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Thread: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill[W:451:959]

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    people do have a right to commerce, however they don't have a right force commerce on another person.
    No one is forcing them to run a business, so it's not strictly a matter of forcing commerce on another person.

    when governments deal with citizens/business....it deals in crime, health and safety.
    This is too lightweight IMO. A crime is a legal term and nearly anything under the sun can (and maybe has) been labeled a crime at one time/place or another. No, being a crime doesn't legitimate or delegitimize a particular government action. As you know well, it's something outside of government and law that is the primary driver for what is right,and what is not. And discrimination is not OK in that context.

    You can run a discriminatory club or organization, or private "group", etc. But a general business that serves the public, no, discrimination is not OK.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Both GOP Senators from Arizona want this Bill to go away.
    I commend Senators McCain and Flake for being disgusted with this business .
    Physics is Phun

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil_Osophy View Post
    Do you seriously believe he should be entitled to that mans property and services? That mans labor and business? What place does he have to force that man to allow him on the property and do business with him?
    If you just happen to run a business, that means you become everyone's slave? I don't think so. Just because you happen to be in business, that doesn't mean everyone else is entitled to your business.
    Couldn't disagree with you more. You want to repeal the 1965 Civil Rights Act. I don't. I think I win. When you open your business to the public, you open your business to the public, not to only those members of the public that fit your particular likes or dislikes regarding race or gender or whatever. What you are advocating is segregation, pure and simple. And it's despicable.
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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    1.)Then if you don't get someone to serve you when they otherwise don't desire to serve you how do you actually get service from them?
    1.) Since using their service will almost always detail either entering their property or using their property in some way or another, how do you get service without either entering or otherwise using their property in the vast majority of cases?
    1.) they are not obligated to serve me so i don't understand your question, it makes no sense.
    2.) who said id be obtaining service without doing so?

    do you have any questions that make sense and actually apply to the discussion?

    I was asked two questions and I answered them, the fact remains I don't believe that you have a right to walk onto anyone's property and I don't believe people are obligated to serve you if they happen to run a business.

    these fact will never change
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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil_Osophy View Post
    You clearly stated that not serving someone is a violation of their right
    LMAO i did NOTHING of the sort and you are severly mistaken like i said or just posted a lie, pick one.
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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil_Osophy View Post
    you have a right to commerce voluntarily. If the other party doesnt want to do business with you, why should they have to?
    They don't have to. They can close up shop.

    There are a wide range of business laws that govern the way you treat employees, and customers. This is just one of many (presumably).

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    No one is forcing them to run a business, so it's not strictly a matter of forcing commerce on another person.
    Yes, no one is forcing them to be in business, but each transaction represents commerce, so if there is some sort of coercion or otherwise threat of government force behind that commerce it is forced commerce on at least some level.

    You can run a discriminatory club or organization, or private "group", etc. But a general business that serves the public, no, discrimination is not OK.
    Nonsense. All of the examples you listed are private property, and as such, discrimination in terms of entry and use are perfectly fine.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Yes, no one is forcing them to be in business, but each transaction represents commerce, so if there is some sort of coercion or otherwise threat of government force behind that commerce it is forced commerce on at least some level.



    Nonsense. All of the examples you listed are private property, and as such, discrimination in terms of entry and use are perfectly fine.
    Apparently you haven't read the 1965 Civil Rights Act. Wait until your loon Rand Paul gets elected and repeals the law before you make silly statements like that.
    "Groups with guitars are on the way out, Mr. Epstein"

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) they are not obligated to serve me so i don't understand your question, it makes no sense.
    Can the government come down on them if they don't? What happens when they fail to serve you? Can you sue? Do you use the government to sue someone?

    2.) who said id be obtaining service without doing so?
    Then you agree with me. Good.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Both GOP Senators from Arizona want this Bill to go away.
    I commend Senators McCain and Flake for being disgusted with this business .
    Well, neither one of them are Libertarians, so that makes sense. Just wait until the NFL threatens to pull the Super Bowl next year. You'll see a number of these right wing clowns in Arizona come to Jesus.
    "Groups with guitars are on the way out, Mr. Epstein"

    Dick Rowe, A & R man
    Decca Records
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