• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Lake Mead is shrinking -- and with it Las Vegas' water supply

specklebang said:
••Israel has been working on desalination for many decades. I'm guessing© the technology has been pretty advanced. The only real barrier is the cost.



••I certainly hope so. We'll pay off whomever we have to.



••Gee. Thanks. Can the cats and I move in with you? Just for a few years?



••Believe it or not, our zombie population has been shrinking. You can go hours without sighting one.



••Las Vegas is already (finally) developing a new source of economic revenue. We are in the process of becoming the center for clouds. Our University has gone from utterly lame to one of the top 10.



••Water is way too cheap. Once it cost 50¢ to take a shower, you'll see a big change in people's habits.

I'll also point out that Las Vegas is a great place to live. Low cost of living. Plenty of entertainment. 24/7 businesses. Plenty of parking. The city is flat, easy to develope but we are ringed by beautiful mountains. The weather is moderate, just a couple of blazing hot Summer and yes, it's a DRY heat.

Las Vegas is recovering in a healthy way. The losers moved away after the housing bust. The technology people are moving in. I went to a First Friday event recently and I was stunned by how the population has changed. So many "normal" people, nicely dressed, having fun. The changes are unbelievable to an old-timer like me.

There is no more of this lawn stuff. Almost everyone has gone to desert landscaping. I expect that once water doubles in price, there will be plenty. We don't grow crops so unlike CA, we don't really NEED water.

Now, obviously, I want all this to work out. And I think it will. Now, the CA crop issue is a lot more scary. Food is very important.
Click to expand...

As I said earlier though even with all Vegas has done to conserve water, lake Meade is still forecast to drop 20 feet in the next year. How long can this go on? What happens when it's dry?
 
notquiteright said:
First thing the desert SW needs to do is stop exporting it's water to other states. Second thing to remember is it is a very arid climate and not well suited to be inhabited like it is a lush oasis in the desert. Third a prolonged drought might indicate climate change... :roll:

Fourth, Lost Wages isn't the only place suffering from extended drought. Texoma is the area on both sides of the Red River separating Texas from Oklahoma. We have had record heat and prolonged drought to the point businesses don't want to relocate- even with the lower taxes and eager to work population. Local chambers and Quasi government committees who's sole job is to attract new business are getting no takers.

Wichita Falls Texas is trying to figure out what a stage 5 drought policy should be- mostly because stage 5 was, until now, unthinkable. Reservoirs are so low that local hotels and restaurants don't serve glasses of water because it is often off tasting and off color.

So this is a region wide drought, not just a playground in the desert's problem. Folks might be getting out while the getting is good across the entire SW.
Click to expand...

Lake Mead is part of the Colorado River. The water of the Colorado River is Federal water. California has already had 1/2 of it's water from the Colorado River intended for California's (Metropolitan Water District) diverted to Arizona because so many Americans have been fleeing to Arizona to get away from liberal Nanny States.

And the liberal controlled State Legislature in Sacramento still has the "Welcome Matt" out on the California/Mexico border welcoming every illegal alien and telling them to send for their extended families because the stupid people of California are willing to pay for educating your children, provide basic health care at hospital emergency rooms. And as soon as you pop out an "anchor baby", you get WICS, food stamps, ADC welfare, in state tuition at colleges, subsidized housing, Obama phones and now drivers licenses. Oh yeah, you can also vote and buy guns.
 
Wrong again, but for different reasons, but I don't mean to be an ass about it.
In Illinois, local GOP farmers were forced to take "wind-farm" money under eminent domain.
apdst said:
Tree huggers fight tooth and nail to stop wind and solar farms.
Click to expand...
Beautiful brick homes, a lifelong dream, shattered by a field of electromagnetic impulses of unknown damage and unsightlyness..

Btw, the wind and solar are 15% of new energy by law, written by libbos.
Aside, Illinois is not left or right of center that much either party.

As for solar field, we're all in on one near me.
Tons of money for all government/school entities.
Farm field of lower grade.
Farm field will go back to farming in 20 years .
 
Last edited:
You should start a thread on what you typed after the first two and a half sentences.
I assume you're linking Lake Mead going down due to illegal aliens and rant.
Do you know the history of the Colorado River and water that coulda/woulda/shoulda gone to Mexico ?
APACHERAT said:
Lake Mead is part of the Colorado River. The water of the Colorado River is Federal water. California has already had 1/2 of it's water from the Colorado River intended for California's (Metropolitan Water District) diverted to Arizona because so many Americans have been fleeing to Arizona to get away from liberal Nanny States.

