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Thread: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    What abuse of power? The abuse of not giving unions public money like Democrat politicians do?
    "Dont form a union or else" sure sounds like politicians applying punishment to those exercising their right to speech and assembly.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    They have 2 reasons to care.

    1. Politically the UAW is a Democratic fundraising organization. So Republicans would be voting to finance a huge fund raising and manpower campaign against them.

    2. Whether the company would continue to operate the facility for long would depend upon whether it remained competitive at that location.
    Quote Originally Posted by CalGun View Post
    Ahh but wait....

    I could argue they aren't choosing between their careers or the jobs; for if they go ahead and the UAW takes over they lose their jobs, and like Detroit the UAW will likely ruin the jobs in their state too. Where as if they say no, keep their careers, they can live on without the UAW and perhaps generate other jobs that make sense.
    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    Maybe they don't want UAW in Tennessee politics? Maybe they are trying to avoid this?

    pgf.jpg[/img]
    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Who the tiny number of VW workers, in TN, vote for is not the issue - it is where their union dues will go (into DNC coffers) that makes a bigger difference.
    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Union dues go to Democratic candidates and officials. Members don't have a say on that.

    They also can have concerns over when a union shop factory would remain competitive and if not then would be a bad investment.
    I thank all of you for answering my question. Your responses are similar and do make sense.

    Certainly, the unions are all Democrat all Day and now that campaign contributions are more or less unlimited,. uncontrolled and unrevealed, I guess the Unions are flush with cash and thus would have major influence.

    Does VW have any say in this matter? Are they inviting the unions? Even if the arrived in TN as a non-union company, couldn't the unions take over anyway even if VW didn't support that? Aren't all businesses vulnerable to union takeover? I'm guessing© VW would rather not be unionized or are they the ones behind the union?

    Isn't this going to be problematic with all businesses in any state? Can't any business go union at any time? If so, then what are the Republican politicians going to do? Forbid any new businesses from opening (assuming incentives)?

    As for the Detroit analogy, there are many other reasons for Detroit's problems and the unions are only a part of that. Surely there are other unionized businesses in other states that have not been harmed by the unions? AFAIK Las Vegas casinos are all unionized, yet Las Vegas is definitely not a Detroit.

    I appreciate that many of you seem to understand that when I pose a question - it is a real question, not a statement couched as a question. Your answers are read because my objective is to understand. So, thank you all.

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    "Dont form a union or else" sure sounds like politicians applying punishment to those exercising their right to speech and assembly.
    Isn't "don't form a Union or else" just as much a free speech issue? It might be selfish but don't politicians in power have as much right to be negative as those seeking power?

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    I thank all of you for answering my question. Your responses are similar and do make sense.

    Certainly, the unions are all Democrat all Day and now that campaign contributions are more or less unlimited,. uncontrolled and unrevealed, I guess the Unions are flush with cash and thus would have major influence.

    Does VW have any say in this matter? Are they inviting the unions? Even if the arrived in TN as a non-union company, couldn't the unions take over anyway even if VW didn't support that? Aren't all businesses vulnerable to union takeover? I'm guessing© VW would rather not be unionized or are they the ones behind the union?

    Isn't this going to be problematic with all businesses in any state? Can't any business go union at any time? If so, then what are the Republican politicians going to do? Forbid any new businesses from opening (assuming incentives)?

    As for the Detroit analogy, there are many other reasons for Detroit's problems and the unions are only a part of that. Surely there are other unionized businesses in other states that have not been harmed by the unions? AFAIK Las Vegas casinos are all unionized, yet Las Vegas is definitely not a Detroit.

    I appreciate that many of you seem to understand that when I pose a question - it is a real question, not a statement couched as a question. Your answers are read because my objective is to understand. So, thank you all.
    I would guess that the Tenn. Republican stance is that they're chasing good money after bad if the UAW is threatening to unionize VW in Tennessee since VW would likely move the operation to Mexico anyway from the rising labor costs alone. It becomes a viscous cycle where the UAW demands more from VW, VW threatens to move to Mexica, the UAW pays for State Democrats elections, State Democrats given VW more money to cover the UAW demands, wash, rinse repeat. Eventually you wind up with Detroit where the taxes gathered from the burnt out husk of a city can no longer afford the expensive tastes of union labor.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    I would guess that the Tenn. Republican stance is that they're chasing good money after bad if the UAW is threatening to unionize VW in Tennessee since VW would likely move the operation to Mexico anyway from the rising labor costs alone. It becomes a viscous cycle where the UAW demands more from VW, VW threatens to move to Mexica, the UAW pays for State Democrats elections, State Democrats given VW more money to cover the UAW demands, wash, rinse repeat. Eventually you wind up with Detroit where the taxes gathered from the burnt out husk of a city can no longer afford the expensive tastes of union labor.
    Well thought out response.

    Do you know where VW is moving from (assuming the move happens under the circumstances)? I tried Googling but no clear answer. I thought they were already mostly using Mexico but that was long time ago.

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    Like the IRS is NOT doing, actually.

    My point is about those crying foul about that applauding similar behavior when their side does it.

    Im one of those "no anonymity for anybody engaging in political intervention activities" folks.

    I want to know who politicians are beholden to.
    What's next? Public ballots?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    Isn't "don't form a Union or else" just as much a free speech issue? It might be selfish but don't politicians in power have as much right to be negative as those seeking power?
    Nope

    Using the public's money for political purposes is an abuse of power.
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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    Well thought out response.

    Do you know where VW is moving from (assuming the move happens under the circumstances)? I tried Googling but no clear answer. I thought they were already mostly using Mexico but that was long time ago.
    My understanding is that this isn't a move at all. It is a new plant meant to manufacture a new SUV that will be debuting in 2016. They currently are choosing between Tennessee and Mexico and from what I read into the story, Tennessee is only in the running because of state funding.

    My comment on moving is more of a forecast even if Tennessee lands the deal. In the long run the Republicans probably see a unionized plant being shut down and relocated to Mexico eventually, having essentially wasted the state funding.
    Last edited by jmotivator; 02-11-14 at 02:32 PM.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    I would guess that the Tenn. Republican stance is that they're chasing good money after bad if the UAW is threatening to unionize VW in Tennessee
    IOW, the Tenn Republicans are saying that VW is not competent to decide for itself whether or not it goes union.

    And the idea that the govt should stay out of private businesses goes under the bus. The republicans have no principles besides short-term self-interest
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Tenn. politicians threaten to kill VW incentives if UAW wins election

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Nope

    Using the public's money for political purposes is an abuse of power.
    What? So accepting any public campaign financing is taboo?
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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