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Thread: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    Is it assumed that there will be no challengers to Clinton--that she is a shoo-in, even though she has repeatedly stated that she is not interested? Why is that, Pero? If for health or some other reason she doesn't run, wouldn't that create a problem for the Dems to field some candidates, since everyone is currently concentrating on one person?
    Pol, I have never heard she wasn't interested. What I have heard is she hadn't made up her mind yet. But the same thing is happening on the Democratic side, the old tired, true and blue names are floated. Clinton, Biden, Warren, Cuomo, O'Malley and Schweitzer. In all polls concerning the Democratic nomination Clinton is in the mid 60% range and everyone one else is in single digits except Biden which comes in at 10-11%. Hence the coronation of Hillary. But she was way ahead in 2007 and she lost in the 2008 primaries. I expect a fresh face.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    Pol, I have never heard she wasn't interested. What I have heard is she hadn't made up her mind yet. But the same thing is happening on the Democratic side, the old tired, true and blue names are floated. Clinton, Biden, Warren, Cuomo, O'Malley and Schweitzer. In all polls concerning the Democratic nomination Clinton is in the mid 60% range and everyone one else is in single digits except Biden which comes in at 10-11%. Hence the coronation of Hillary. But she was way ahead in 2007 and she lost in the 2008 primaries. I expect a fresh face.
    I believe she stated that she wasn't interested, because she wanted to devote her time to advancing women's causes around the world. It is hard to believe, though, that one would not be interested in being President of the United States!

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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    In RWR's own words:

    "When I began entering into the give and take of legislative bargaining in Sacramento, a lot of the most radical conservatives who had supported me during the election didn't like it.


    "Compromise" was a dirty word to them and they wouldn't face the fact that we couldn't get all of what we wanted today. They wanted all or nothing and they wanted it all at once. If you don't get it all, some said, don't take anything.


    "I'd learned while negotiating union contracts that you seldom got everything you asked for. And I agreed with FDR, who said in 1933: 'I have no expectations of making a hit every time I come to bat. What I seek is the highest possible batting average.'


    "If you got seventy-five or eighty percent of what you were asking for, I say, you take it and fight for the rest later, and that's what I told these radical conservatives who never got used to it."
    Here are a few quotes for you to ponder.
    Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty.

    Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn’t pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children’s children what it was once like in the United States where men were free.

    Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them.

    Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.

    Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other.

    Government’s first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives.

    Government’s view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

    Man is not free unless government is limited.

    No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we’ll ever see on this earth!


    The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I’m from the government and I’m here to help.

    The problem is not that people are taxed too little, the problem is that government spends too much.

    All of us should remember that the Federal Government is not some mysterious institution comprised of buildings, files, and paper. The people are the government. What we create we ought to be able to control.

    We are learning that the way to prosperity is not more bureaucracy and redistribution of wealth but less government and more freedom for the entrepreneur and for the creativity of the individual.

    The federal government has taken on functions it was never intended to perform and which it does not perform well. There should be a planned, orderly transfer of such functions to states and communities and a transfer with them of the sources of taxation to pay for them.

    Government is never more dangerous than when our desire to have it help us blinds us to its great power to harm us.

    We are going to put an end to the notion that the American taxpayer exists to fund the federal government. The federal government exists to serve the American people.

    Here in this land, for the first time, it was decided that man is born with certain God-given rights. We the people declared that government is created by the people for their own convenience. Government has no power except those voluntarily granted to it by we the people.

    I will not stand by and watch this great country destroy itself under mediocre leadership that drifts from one crisis to the next, eroding our national will and purpose.

    America must remain freedom’s staunchest friend, for freedom is our best ally and it is the world’s only hope to conquer poverty and preserve peace.

    The Founding Fathers established a nation under God, ruled not by arbitrary decrees of kings or the whims of entrenched elites but by the consent of the governed. Theirs was the vision of a striving, God-fearing, self-reliant people living in the sunlight of justice and breathing the bracing air of liberty.