And the liberal controlled State Legislature in Sacramento still has the "Welcome Matt" out on the California/Mexico border welcoming every illegal alien and telling them to send for their extended families because the stupid people of California are willing to pay for educating your children, provide basic health care at hospital emergency rooms. And as soon as you pop out an "anchor baby", you get WICS, food stamps, ADC welfare, in state tuition at colleges, subsidized housing, Obama phones and now drivers licenses. Oh yeah, you can also vote and buy guns.
Click to expand...
 
NIMBY said:
Wrong again, but for different reasons, but I don't mean to be an ass about it.
In Illinois, local GOP farmers were forced to take "wind-farm" money under eminent domain.

Beautiful brick homes, a lifelong dream, shattered by a field of electromagnetic impulses of unknown damage.

Btw, the wind and solar are 15% of new energy by law, written by libbos.
Aside, Illinois is not left or right of center that much either party.

As for solar field, we're all in on one near me.
Tons of money for all government/school entities.
Farm field of lower grade.
Farm field will go back to farming in 20 years .
Click to expand...

No, I'm not wrong...

Environmentalists Gearing Up For A War On Wind - Forbes

Wind power creating an environmental divide - Business - The Boston Globe

Environmentalists Oppose Mojave Desert Solar Power | Heartlander Magazine

Environmentalists who backed solar farms now oppose them
 
apdst said:
Likewise, we can trust your questions to be flamebait.
Click to expand...

No flamebait. No offense intended. Just a complaint that my post was taken out of context and presented as something it was not. And when you refused to acknowledge or correct that, you indicate you intend to quote people dishonestly. Just making the observation. And I will wish you a good evening and move on.
 
I haven't checked its depth recently, but surely its not as wide as you go down.
sawyerloggingon said:
As I said earlier though even with all Vegas has done to conserve water, lake Meade is still forecast to drop 20 feet in the next year. How long can this go on? What happens when it's dry?
Click to expand...
Don't look now, but the same damn thing is happening all over the West/Southwest.
Lake Powell comes to mind.

What's it like in Idaho?
I always like repeating the story of how Idaho potato farmers own the water in Jackson Lake at the base of the Grand Tetons,
in Wyoming for Goodness sake.
 
Before you completely disappear from this thread, care to give an update on water conditions in the Taos and North Central NM area, my favorite.
And NM in general?
I also really like parts of Albuquerque and Sandia Peak.
Really still need to do more NM but life is so short .
AlbqOwl said:
No flamebait. No offense intended. Just a complaint that my post was taken out of context and presented as something it was not. And when you refused to acknowledge or correct that, you indicate you intend to quote people dishonestly. Just making the observation. And I will wish you a good evening and move on.
Click to expand...
 
NIMBY said:
I haven't checked its depth recently, but surely its not as wide as you go down.

Don't look now, but the same damn thing is happening all over the West/Southwest.
Lake Powell comes to mind.

What's it like in Idaho?
I always like repeating the story of how Idaho potato farmers own the water in Jackson Lake at the base of the Grand Tetons,
in Wyoming for Goodness sake.
Click to expand...

The photos are too large to post here, but this link shows earth shots of Elephant Butte Lake, New Mexico's largest lake, at normal levels and just below that the same lake as it appears now during what is described as not just severe, not just extreme, but as exceptional drought for our area:
Drought Dries Elephant Butte Reservoir : Image of the Day
 
I can only go from my personal experiences since I know these farmers.
They got ****ed and paid off.
I will check your links when I am not robo-posting.
We've got a new oil/gas pipeline down to Pontiac, right next to a huge landfill.
Too bad we can't just recycle and incinerate--imagine those jobs.
Imagine--John Lennon was on to something .
Lots of income from Chicago Suburban and Northwest Indiana towns and their ****ing garbage, southeast of me.
apdst said:
No, I'm not wrong...

Environmentalists Gearing Up For A War On Wind - Forbes

Wind power creating an environmental divide - Business - The Boston Globe

Environmentalists Oppose Mojave Desert Solar Power | Heartlander Magazine

Environmentalists who backed solar farms now oppose them
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
NIMBY said:
I haven't checked its depth recently, but surely its not as wide as you go down.

Don't look now, but the same damn thing is happening all over the West/Southwest.
Lake Powell comes to mind.

What's it like in Idaho?
I always like repeating the story of how Idaho potato farmers own the water in Jackson Lake at the base of the Grand Tetons,
in Wyoming for Goodness sake.
Click to expand...

