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Thread: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    An article in the Guardian of London headlined, "A pro-western regime in Kabul should give the U.S. an Afghan route for Caspian oil".

    "The invasion of Afghanistan is certainly a campaign against terrorism," wrote author George Monbiot in the Oct. 22, 2001, piece, "but it may also be a late colonial adventure."

    He wrote that the U.S. oil company Unocal Corp. had been negotiating with the Taliban since 1995 to build "oil and gas pipelines from Turkmenistan, through Afghanistan and into Pakistani ports on the Arabian sea."

    To make things even smoother, the U.S. engineered the rise to power of two former Unocal employees: Hamid Karzai, the new interim president of Afghanistan, and Zalmay Khalizad, the Bush administration's Afghanistan envoy.

    John Pilger in an Oct. 29 commentary in the British-based Mirror wrote, "Bush's concealed agenda is to exploit the oil and gas reserves in the Caspian basin, the greatest source of untapped fossil fuel on earth."

    "Just as the Gulf War in 1991 was about oil, the new conflict in South and Central Asia is no less about access to the region's abundant petroleum resources," writes Ranjit Devraj in the Hong Kong-based Asia Times, a business- oriented publication.
    The War in Afghanistan was not about building a pipeline to the Caspian or the Indian Ocean. Good ****ing grief.

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    I don't either, but I do remember them being about as successful with their venture as we are with ours.

    Genghis Kahn wasn't trying to establish democracy either, and whatever he was trying to accomplish was also a failure.
    How so? Khan despoiled Khwarezemia and dominated Afghanistan until it was in turn absorbed by the Timurids. Afghanistan has been conquered and subdued repeatedly throughout its history.

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    How so? Khan despoiled Khwarezemia and dominated Afghanistan until it was in turn absorbed by the Timurids. Afghanistan has been conquered and subdued repeatedly throughout its history.
    I don't know about that.

    I got to wondering agout the belief that Afganistan has really never been conquered, and looked it up. It seems it has, more or less:

    Yahoo answers

    Yes.

    Alexander the Great conquered and pacified the region; even after his death,it was sufficiently under the thumb to be mentioned in both the Partition of Babylon (323 BC) and Partition of Triparadisus 321 BC), documents drawn up by Alexander's generals dividing his empire between them.

    The fact that the Indian client king Porus was leading an army to the support of Eumenes against Antingonus in 317 BC, during the wars of the Diadochi, is further indication that Afghanistan was still controlled by Hellenistic satraps, as Porus would have to cross the area to reach Eumenes.

    In 1842, British forces defeated an Afghan army and occupied Kabul, destroying all its fortifications and the Central Bazaar (centre of economic activity in the country). However, deciding that Afghanistan was both too dangerous and,more importantly,unprofitable, The East India Company decided to withdraw the British presence from Afghanistan permanently (this is clear from surviving correspondence of the Company with its London offices).
    So, maybe it's time to take a page from the East India Company's playbook. Afganistan is dangerous and unprofitable....

    unless, of course, that pipeline from the Caspian Sea mentioned above is the real goal.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    We went in not only with the goal of not winning, but with no vision of what winning would have even looked like. If the goal was status quo, why even get involved at all? Meanwhile, today we are in Afganistan with the goal of... what again? How do we know when we've won if there is no exit strategy?

    And I, too, was too involved to have a non biased view of Vietnam. It just seems to me that there are parallels with Vietnam, Afganistan, and Iraq.
    I think you are right, there are some and yet they are different. We went into Vietnam and forced the Vietnamese to do away with their Mandarin style of government for democracy, we have done the same in Iraq and Afghanistan. If we had allowed the Afghani's to choose their own form of government instead of forcing ours on to them, we wouldn't be in the pickle we are today.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    I have a memory that goes back to the Vietnam War. Luckily for us, the North Vietnamese government didn't turn out to be nearly as "Communistic" as we supposed, and, as we now know, the so called "domino theory" was a lot of hoakum.
    Vietnam, today, is a pile of ****. It would not be had it maintained ties with the West and pursued democracy, human rights and development.

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    What are you suggesting Juanita? Karzai is going, and there will be elections, its just a matter of whether or not Karzai gets his man in there.

    Take him out and put our own handpicked guy in.....

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    If it was a fair election, how could you be sure that the Taliban wouldn't win? Ban them from standing and you just made it unfair.



    We could buy the election--put our own guy in...

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by annata View Post
    interesting, haven't thought about the elections -found this:

    Will Afghanistan Survive The Aftermath Of Its 2014 Presidential Elections? Will A Former Warlord Or Pro-Western Technocrat Replace Karzai?

    This year’s elections will see 11 candidates, ranging from Western-educated technocrats to former warlords with bloody histories.
    Afghanistan’s economy is largely dependent on international assistance as well as the presence of coalition forces in the country, which generates demand for goods and services.

    In 2010 to 2011 the civilian and security-related assistance was the equivalent to 98 percent of Afghanistan’s GDP, and with the transition Afghanistan will have to rely more on domestic revenue generation to meet its budgetary needs.
    This year’s presidential election can provide a critical opportunity for a renewal of legitimacy, a boost in confidence and a start to correcting the ineffective and corrupt governance that characterizes Afghanistan,” Vanda Felbab-Brown, a senior fellow with the Center for 21st Century Security and Intelligence in the Foreign Policy program at Brookings, a non-partisan Washington think tank, said.
    But Brown warned the election could trigger “extensive violence, a prolonged political crisis that paralyzes governance and the collapse of international support,” which could strengthen the Taliban
    .


    Well, we sure don't want to do anything to strengthen the Taliban... We need some smart people on this one...

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by Juanita View Post
    We could buy the election--put our own guy in...
    Mornin' Juanita. How do we do that when we don't have any in the Taliban that will be taking control. They have refused all negotiations with us.

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    Re: Karzai: "American military should “stop harassing” the Afghan judiciary

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Let the Saudis and the those Sunni Arabs.....run in to save the day. Get a little bit of that front line action on a grand scale. So they can taste whats its like. Rather than just talk and talk and talk and beg others to go and do the their dirty work for them.
    Yeah but, are you saying that we should still have soldiers getting killed in Iraq. Americans that voted for Obama in 08' were done, finished with Iraq and wanted exactly a clean break. Iraq was a mistake to begin with, why should it be perpetuated. I mean I realize Powell told Bush, "if you break it, you own it" (and of course Bush broke it) but Americans don't want to own it anymore.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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