    We are taxing ourselves into economic exhaustion and stagnation, crushing our ability and incentive to save, invest and produce. This must stop.

    There’s a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts.

    Our Founding Fathers devised a system of government unique in all the world – a federation of sovereign States, with as much law and decision-making authority as possible kept at the local level.

    When we deprive people of what they have earned, or take away their jobs, we destroy their dignity and undermine their families.

    Freedom is the recognition that no single person, no single authority or government has a monopoly on the truth, but that every individual life is infinitely precious, that every one of us put in this world has been put there for a reason and has something to offer. It´s so hard for government planners, no matter how sophisticated, to ever substitute for millions of individuals working night and day to make their dreams come true. The fact is, bureaucracies are a problem around the world.

    I think the best possible social program is a job.

    The size of the Federal budget is not an appropriate barometer of social conscience or charitable concern.

    Our federal tax system is, in short, utterly impossible, utterly unjust and completely counterproductive, [it] reeks with injustice and is fundamentally un-American… it has earned a rebellion and it’s time we rebelled.
    The federal government has taken too much tax money from the people, too much authority from the states, and too much liberty with the Constitution.

    Our natural, inalienable rights are now considered to be a dispensation from government, and freedom has never been so fragile, so close to slipping from our grasp as it is at this moment.
    Extreme taxation, excessive controls, oppressive government competition with business, frustrated minorities and forgotten Americans are not the products of free enterprise. They are the residue of centralized bureaucracy, of government by a self-anointed elite.

    Nations crumble from within when the citizenry asks of government those things which the citizenry might better provide for itself. … [I] hope we have once again reminded people that man is not free unless government is limited.
    There’s a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts.

    Republicans believe the best way to assure prosperity is to generate more jobs. The Democrats believe in more welfare.

    I’m convinced that today the majority of Americans want what those first Americans wanted: A better life for themselves and their children; a minimum of government authority. Very simply, they want to be left alone in peace and safety to take care of the family by earning an honest dollar and putting away some savings. This may not sound too exciting, but there is something magnificent about it. On the farm, on the street corner, in the factory and in the kitchen, millions of us ask nothing more, but certainly nothing less than to live our own lives according to our values — at peace with ourselves, our neighbors and the world.

    Government is not a solution to our problem, government is the problem.


    These quotes make it perfectly clear that Reagan was all about small government and that is something the Republican elites have strayed away from, including you.

  4. #44
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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    Here are a few quotes for you to ponder.
    Concentrated power has always been the enemy of liberty.

    Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn’t pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children’s children what it was once like in the United States where men were free.

    Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them.

    Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.

    Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other.

    Government’s first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives.

    Government’s view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.

    Man is not free unless government is limited.

    No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we’ll ever see on this earth!


    The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I’m from the government and I’m here to help.

    The problem is not that people are taxed too little, the problem is that government spends too much.

    All of us should remember that the Federal Government is not some mysterious institution comprised of buildings, files, and paper. The people are the government. What we create we ought to be able to control.

    We are learning that the way to prosperity is not more bureaucracy and redistribution of wealth but less government and more freedom for the entrepreneur and for the creativity of the individual.

    The federal government has taken on functions it was never intended to perform and which it does not perform well. There should be a planned, orderly transfer of such functions to states and communities and a transfer with them of the sources of taxation to pay for them.

    Government is never more dangerous than when our desire to have it help us blinds us to its great power to harm us.

    We are going to put an end to the notion that the American taxpayer exists to fund the federal government. The federal government exists to serve the American people.

    Here in this land, for the first time, it was decided that man is born with certain God-given rights. We the people declared that government is created by the people for their own convenience. Government has no power except those voluntarily granted to it by we the people.

    I will not stand by and watch this great country destroy itself under mediocre leadership that drifts from one crisis to the next, eroding our national will and purpose.

    America must remain freedom’s staunchest friend, for freedom is our best ally and it is the world’s only hope to conquer poverty and preserve peace.