We are a bit behind normal snow pack this year but the last three winters have been fine. No worries here. On my recent trip to Calif though I was shocked, it looks like the middle of summer and when I flew over Shasta it looked like a mud hole. I'm going back in a few days and my brother said they are drinking lots of beer to conserve water.:lol:
 
NIMBY said:
Before you completely disappear from this thread, care to give an update on water conditions in the Taos and North Central NM area, my favorite.
And NM in general?
I also really like parts of Albuquerque and Sandia Peak.
Really still need to do more NM but life is so short .
Click to expand...

I did just before I saw your post. :) All the other New Mexico lakes are similarly stressed - Cochiti, Conchas, Navajo, etc.

I looked for something similar for Lake Mead and the comparison here is pretty dramatic. The top shot of course now - the bottom one before the drought began:
Hoover Dam Photos Pictures - Drought Effects On The Lake Mead Side
 
AlbqOwl said:
The photos are too large to post here, but this link shows earth shots of Elephant Butte Lake, New Mexico's largest lake, at normal levels and just below that the same lake as it appears now during what is described as not just severe, not just extreme, but as exceptional drought for our area:
Drought Dries Elephant Butte Reservoir : Image of the Day
Click to expand...

I saw a similar photo of the Sierras. There is just a slender ribbon of white along its crest.
 
Meaning all of the waterfalls in Yosemite will dry up earlier this summer.
sawyerloggingon said:
I saw a similar photo of the Sierras. There is just a slender ribbon of white along its crest.
Click to expand...
Back here, the Great Lakes have varied only SIX feet one way or another back to the beginning of stats .
 
NIMBY said:
I can only go from my personal experiences since I know these farmers.
They got ****ed and paid off.
I will check your links when I am not robo-posting.
We've got a new oil/gas pipeline down to Pontiac, right next to a huge landfill.
Too bad we can't just recycle and incinerate--imagine those jobs.
Imagine--John Lennon was on to something .
Lots of income from Chicago Suburban and Northwest Indiana towns and their ****ing garbage, southeast of me.
Click to expand...

Sounds great! What about the smoke?
 
apdst said:
Sounds great! What about the smoke?
Click to expand...
We will find a chemical or nuclear way to change it to something useful.
Some of the stuff on H2 and Military Channel late is amazing.
We need another Einstein.
We need to reverse engineer his equations in practicality, though who knows what gov't has going.
Dump it on the moon--Newt will be proven right--a "tethered" pipe to the Moon.
I love all the theories on "3's".
They had Tesla's on last night and this Indian mathematician, called the smartest person alive .
 
NIMBY said:
We will find a chemical or nuclear way to change it to something useful.
Some of the stuff on H2 and Military Channel late is amazing.
We need another Einstein.
We need to reverse engineer his equations in practicality, though who knows what gov't has going.
Dump it on the moon--Newt will be proven right--a "tethered" pipe to the Moon.
I love all the theories on "3's".
They had Tesla's on last night and this Indian mathematician, called the smartest person alive .
Click to expand...

Which is why I am not all that worried about the drought. I figure humankind has survived worse as well as the last ice age and pretty much anything else Mother Nature can throw at us. So a drought certainly isn't beyond our capability to figure out. Or, if it just isn't feasible to stay here, everybody packs up and goes somewhere else as civilizations have been doing here and there on the Earth for all the history of mankind.

The only thing is, I really like our laid back casual lifestyle out here on the high desert. Will we fit in with the folks in Illinois or Ohio?
 
NIMBY said:
We will find a chemical or nuclear way to change it to something useful.
Some of the stuff on H2 and Military Channel late is amazing.
We need another Einstein.
We need to reverse engineer his equations in practicality, though who knows what gov't has going.
Dump it on the moon--Newt will be proven right--a "tethered" pipe to the Moon.
I love all the theories on "3's".
They had Tesla's on last night and this Indian mathematician, called the smartest person alive .
Click to expand...

There'll be a toxic by-product that the tree huggers will get pissed off about...lol!!!
 
I blame air conditioning.
I wouldn't camp overnight where there wasn't fresh water but since air conditioning was perfected hundreds of thousands of Americans have settled in the 'sun belt', largely affluent types who are used to the government providing them with the means to maintain their lifestyle- golf courses, swimming pools, manicured lawns, cheap Mexican servants, etc.
Cut them off, I say. Too late to save the Colorado river but let them all go find their own water.
 
