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Thread: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I knew Collins was a nobody. I thoight for sure that his announcement gaurantee him a spot on the team.
    that's probably what he thought too. sadly, for him, even the novelty of being "the first" wasn't enough to overcome his general suckiness as an aging player.
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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    that's probably what he thought too. sadly, for him, even the novelty of being "the first" wasn't enough to overcome his general suckiness as an aging player.

    lol, the funniest thing about that announcement were the people talking about what a great player he was who obviously don't watch basketball

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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    And women get seperate facilities. Shouldnt gay men? They might not want other gay men, or women, staring at them. Its not neccesarily about harrasment, but privacy.
    If you want to go that route, then each individual, regardless of sexual orientation, should have a private facility, yes?
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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    Two things:

    1) His college teammates knew he was gay. These things have a habit of "coming out" in the media. If he were drafted not knowing that and it suddenly hit the press....

    2) While guys of his talent level go undrafted, sometimes they go on to make the Pro Bowl (Vontaze Burfict, for example). Think it wouldn't hit the news if a Pro Bowler hit the gay bars in Honolulu?

    It's better that they know going into this than to have to deal with the distractions later. You know it would be huge news after the fact. Now it's out there, and it's done. "OK he's gay, now let's play football."

    Oh, I don't blame him for coming out and think it was thought process with it was spot on. If you're confident it'd come out in predraft research then it's better to get it out there. It'd be an even BIGGER story and distraction in such a case...and as you'll note, the distraction is what worries me NOT the gayness

    And he absolutely could turn into a great player. Hell, one of my favorite players was undrafted (London Fletcher) and another was a 6th rounder and has already made 2nd team all pro in his career (Alfred Morris). My point was that if he doesn't get drafted in the 3rd or 4th it's not unfathomable that it's for reasons that have nothing to do with him being gay because it's not an unusual occurrence.

    I've not criticized him at all for coming out....with it seemingly being obviously known by his team prior to this, it's probably smart on his part. But I do think it will negatively impact some GMs thoughts on him, and not because of the gayness but because of thhe distraction that will come with him.

    Much like I said with Tebow, I feel for the guy because he shouldn't HAVE to deal with all that extra baggage...but ultimately fair is irrelevant in this case, it is what it is

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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    lol, the funniest thing about that announcement were the people talking about what a great player he was who obviously don't watch basketball
    yeah, the dude averaged 3 points per game over his career and just under 4 rebounds per game. his last season, he averaged 1ppg and just under 2 rpg. at his best, he was one of the worst players in the NBA
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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    Not really. I would want to balance the two.
    Not really. You continually talk about drafting him to entice fans, because of your morals/ethics, etc while basically ignoring the potential football negatives.

    And you talk about it distracting the team?

    I happen to believe that this would be no negative distraction at all.
    Then I question that you are an active football fan, or at least an active football fan of a franchise other than New England. I've got to watch first hand, REPEATEDLY, what distractions can do to a football team. Whether it was a few years back with Albert Haynesworth, or Donovan McNabb, or recently with RG3's knee. Players constantly being bombarded with distracting, non-football relevant questions. The Coach constantly being steered to talk about those things during press conferences. A media continually fueling the controversies ruining fan morale. It's a horrible cycle that I've seen play out again and again. Look at comments coming out from the Jet's when Tebow was there when ESPN basically was camped out at their complex due to a 2nd string QB? Question why when people talk about the "patriot way" part of that is Bellicheck masterfully controlling the media and the exposure of his players. Ask yourself why the notion of "bulletin board material" exists within the NFL, or why and who anonymous player sources are who start talking about news stories to the media.

    This guy is rated as a 3rd to 5th round selection...hardly a star or someone normally getting attention. Yet already he's getting MAJOR coverage by both the sports media AND the regular media. If you don't think there's going to be a madhouse of media attention over this guy from the day he's drafted through training camp and on yo'ure kidding yourself. And teams have shown time and time again that generally, save for the most stable or organizations, they don't like such attention because it's incredibly difficult to manage in a way that doesn't negatively affect the team.

    Mind you, I'm not bothering to respond to your attempt to strawman may argument into a distraction BECAUSE of his sexuality because I said repeatedly that I don't think THAT distraction itself will be that much of a problem.

    Also, the massive pluses for community support (remember, the NFL has huge political tax exemptions and stadium perks from local/state/national politicians...it is VERY important that they have a good image) are incalculable.
    Like I said...marketting and political reasonings.

    Additionally, I would feel better about myself and sleep better at night knowing I helped this cause move forward.
    Like I said....marketting and political reasonings.

    Any NFL G.M. is probably already a millionaire...they don't need to sacrifice their morals/ethics to feed their families.
    Like I said....marketting and political reasonings.

    And if drafting this guy gets me fired...so be it.

    I could DEFINITELY live with that.
    Like I said....marketting and political reasonings. (now can we stop with your attempt to suggest that wouldn't be your primary motivation)

    If I was the GM of a team that I thought was stable enough in it's management structure, confident in how ownership will react, and comfortable with what I know about my lockerroom I'd potentially think about doing it. However, if I'm the GM of the Redskins I don't. If I'm the GM or any team where I'm brand new or where our coach is brand new, I don't do it. If I'm someone like the Jets I don't do it. There's enough other talent out there rated at the same level that is not going to come with the baggage of the extreme media attention this guy would bring.

    That likely means he ends up being a steal for a solid team like New England, or perhaps Pittsburgh. In no way am I saying that it's unthinkable to draft him. Rather, the pool of potential draftees I think will simply be smaller than it would be if he wasn't gay OR this wouldn't garner the kind of attention it garners. And understandably so.

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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Not really. You continually talk about drafting him to entice fans, because of your morals/ethics, etc while basically ignoring the potential football negatives.



    Then I question that you are an active football fan, or at least an active football fan of a franchise other than New England. I've got to watch first hand, REPEATEDLY, what distractions can do to a football team. Whether it was a few years back with Albert Haynesworth, or Donovan McNabb, or recently with RG3's knee. Players constantly being bombarded with distracting, non-football relevant questions. The Coach constantly being steered to talk about those things during press conferences. A media continually fueling the controversies ruining fan morale. It's a horrible cycle that I've seen play out again and again. Look at comments coming out from the Jet's when Tebow was there when ESPN basically was camped out at their complex due to a 2nd string QB? Question why when people talk about the "patriot way" part of that is Bellicheck masterfully controlling the media and the exposure of his players. Ask yourself why the notion of "bulletin board material" exists within the NFL, or why and who anonymous player sources are who start talking about news stories to the media.

    This guy is rated as a 3rd to 5th round selection...hardly a star or someone normally getting attention. Yet already he's getting MAJOR coverage by both the sports media AND the regular media. If you don't think there's going to be a madhouse of media attention over this guy from the day he's drafted through training camp and on yo'ure kidding yourself. And teams have shown time and time again that generally, save for the most stable or organizations, they don't like such attention because it's incredibly difficult to manage in a way that doesn't negatively affect the team.

    Mind you, I'm not bothering to respond to your attempt to strawman may argument into a distraction BECAUSE of his sexuality because I said repeatedly that I don't think THAT distraction itself will be that much of a problem.



    Like I said...marketting and political reasonings.



    Like I said....marketting and political reasonings.



    Like I said....marketting and political reasonings.



    Like I said....marketting and political reasonings. (now can we stop with your attempt to suggest that wouldn't be your primary motivation)

    If I was the GM of a team that I thought was stable enough in it's management structure, confident in how ownership will react, and comfortable with what I know about my lockerroom I'd potentially think about doing it. However, if I'm the GM of the Redskins I don't. If I'm the GM or any team where I'm brand new or where our coach is brand new, I don't do it. If I'm someone like the Jets I don't do it. There's enough other talent out there rated at the same level that is not going to come with the baggage of the extreme media attention this guy would bring.

    That likely means he ends up being a steal for a solid team like New England, or perhaps Pittsburgh. In no way am I saying that it's unthinkable to draft him. Rather, the pool of potential draftees I think will simply be smaller than it would be if he wasn't gay OR this wouldn't garner the kind of attention it garners. And understandably so.
    Whoa...no offense but this is getting way more long-winded then matters to me. Debating theories is a complete waste of time IMO. Few people involved ever change their mind...and the debates usually just go on and on and on....and there are others things I would rather do with my time then endlessly debate a theory.


    Look, I would draft this guy in the position that my scouts tell me he is worth it on the field...and I have stated why.

    You would not because him being gay would cause 'distractions' and I assume you have stated why.

    I don't agree with you and you don't agree with me...what else needs to be said?


    Good day.
    Last edited by DA60; 02-10-14 at 02:32 PM.

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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    When did you decide to be straight? When did you come out to your co-workers?

    It's interesting how the same people who were all concerned about a gay guy being a problem in the locker room, now say "who cares." If it was really like that, why hasn't anyone come out before? Do you really think there were no gay guys in the NFL?
    Oh, the news it's about me, I didn't announce anything. Good point about the locker room though. I guess he'll have a seperate room, or just get to see the sex he is attracked to unclothed all the time. I wonder if women would have a problem with a guy showering with them?
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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    I don't agree with you and you don't agree with me...what else needs to be said?
    Nothing apparently since there seems to be no use, seeing as you bitch about people typing a lot on a message board and then turn around and show you didn't bother to read anything I wrote by once again misrepresenting the point I'm making by claiming something I distinctly said WASN'T what I was saying.

    If my talent scouts tell me he's rated at a 3rd round grade at OLB and another OLB is rated at a 3rd round grade, I'm taking the guy who’s not going to cause a swarm of media attention to come down upon my team as a major distraction. If he's available in the 5th or 6th at a great value, then perhaps I'm more inclined to act. But the distraction because of the massive political influenced NEWS story, not his status as a gay man, would be a negative that would be taken into effect. And I imagine it’ll be the case for some of the teams in this years draft. But much like Tim Tebow going in the first round…it only takes one team to think “I can do this”.

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    Re: All-American college football player Michael Sam says he is gay

    Something occured to me when I was a young homophobic Marine. They are gay wether they come out or not. So it really must not be a big deal since it wasnt a problem anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    Oh, the news it's about me, I didn't announce anything. Good point about the locker room though. I guess he'll have a seperate room, or just get to see the sex he is attracked to unclothed all the time. I wonder if women would have a problem with a guy showering with them?
    God Bless the Marine Corps.

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