would I support SSM?

Like I said in my previous to Lursa. Y'all continue this conversation without me. Thanks for the good time.
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But nobody is asking you to support their relationship. Nobody asked me to support yours either. Your approval isn't necessary here.

I don't support young women going to Justin Bieber concerts, but that doesn't mean I would vote to make Justin Bieber concerts illegal.

I'm not sure where you got the idea that you are being asked to approve of same-sex marriage.
 
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Deuce said:
It wouldn't shock me to see polygamy come up in discussion more often, but that has far lower popular support and also doesn't have the same legal argument going for it. (equal protection clause doesn't apply because number of people is not a protected classification)
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That something isn't a protected class has no bearing on whether or not it should be.

Not that polygamy and SSM really have much to do with each other, but, you know... facts. There is definitely a legal argument for polygamy. It just doesn't have anything to do with SSM.
 
WCH said:
You mean pretend Christian? If you do not believe the word and mock it with laughter,
you are not a Christian.

Making sinful acts acts legal serves only to putting another nail in the coffin.

Have at it.
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Making something illegal based on how sinful it is according to a religion is unconstitutional.
 
IIRC, I don't believe I asked anyone to cohere to my beliefs or values during this thread. But, one couldn't tell that from the responses.
 
WCH said:
You mean pretend Christian? If you do not believe the word and mock it with laughter,
you are not a Christian.

Making sinful acts acts legal serves only to putting another nail in the coffin.

Have at it.
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ok then
 
WCH said:
Because as Christians are not suppose to ignore sin and allow it to fester.
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so you cant ignore sin and allow it and their are laws that deal with things you consider sinful

and your not trying to force the dictates of your faith on any one

how's that work?
 
blarg said:
so you cant ignore sin and allow it and their are laws that deal with things you consider sinful

and your not trying to force the dictates of your faith on any one

how's that work?
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By urging folks to come to Christ. Sometimes by the hair ;)
 
WCH said:
IIRC, I don't believe I asked anyone to cohere to my beliefs or values during this thread. But, one couldn't tell that from the responses.
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You are asking people to do just that when you vote against same-sex marriage. Voting against someone else's rights is not just expressing your beliefs, it's taking action.

Conversely, two dudes getting married in no way affects your beliefs. They are not forcing anything upon you, because the state recognizing their union doesn't affect you.

You can believe that two dudes getting married is wrong, that's your choice. Your belief on the matter doesn't harm others, so it's no business of mine demanding that the government ban your beliefs. It's the action you take that harms others.
 
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WCH said:
IIRC, I don't believe I asked anyone to cohere to my beliefs or values during this thread. But, one couldn't tell that from the responses.
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In general when I reply to posts like yours I at least in the beginning add that people are entitled to their personal beliefs and to pratice them.

In this thread I did so and also asked how SSM would *affect* your marriage and if it would keep you from practicing your beliefs.

But your beliefs...are not relevant to law unless you can show harm or restriction to them. And as you can see from responses, if you want to 'force' your belief system on others, you have to show just cause.
 
WCH said:
IIRC, I don't believe I asked anyone to cohere to my beliefs or values during this thread. But, one couldn't tell that from the responses.
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BTW, by endorsing keeping gays from marrying, you are indicating you would force others to cohere to your beliefs and values.

Are you not clear on that?


Are you not clear that millions of other Americans dont share those same beliefs and values?
 
blarg said:
so you cant ignore sin and allow it and their are laws that deal with things you consider sinful

and your not trying to force the dictates of your faith on any one

how's that work?
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He and millions of other Christians already do...and attend their weddings. All the fornicators and adulterers....they attend THEIR weddings.

Any couple that had sex before marriage are fornicators, certainly those that lived together before marriage.

I have yet to hear why it's ok for them to marry but gays, not so much. They arent supposed to treat any of those sins any differently.
 
Deuce said:
You are asking people to do just that when you vote against same-sex marriage. Voting against someone else's rights is not just expressing your beliefs, it's taking action.

Conversely, two dudes getting married in no way affects your beliefs. They are not forcing anything upon you, because the state recognizing their union doesn't affect you.

You can believe that two dudes getting married is wrong, that's your choice. Your belief on the matter doesn't harm others, so it's no business of mine demanding that the government ban your beliefs. It's the action you take that harms others.
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Sin effects everyone around it and everyone who supports it. Sorry you don't see that.
 
Lursa said:
BTW, by endorsing keeping gays from marrying, you are indicating you would force others to cohere to your beliefs and values.

Are you not clear on that?


Are you not clear that millions of other Americans dont share those same beliefs and values?
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Too bad, millions of Americans don't find anything wrong with theft or assault but, they are definitely wrong just like you..
 
WCH said:
Sin effects everyone around it and everyone who supports it. Sorry you don't see that.
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WCH said:
Too bad, millions of Americans don't find anything wrong with theft or assault but, they are definitely wrong just like you..
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You are unable to articulate any specific, harmful effect same-sex marriage has on you, or anybody else. Therefore there is absolutely no reason for any court, or any real American for that matter, to entertain the notion. The comparison to theft is ridiculous and you know it. Theft has a victim. Same-sex marriage does not. You also need to stop pretending you're just being "attacked for your faith" or that you're just "expressing a belief."

You are actively working against the rights of others, that's why you're being "attacked."
 
WCH said:
Too bad, millions of Americans don't find anything wrong with theft or assault but, they are definitely wrong just like you..
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But no one that has committed theft or assault is prohibited from marrying. Why do you not advocate that those that have committed theft or assualt also be denied the right to marry as you do gay people?

You pick and choose whom to deny marrage to based on your self-serving, self-righteous, subjective and capricious reasoning of sin. At least be consistant in your dogma.
 
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One day you'll all be judged for who and what you support.

If you don't believe that then the scripture I posted is not for you.
 
WCH said:
Too bad, millions of Americans don't find anything wrong with theft or assault but, they are definitely wrong just like you..
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Again...you cannot explain why you and other Christians are not waging war against fornicators and adulterers being allowed to marry. The Bible said these sins, along with laying with a man, are judged (by Him) all the same. If you claim you dont support SSM because they are sinners, you dont have a real reason.

And you do not see the difference between *crimes* that harm people and things that *do no harm?* (And btw, fornication and adultery DO harm others)

If homosexuality is doing harm, you have not demonstrated it....that's ok...no one else has either.

We're back to hypocrisy. Not all sinners, just gays. Not doing harm except personal offense (not an infringement on rights anywhere).
 
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