AlbqOwl said:
Which is why I am not all that worried about the drought. I figure humankind has survived worse as well as the last ice age and pretty much anything else Mother Nature can throw at us. So a drought certainly isn't beyond our capability to figure out. Or, if it just isn't feasible to stay here, everybody packs up and goes somewhere else as civilizations have been doing here and there on the Earth for all the history of mankind.

The only thing is, I really like our laid back casual lifestyle out here on the high desert. Will we fit in with the folks in Illinois or Ohio?[/QUOTE]

Probably what the Anasazi thought, "will we fit in with the Navaho and Apache?"
Click to expand...
 
sawyerloggingon said:
AlbqOwl said:
Which is why I am not all that worried about the drought. I figure humankind has survived worse as well as the last ice age and pretty much anything else Mother Nature can throw at us. So a drought certainly isn't beyond our capability to figure out. Or, if it just isn't feasible to stay here, everybody packs up and goes somewhere else as civilizations have been doing here and there on the Earth for all the history of mankind.

The only thing is, I really like our laid back casual lifestyle out here on the high desert. Will we fit in with the folks in Illinois or Ohio?[/QUOTE]

Probably what the Anasazi thought, "will we fit in with the Navaho and Apache?"
Click to expand...

LOL. Actually they didn't so far as we know. But they did get along with the Pueblo people who it is presumed assimilated them.
Click to expand...
 
Grand Mal said:
I blame air conditioning.
I wouldn't camp overnight where there wasn't fresh water but since air conditioning was perfected hundreds of thousands of Americans have settled in the 'sun belt', largely affluent types who are used to the government providing them with the means to maintain their lifestyle- golf courses, swimming pools, manicured lawns, cheap Mexican servants, etc.
Cut them off, I say. Too late to save the Colorado river but let them all go find their own water.
Click to expand...

The wages of the nanny state.
 
sawyerloggingon said:
There has been a 14 year drought in this part of the US and if it goes on much longer Las Vegas will be a ghost town. If you own real estate there you should get while the gettin is good. Vegas may be the next Salton Sea resort area.


LAKE MEAD, Nev. - When you head out on Nevada's Lake Mead, the first thing you notice is a white line. That's where the water used to be.
What did this look like a decade ago?
"This was all underwater," said Pat Mulroy, the general manager of the Southern Nevada Water Authority. "I mean boats were everywhere. There was a whole marina here."
Mulroy said that the drought began 14 years ago. Satellite photos show the Colorado River, which feeds Lake Mead, is drying up -- so the lake is rapidly shrinking. Islands are growing, and boats are floating far from where they once were.



Lake Mead is shrinking -- and with it Las Vegas' water supply - CBS News
Click to expand...


Well, it is a desert after all. We have treated that area like an oasis for far too long. It has had relatively good rainfall for decades before this. I am sure this is why people began to move there in droves. Now the weather is going back to being very, very dry and the residents are finding out that it's not so perfect after all. I don't believe that climate change has anything to do with it. Again, it's a desert.
 
I have this theory that the water in Las Vegas and the drought in the west is directly related to the choice to cut water to California farmland over the last decade. A lot of the water used in irrigation in California evaporates, follows the easterly winds and end up as precipitation and then flows back west.

People seem to forget that before California was settled that that wide expanse of California farm land was desert. It's going back there now.
 
AlbqOwl said:
No it is a drought. Our area was recently classified as not just severe drought or extreme drought but exceptional drought, i.e. there is no drought in our recorded history that is as bad as this drought has been. As somebody previously posted, it was almost certainly just such a drought that drove the Anasazi from their ancient cultural homes. And if it is another 100-year drought, we really will have to figure out how to deal with that. I trust human ingenuity to be up to the task though.
Click to expand...

Actually the Anasazi 'disappeared' from a variety of factors. Over population was one of them, pressure from the invader tribes like the Navajo who's meaning for Anasazi is ancient enemy, and being pushed into marginal areas where access to easily irrigated lands was very limited and thus the effects of the drought were increased on them but not the Navajo- remember people lived in the area through-out the exceptional drought.

I wouldn't bet on human ingenuity so much- many desert civilizations have failed- from the Sahara, the Mongolian desert, Egypt, Mesopotamia, the Holy Lands, Australia, the short grass prairie of New Mexico (now a sandy wasteland- thanks to human ingenuity)

Come to think of it has there been any example of the desert being turned back by human ingenuity?

And FYI exceptional drought doesn't mean the worst in recorded history- read up on D4 drought as SW OK and the Texas panhandle has had D4 in areas for awhile now.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom