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Thread: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial[W:336]

  1. #121
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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Only similarity in my mind is that the black guy ended up shot dead.
    That's completely understandable. However, the perspective of many blacks is different for a variety of compounding reasons.
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post

    His not calling the police for hours is another matter.
    It wasn't that he didn't call the police for hours. He never called the police at all, they called him.
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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Simply wrong.
    Not everyone acts the same way after a traumatic experience. His GF remembering what he said matters not, especially as this was traumatic for her too. Nor was there a requirement to contact the police or remain in the area in fear for your life in an unfamiliar environment.

    Self defense is an affirmative defense and the burden of proof is on the defense to show clear and convincing evidence that the defendant's actions were reasonable. It is not enough to just claim that the situation was stressful or unfamiliar, he has to demonstrate that his use of deadly force was reasonable. "Reasonable" is not so broad a term as to be just what the defendant believes to be reasonable, but more narrow than that. And to the benefit of the defense the burden of proof is not even the same as the prosecution must demonstrate (beyond a reasonable doubt). All the defense needs to do is demonstrate clear and convincing evidence. In the Dunn case there was none of that.

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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    The jury found that he didn't. You can harp the same old song as long as you'd like, Excon. You are in a distinct minority with them. I, for one, am grateful for that. The jury found that he was not acting in self-defense. From the bare-bones facts we have to work with, I agree with that finding. Your liberal views on what's self-defense and what's isn't don't even match those of the most liberal state of Florida. (Liberal not having political meaning here.)
    It almost seems like some folks believe that just because someone said they feared for their life...we have to believe them.

    Can you imagine what horrible things could occur if we were obliged to believe what they said every time?

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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    This is the first I have heard of this case. From what I read Dunn is fortunate to get off this easy if this verdict stands. It is one thing to carry a firearm and use it in self-defense, it's another thing to shoot into a car full of people then leave the scene.

    I am a CCL holder in the state of Texas. If I had been confronted with this situation, I would have attempted to leave before any shooting or fighting started.

    Something else, a person carrying a firearm is not suppused to have any alcohol in their system at all, and you certainly aren't supposed to leave the scene of the incident.

    On the surface this verdict seems to be a miscarriage of justice.
    Not sure about a miscarriage of justice - without throwing in a retrial (if it happens) on the murder charges - he will still be in jail for decades.

    I have wondered about the alcohol issue as well.

    Who knows, the guy has excuses for all of his deplorable behavior. Luckily the jury seemed to see right through it.

  6. #126
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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by Del Zeppnile View Post
    Self defense is an affirmative defense and the burden of proof is on the defense to show clear and convincing evidence that the defendant's actions were reasonable. It is not enough to just claim that the situation was stressful or unfamiliar, he has to demonstrate that his use of deadly force was reasonable. "Reasonable" is not so broad a term as to be just what the defendant believes to be reasonable, but more narrow than that. And to the benefit of the defense the burden of proof is not even the same as the prosecution must demonstrate (beyond a reasonable doubt). All the defense needs to do is demonstrate clear and convincing evidence. In the Dunn case there was none of that.
    Not even a whiff.

  7. #127
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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    He was so afraid for his life that he did not mention the incident to his SO, or call the police.

    That is not the action of a man who was afraid for his life and shot at someone with justification. It is the action of someone who realized he just fd up.
    Your are assuming ....you simply don't know. Ever been in a situation like Dunn's?

    It's encouraged and recommended that you *remove yourself from the *immediate danger area* of the scene of the *said* threat. Leaving the premises is not egregious, and easily able to be articulated plus no law was broken

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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by ric27 View Post
    Your are assuming ....you simply don't know. Ever been in a situation like Dunn's?

    It's encouraged and recommended that you *remove yourself from the *immediate danger area* of the scene of the *said* threat. Leaving the premises is not egregious, and easily able to be articulated plus no law was broken
    Other then of course shooting at people
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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by Leo View Post
    I cannot comment upon the laws which prevail in the various US jurisdictions, but under British Law your earlier statements were, in effect, correct.

    A Barrister who is informed of guilt by his potential client has the duty to either refuse representation (and become a potential witness against the client) or to inform the court of his client's admitted guilt, while advising that client to make a guilty plea in the hope of a lesser sentence. He may not, at the risk of being disbarred, represent a client whom he knows to be guilty, as anything otherwise. A Barrister may also withdraw from a case where he feels ‘the administration of justice might be or appear to be prejudiced’.

    So you see, we 'serfs and subjects' (as some Americans are wont to describe us) do some things rather better.

    But the pachyderm in the chamber which everyone is ignoring - and which someone needs to mention (at the risk of the storm of vituperation such mention will doubtless bring,) - is the fact that none of this would have happened, and a 16 year old would be alive today, had Dunn not been allowed to carry a hand gun.
    Like your more sensible approach to enforcing ethics on attorneys Like our approach to the right to bear arms. It was, after all, a reaction to the private arms policies toward the colonies by British governance of the day that we came to recognize the right to bear arms. So, Dunn is your guy's fault
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    Re: Dunn convicted of attempted murder; hung jury on murder in 'loud-music' trial

    Quote Originally Posted by ric27 View Post
    Your are assuming ....you simply don't know. Ever been in a situation like Dunn's?

    It's encouraged and recommended that you *remove yourself from the *immediate danger area* of the scene of the *said* threat. Leaving the premises is not egregious, and easily able to be articulated plus no law was broken
    Leaving the scene....not a big deal if you need to get to safety.

    When you are safe, call 911 or drive to the nearest police station or officer.

    Why would someone not take this reasonable action?

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