    The Founding Fathers established a nation under God, ruled not by arbitrary decrees of kings or the whims of entrenched elites but by the consent of the governed. Theirs was the vision of a striving, God-fearing, self-reliant people living in the sunlight of justice and breathing the bracing air of liberty.

    We are taxing ourselves into economic exhaustion and stagnation, crushing our ability and incentive to save, invest and produce. This must stop.

    There’s a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts.

    Our Founding Fathers devised a system of government unique in all the world – a federation of sovereign States, with as much law and decision-making authority as possible kept at the local level.

    When we deprive people of what they have earned, or take away their jobs, we destroy their dignity and undermine their families.

    Freedom is the recognition that no single person, no single authority or government has a monopoly on the truth, but that every individual life is infinitely precious, that every one of us put in this world has been put there for a reason and has something to offer. It´s so hard for government planners, no matter how sophisticated, to ever substitute for millions of individuals working night and day to make their dreams come true. The fact is, bureaucracies are a problem around the world.

    I think the best possible social program is a job.

    The size of the Federal budget is not an appropriate barometer of social conscience or charitable concern.

    Our federal tax system is, in short, utterly impossible, utterly unjust and completely counterproductive, [it] reeks with injustice and is fundamentally un-American… it has earned a rebellion and it’s time we rebelled.
    The federal government has taken too much tax money from the people, too much authority from the states, and too much liberty with the Constitution.

    Our natural, inalienable rights are now considered to be a dispensation from government, and freedom has never been so fragile, so close to slipping from our grasp as it is at this moment.
    Extreme taxation, excessive controls, oppressive government competition with business, frustrated minorities and forgotten Americans are not the products of free enterprise. They are the residue of centralized bureaucracy, of government by a self-anointed elite.

    Nations crumble from within when the citizenry asks of government those things which the citizenry might better provide for itself. … [I] hope we have once again reminded people that man is not free unless government is limited.
    There’s a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts.

    Republicans believe the best way to assure prosperity is to generate more jobs. The Democrats believe in more welfare.

    I’m convinced that today the majority of Americans want what those first Americans wanted: A better life for themselves and their children; a minimum of government authority. Very simply, they want to be left alone in peace and safety to take care of the family by earning an honest dollar and putting away some savings. This may not sound too exciting, but there is something magnificent about it. On the farm, on the street corner, in the factory and in the kitchen, millions of us ask nothing more, but certainly nothing less than to live our own lives according to our values — at peace with ourselves, our neighbors and the world.

    Government is not a solution to our problem, government is the problem.


    These quotes make it perfectly clear that Reagan was all about small government and that is something the Republican elites have strayed away from, including you.
    It's a nice list, but you can't win a specific debate with a pile of irrelevancies, no matter how high the pile. Fact is that kamikazes like you are the people who betray RWR's legacy every day. Nominating a witch for Senate in Delaware and stupid candidates in Indiana and Missouri are only the screw-ups that come immediately to mind. The political obtuseness of folks like you has kept the Senate in Dem hands. Thank you for Obamacare.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  5. #45
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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    I believe she stated that she wasn't interested, because she wanted to devote her time to advancing women's causes around the world. It is hard to believe, though, that one would not be interested in being President of the United States!
    When I watched the news during supper they were talking about Hillary and who else might be interested. The news basically said all others are waiting for her to make up her mind about running or not before they, the other decide whether to throw their hat into the ring or not.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  6. #46
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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    It's a nice list, but you can't win a specific debate with a pile of irrelevancies, no matter how high the pile. Fact is that kamikazes like you are the people who betray RWR's legacy every day. Nominating a witch for Senate in Delaware and stupid candidates in Indiana and Missouri are only the screw-ups that come immediately to mind. The political obtuseness of folks like you has kept the Senate in Dem hands. Thank you for Obamacare.
    What a load of crap but not surprising considering the source. You start off with quotes, I bury you in relevance and you come back with crap like that? You have pissed away the main objectives of what was once the Republican party in the name of compromise and now you have compromised to the point you stand for absolutely nothing. Certainly nothing Reagan advocated. It wasn't a couple of Senate seats that were lost that brought us Obamacare, it was people like you who have compromised to the point that folks don't see any difference in the major parties and decide to vote for the one that promises more freebies. Maybe it is time for you to grow a few principles.

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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    What a load of crap but not surprising considering the source. You start off with quotes, I bury you in relevance and you come back with crap like that? You have pissed away the main objectives of what was once the Republican party in the name of compromise and now you have compromised to the point you stand for absolutely nothing. Certainly nothing Reagan advocated. It wasn't a couple of Senate seats that were lost that brought us Obamacare, it was people like you who have compromised to the point that folks don't see any difference in the major parties and decide to vote for the one that promises more freebies. Maybe it is time for you to grow a few principles.
    You found a list of RWR quotes, admirable but not relevant to this discussion. You mistake childish, self-defeating stubbornness for principles. From Edmund Burke to Benjamin Disraeli to Ronald Reagan, not one of the great conservative leaders had anything in common with your juvenile intransigence.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  8. #48
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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    You found a list of RWR quotes, admirable but not relevant to this discussion. You mistake childish, self-defeating stubbornness for principles. From Edmund Burke to Benjamin Disraeli to Ronald Reagan, not one of the great conservative leaders had anything in common with your juvenile intransigence.
    Well you are really good at telling people they are irrelevant or absurd etc. etc. etc. and now we can include juvenile intransigence which amounts to personal attacks of those who disagree with the great and all knowing Jack Hays. <cough> If I were to post what I really think of you at this time it would get me banned. So let me just end this little conversation by stating I am more in line in my thinking with the Founders, Classic Liberals, and current Conservative thinkers than you would ever hope to be. They stood for something and so do I. You don't. Your ideology is so watered down due to compromising basic principles that you might as well join the Democrat party and be done with it.

  9. #49
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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by vesper View Post
    Well you are really good at telling people they are irrelevant or absurd etc. etc. etc. and now we can include juvenile intransigence which amounts to personal attacks of those who disagree with the great and all knowing Jack Hays. <cough> If I were to post what I really think of you at this time it would get me banned. So let me just end this little conversation by stating I am more in line in my thinking with the Founders, Classic Liberals, and current Conservative thinkers than you would ever hope to be. They stood for something and so do I. You don't. Your ideology is so watered down due to compromising basic principles that you might as well join the Democrat party and be done with it.
    You have no idea what are my views and certainly no grounds to declare them watered down. You also seem to be an example of the truth of the saying that a little learning is a dangerous thing. I'm not sure who you would consider to be a current Conservative thinker (Krauthammer? Will? Kristol?) or Classic Liberal (Mill? Locke? Smith?) but I suspect I know them better than you. As for the Founders, it's apparent your ignorance is nearly boundless. I recommend you study more and declaim less.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  10. #50
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    Re: Cuccinelli says Christie should quit RGA

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    You have no idea what are my views and certainly no grounds to declare them watered down. You also seem to be an example of the truth of the saying that a little learning is a dangerous thing. I'm not sure who you would consider to be a current Conservative thinker (Krauthammer? Will? Kristol?) or Classic Liberal (Mill? Locke? Smith?) but I suspect I know them better than you. As for the Founders, it's apparent your ignorance is nearly boundless. I recommend you study more and declaim less.
    I've read enough of the stuff you have posted on this forum to conclude you are indeed one with watered down principles in relation to what was once considered the basic principles of the Republican party.
    I have dedicated much study to those who influenced the Founders. From Nicolo Machiavelli, Thomas Hobbes, James Harrington , John Locke, Charles de Montesquieu, Thomas Paine and John Stuart Mill. And by no means is that a complete list! If you assume you know more than me, then that alone is a sign of a man who assumes too much. To characterize me as a "dangerous thing" because of "little learning" would be words that could only be from a very arrogant, pompous person that most likely is due to his own shortcomings. Does the shoe fit?
    Last edited by vesper; 01-23-14 at 12:10 AM.

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