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Thread: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    I will say it AGAIN... and I've posted this a few times, lately. All the "government should get out of marriage business" is sour grapes BS from the anti-SSM crowd. You never heard this 100 years ago, 50 years ago, or 25 years ago, or at least no where NEAR as much as you hear it now. You hear it because anti-SSM people see the writing on the wall. SSM will become the law of the land at some point in the near future, so anti-SSMers figure they should take ALL the toys away rather than having to live with that. I'm SURE there are folks who actually do believe it, but I'd be those people are few and far between. Most fit into the category that I have outlined in this post.
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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by blarg View Post
    this seems to cover it

    All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
    The existing definition of marriage being a type of contract between one man and one woman doesn't mean that equal protection is denied when the law doesn't allow two men or two women to be married.

    Expanding the definition is something that the State can decide to do to allow gay marriage by changing the law. It is not something that the Courts should decide to do so since that would be in effect a legislative action.
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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    It is certainly new to say that gay marriage is even a thing, much less a right.
    Marriage is a right. Just because you tack on the word "gay" doesn't make it a different kind of marriage. Indeed the only time that the word "gay" is used is during debates such as we are having and in politics. In general surroundings people don't say "oh your gay married huh?". They just say "oh your married huh?".

    And no, gay marriage is not new. Its been around for centuries at the very least. One small example is the Native American's. Two guys that got to gether were often considered "married". Though they used different wording. But thats to be expected since they had different language. And then there was the Ming Dynasty where young men or women would bind themselves to the same sex in the province of Fujian. It also occured in Ancient Egypt and Mesopotamia.

    So no, gay marriage is not new. Might be new to the United States, but not new as a societal concept.
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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    I will say it AGAIN... and I've posted this a few times, lately. All the "government should get out of marriage business" is sour grapes BS from the anti-SSM crowd. You never heard this 100 years ago, 50 years ago, or 25 years ago, or at least no where NEAR as much as you hear it now. You hear it because anti-SSM people see the writing on the wall. SSM will become the law of the land at some point in the near future, so anti-SSMers figure they should take ALL the toys away rather than having to live with that. I'm SURE there are folks who actually do believe it, but I'd be those people are few and far between. Most fit into the category that I have outlined in this post.
    How many of us were actually thinking about politics twenty-five years ago?

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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    I will say it AGAIN... and I've posted this a few times, lately. All the "government should get out of marriage business" is sour grapes BS from the anti-SSM crowd. You never heard this 100 years ago, 50 years ago, or 25 years ago, or at least no where NEAR as much as you hear it now. You hear it because anti-SSM people see the writing on the wall. SSM will become the law of the land at some point in the near future, so anti-SSMers figure they should take ALL the toys away rather than having to live with that. I'm SURE there are folks who actually do believe it, but I'd be those people are few and far between. Most fit into the category that I have outlined in this post.
    It is more than writing on the wall at this point. Windsor requires the federal government to recognize SSM from states that allow it. Those are the lion's share of rights, benefits and responsibilities. As soon as a state without a residency requirement for marriage allows SSM(New York did this), that makes it so that any SSM couple can get most of what goes with marriage by taking a simple vacation and filling out a bit of paperwork.

    So it is really all over. There is just a bit of kicking and griping left to go.
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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    I will say it AGAIN... and I've posted this a few times, lately. All the "government should get out of marriage business" is sour grapes BS from the anti-SSM crowd. You never heard this 100 years ago, 50 years ago, or 25 years ago, or at least no where NEAR as much as you hear it now. You hear it because anti-SSM people see the writing on the wall. SSM will become the law of the land at some point in the near future, so anti-SSMers figure they should take ALL the toys away rather than having to live with that. I'm SURE there are folks who actually do believe it, but I'd be those people are few and far between. Most fit into the category that I have outlined in this post.
    yep for some its desperation and for others its simply to hide thier bigotry


    lets add more

    protesting about divorce?
    protesting about legal marriages involving ZERO religion?
    protesting about government endorsing other marriages that dont match thier opinions (different religion, remarriages etc)
    etc etc

    its a strawman

    a curtain to hide the true reasons in the vast majority of cases
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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Serious View Post
    The existing definition of marriage being a type of contract between one man and one woman doesn't mean that equal protection is denied when the law doesn't allow two men or two women to be married.

    Expanding the definition is something that the State can decide to do to allow gay marriage by changing the law. It is not something that the Courts should decide to do so since that would be in effect a legislative action.
    that's exactly what it means those couples don't get the protections and privileges of marriage because of gender, requiring a gender combination without cause denies 1 gender couples equal protection

    same principle as bans on interracial couples from getting married

    those couples were denied equal protection and privileges under the law even if the law was the same for them and single race couples

    the states can decide to end that inequality of protection and privileges but the courts must decide to end it if the states don't

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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Serious View Post
    The existing definition of marriage being a type of contract between one man and one woman doesn't mean that equal protection is denied when the law doesn't allow two men or two women to be married.
    The "existing" definition of marriage has changed quite a bit in the last two hundred years alone. And that isn't even considering gay marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Serious View Post
    Expanding the definition is something that the State can decide to do to allow gay marriage by changing the law. It is not something that the Courts should decide to do so since that would be in effect a legislative action.
    Its not expanding anything. And yes, the courts should always protect peoples Rights. Also striking down law is not legislation. Legislation is making law. Not striking down law. Unless of course you consider striking down law as a form of legislation. In which case you have about 200 years of the court legislating things that protected your rights. Guess we should just strike down all the courts rulings that struck down some law or other that protected your rights over the last 200 years huh? Which would bring back all those laws that limited free speech, protected voting rights of minority groups, and all the other Rights that the Legislative Branch has continueally tried to curtail.
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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    How many of us were actually thinking about politics twenty-five years ago?
    Maybe WE weren't, but others were.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
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    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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    Re: Federal Judge Rules Va. Gay Marriage Ban Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Serious View Post
    The existing definition of marriage being a type of contract between one man and one woman doesn't mean that equal protection is denied when the law doesn't allow two men or two women to be married.

    Expanding the definition is something that the State can decide to do to allow gay marriage by changing the law. It is not something that the Courts should decide to do so since that would be in effect a legislative action.
    Just to be clear and comment on a pet leave...there is no orientation test for marriage, nor is it asked about. Gay people can get married in all states. What is at issue and being questioned is whether same sex couples can be married. This is actually important as it effects the legal arguments.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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