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Thread: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill[W:451:959]

  1. #511
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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    There is the ever so small matter that not all humans could be citizens with 'rights' in 18th Century America.
    It is like today. Most of the global population has few rights.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    No, you only believe businesses have the right to separate people. That makes you a supporter of segregation, regardless of how you wish to portray it.
    No one in this thread or frankly in any of the threads I have talked about these matters, has disarmed the argument that people have a right to control access and use of their property; that people have the right to their own labor and service; that people have the right to association; that people have the right to contract, which includes the right to not form a contract with someone. Indeed, all they have ever really done is complain that it's not fair or claim that public businesses must serve all; as if their rights are somehow trumped or voided because of that decision.
    Last edited by Henrin; 02-23-14 at 03:00 PM.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    You mean like homosexuals who don't like the fact that a state has a law prohibiting them from getting "married" should simply move to some other state?

    You mean like homosexuals should have moved out of the US in the pre-Lawrence era when sodomy laws were still legal?
    I meant like people who are discriminated against by a business are being told that they can simply go to another business that will accept them as customers.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    I meant like people who are discriminated against by a business are being told that they can simply go to another business that will accept them as customers.
    I remember once I went to a video game store as a kid to trade in a game, but the store didn't accept it, so what did I do? I went to another store and traded it in there. There was another time, years later, when I went to get a sandwich at Subway, but for whatever reason they were out of bread(GG subway), so what did I do? I went to another place and got myself a sandwich there. Yup, it's pretty easy to deal with really. Sometimes you have something and you have to find someone willing to take it, and other times, you just have to find someone willing to deal with you. The thing about voluntary arrangements is that everyone has the choice to agree or disagree with the arrangement.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    I'd love to see you shout that when you a kicked out of an emergency room and denied treatment because the only man who can save your life does not want to associate with you.
    But hey, the stone age had its merits too.
    Not covered under the law we are discussing and the emergency room is not a private facility and operates under quite different standards of care than say, a bakery. This is a strawman.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Not covered under the law we are discussing and the emergency room is not a private facility
    Seriously? What is it then?

    and operates under quite different standards of care than say, a bakery.
    But this is about people exercising their conscience, not about standards of operation.


    This is a strawman.
    So far you offered two failed arguments to support that. Care to try again?

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    I remember once I went to a video game store as a kid to trade in a game, but the store didn't accept it, so what did I do? I went to another store and traded it in there. There was another time, years later, when I went to get a sandwich at Subway, but for whatever reason they were out of bread(GG subway), so what did I do? I went to another place and got myself a sandwich there. Yup, it's pretty easy to deal with really. Sometimes you have something and you have to find someone willing to take it, and other times, you just have to find someone willing to deal with you. The thing about voluntary arrangements is that everyone has the choice to agree or disagree with the arrangement.
    Thanks for enlightening us with your deep experiences with discrimination. Now I know that when black people in the south before 1964 were denied jobs, bank loans, prohibited from buying or renting a home in most neighborhoods, and denied the ability to go to a store, take a bus, or eat at a restaurant like everyone else by the private sector, they weren't harmed, just slightly inconvenienced.
    Last edited by Hard Truth; 02-23-14 at 05:01 PM.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    Thanks for enlightening us with your deep experiences with discrimination. Now I know that when black people in the south before 1964 were denied jobs, bank loans, prohibited from buying or renting a home in most neighborhoods, and denied the ability to go to a store, take a bus, or eat at a restaurant like everyone else by the private sector, they weren't harmed, just slightly inconvenienced.
    It wasn't even an example of discrimination, just having to find someone that is either willing or able to serve me.

    In any event, voluntary arrangements have certain downsides that come with them when people aren't willing to work together, but they are far superior than coerced arrangements in all cases.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    Seriously? What is it then?
    Most emergency rooms are part of a hospital. Most hospitals in the US are not private facilities. Even those who are have agreements for reciprical treatment. They are also ruled by existing law that the law we're discussing does nothing to alter.

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    But this is about people exercising their conscience, not about standards of operation.
    Point stretched to absurdity and unreality. Once again, this law would have zero effect upon emergency rooms or hospitals.

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    So far you offered two failed arguments to support that. Care to try again?
    Not so (care to name those arguments that you believe failed? I believe you are lost and have mixed up who posted what.), the only failure is your strawman here.
    Last edited by clownboy; 02-23-14 at 05:18 PM.

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    Re: Arizona lawmakers pass controversial anti-gay bill

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    It is truly amazing to what extent some people will go to defend and endorse bigotry.
    Hey, stay on topic. There's no need to drag the liberal bigotry against Governor Palin into this topic.

    What makes it more troubling is that in this instance they are doing it in the name of religion, or by proxy in the name of God. Deus vult. When are the crusades starting?
    Have we been reading the same posts? All I've witnessed have been defenses of freedom, the Pro-Choice advocates battling the closed-minded, anti-liberty bigots of the Anti-Choice movement who want to oppress us all in the name of their own vision of how we should conduct our associations.

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