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Thread: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Just likwe a conservative make idle threats.
    Are you threatened by reality? There was no idle threat in the post, just a statement of high probability. If a constitutional amendment were brought before the states now homosexual marriage would lose it's court based foothold.

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Oh, I see, you were referring to state constitutional amendments and not Federal amendments. Still irrelevant. Nevada and Wisconsin are currently in the process of dealing with repealing their amendments, and of course if higher courts determine that those state amendments are unconstitutional then, well, that's that.
    No, I believe he was talking about amendment to the federal constitution. That is ratified by the states, not a popular vote. The higher courts would have no option in the face of a constitutional amendment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    So far, nothing you or Clownboy has said successfully deals with the direction of change right now. The states and the courts combined are successively heading towards nationwide recognition.
    No again. The states aren't moving that way, the courts may be.

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Are you threatened by reality? There was no idle threat in the post, just a statement of high probability. If a constitutional amendment were brought before the states now homosexual marriage would lose it's court based foothold.
    A majority of voters don't support allowing gays and lesbians to marry legally, yet at the same time a majority also opposes a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage.

    According to a Fox News poll released Wednesday, 37 percent of voters believe gays and lesbians should be allowed to get married legally. While that’s unchanged from 2010, when the question was most recently asked, it’s nearly double the 20 percent who felt that way in March 2004, the first time it was asked.

    Click for the full poll results.

    On the other hand, the poll finds 25 percent think there should be no legal recognition given to gay and lesbian relationships, down from 28 percent in 2010 and a high of 40 percent in 2004.

    The remaining one third (33 percent) think same-sex couples should be allowed a legal partnership similar to but not called marriage. While that number has bounced around a bit over the years, 33 percent also favored this middle-ground position in 2004.

    Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney favors a constitutional amendment defining marriage as being between a man and a woman.

    Thirty-eight percent of American voters agree with him, while 53 percent oppose such an amendment.

    Fox News poll: Majority opposes gay marriage, doesn't want constitutional amendment | Fox News

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Something winston I believe will change as the courts increasingly frustrate the will of the people.

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    No, I believe he was talking about amendment to the federal constitution. That is ratified by the states, not a popular vote. The higher courts would have no option in the face of a constitutional amendment.
    2/3 majority in senate and House, and you don't have the numbers there. And even if it were to go the direction of a constitution convention (which has never happened), you still don't have the numbers. A Federal constitutional amendment is fantasy.

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    No again. The states aren't moving that way, the courts may be.
    Well, not all once, obviously, but one by one they are heading in that direction. And I have no problems with the courts cleaning up the rest.

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Oh, I see, you were referring to state constitutional amendments and not Federal amendments. Still irrelevant. Nevada and Wisconsin are currently in the process of dealing with repealing their amendments, and of course if higher courts determine that those state amendments are unconstitutional then, well, that's that.

    So far, nothing you or Clownboy has said successfully deals with the direction of change right now. The states and the courts combined are successively heading towards nationwide recognition.
    No, I am talking FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS one that defines marriage. There are enough states now to ratify an amendment doing exactly what you don't want it to do

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    No, I am talking FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS one that defines marriage. There are enough states now to ratify an amendment doing exactly what you don't want it to do
    See the post above yours.

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    See the post above yours.
    Also I think it would be risky to hedge one's bet on 3/4s of the States going one's way

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Also I think it would be risky to hedge one's bet on 3/4s of the States going one's way
    Going by Conservative's own link to the list of states that approve of ssm, you have

    *15 states saying "We don't like teh gayz."
    *12 states saying, "we don't like teh gayz, but we like other things a lot less."
    *8 states saying, "I'm not inviting gays to my birthday party, but really I can't be arsed to care."

    Conservative also conveniently ignored the part of his own site that says "In the last eight years, every state has increased in its support for marriage..." which sort of undermines the idea of these as states that will eternally hold the fort against gay marriage.
    Last edited by Cardinal; 02-18-14 at 03:06 PM.

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    re: Actress Ellen Page: "I am gay"[W:1222]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    2/3 majority in senate and House, and you don't have the numbers there. And even if it were to go the direction of a constitution convention (which has never happened), you still don't have the numbers. A Federal constitutional amendment is fantasy.
    Every state but Hawaii has called for an Article V convention in the last 100 years. The threshold for number of states applying has been nearly reached several times. Congress steps in and does it's job at that point.

    At least four amendments (the Seventeenth, Twenty-First, Twenty-Second, and Twenty-Fifth Amendments) have been identified as being proposed by Congress at least partly in response to the threat of an Article V convention.[3

    Convention to propose amendments to the United States Constitution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    It's a failure on our part, as the People, to maintain our Constitution rather than allow the courts to do it extra-constitutionally.


    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Well, not all once, obviously, but one by one they are heading in that direction. And I have no problems with the courts cleaning up the rest.
    Not their mess to "clean up". That's part of the problem here.

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