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Thread: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    Fox is not that bad. Fox has straight news from 9AM till 5PM and then again from 6-7PM. Granted Fox slants right during their straight news, but their talk shows really do not start until 7PM with Gretta although the FIve is there at 5PM. Courting liberal media outlets usually does not work and always backfires it seems. It does seems most Republicans have remained quiet about bridgegate and have not come out to defend him as Democrats would have if he were from their party. Guilliani, Romney, McCain and the RNC head along with Rove are the only ones I have heard come out in his defense. Two has beens, a senator headed for retirement, a talking head and one who job is to defend every republican regardless. Not a strong list for sure.

    But this whole thing was of his or his underlings makings, so we will see where the chips fall.
    If I had to guess, I'd say that the usual party players will diminish seriousness of any sort of "scandal" being attached to this, but only in guarded ways, largely because of how divisive political climate is today. Most will caveat their support with "If he's telling the truth", because outright support will turn out to be used against them by liberals if it turns out that Christie knew. But as scandals go this one is weak, and liberals are inflating it to pre emptively take out the one GOP hopeful that has already polled to beat Hillary.

    Also, I'll just say that because liberals hammered repubs so hard during the Bush years, then promised to change the way things are done in DC, when all we got is ramped up corruption, and when questioned, usually a reply of 'sit down and shut up' by liberals who just ram through like a bull in a china shop, and then say if you don't like TFB!
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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    If I had to guess, I'd say that the usual party players will diminish seriousness of any sort of "scandal" being attached to this, but only in guarded ways, largely because of how divisive political climate is today. Most will caveat their support with "If he's telling the truth", because outright support will turn out to be used against them by liberals if it turns out that Christie knew. But as scandals go this one is weak, and liberals are inflating it to pre emptively take out the one GOP hopeful that has already polled to beat Hillary.

    Also, I'll just say that because liberals hammered repubs so hard during the Bush years, then promised to change the way things are done in DC, when all we got is ramped up corruption, and when questioned, usually a reply of 'sit down and shut up' by liberals who just ram through like a bull in a china shop, and then say if you don't like TFB!
    That makes sense to me. I can't say I blame most of the GOP.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    If I had to guess, I'd say that the usual party players will diminish seriousness of any sort of "scandal" being attached to this, but only in guarded ways, largely because of how divisive political climate is today. Most will caveat their support with "If he's telling the truth", because outright support will turn out to be used against them by liberals if it turns out that Christie knew. But as scandals go this one is weak, and liberals are inflating it to pre emptively take out the one GOP hopeful that has already polled to beat Hillary.

    Also, I'll just say that because liberals hammered repubs so hard during the Bush years, then promised to change the way things are done in DC, when all we got is ramped up corruption, and when questioned, usually a reply of 'sit down and shut up' by liberals who just ram through like a bull in a china shop, and then say if you don't like TFB!

    A rather common tactic used in today's world - When you are doing wrong, accuse the opposition of doing that of which you are actually the guilty one(s)
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    from the NYTimes linked page

    It appears to be playing well with viewers: For the week of Jan. 6, when the story began to gain national attention, Rachel Maddow, who had pursued the story for more than a month, scored a rare weekly win, beating the perennial ratings leader Fox News among the coveted 25 to 54 viewer category. It was the first time Ms. Maddow, the network’s star host, had won a ratings week in more than a year; the momentum continued last week, though final numbers are not available.

    The network started featuring the story in early December, when Ms. Maddow introduced what she called a tale “just too crazy to believe.” Her colleagues joined her, and, once damning emails from Mr. Christie’s aides became public, they were ready to pounce: Lawrence O’Donnell created a hypothetical campaign commercial that could be used to skewer Mr. Christie over the matter. “You can do this at home” he declared, seemingly urging Christie foes to attack the governor. “It’s easy.”
    more from Rachel
    “The question of why matters,” Maddow said. “Governor Christie’s office has tried to shame people for asking what the reason might plausibly have been. But they have offered zero explanation of their own.”
    <snip>
    “Yes, it is pure speculation,” Maddow acknowledged. “It has always been presented as such by us, and by me. We presented that theory as a way to get at the most important and, as yet, totally unexplained question still at the center of this unfolding scandal which is, Why? What is the plausible explanation for this? Why did whoever ordered those lanes closed order those lanes closed?”

    and if you hold to an irrational hatred of a very intelligent person, you can always read NewsMax - Poll: Most New Jersey Voters Believe Christie Knew About Lane Closures, Should Resign if Proven
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    A rather common tactic used in today's world - When you are doing wrong, accuse the opposition of doing that of which you are actually the guilty one(s)
    Oh, so you are saying that the progressive manufactured story of a traffic jam, is actually the type of corruption that exists on a larger scale in DC....I agree.

    from the NYTimes linked page

    It appears to be playing well with viewers: For the week of Jan. 6, when the story began to gain national attention, Rachel Maddow, who had pursued the story for more than a month, scored a rare weekly win, beating the perennial ratings leader Fox News among the coveted 25 to 54 viewer category. It was the first time Ms. Maddow, the network’s star host, had won a ratings week in more than a year; the momentum continued last week, though final numbers are not available.

    The network started featuring the story in early December, when Ms. Maddow introduced what she called a tale “just too crazy to believe.” Her colleagues joined her, and, once damning emails from Mr. Christie’s aides became public, they were ready to pounce: Lawrence O’Donnell created a hypothetical campaign commercial that could be used to skewer Mr. Christie over the matter. “You can do this at home” he declared, seemingly urging Christie foes to attack the governor. “It’s easy.”
    more from Rachel
    “The question of why matters,” Maddow said. “Governor Christie’s office has tried to shame people for asking what the reason might plausibly have been. But they have offered zero explanation of their own.”
    <snip>
    “Yes, it is pure speculation,” Maddow acknowledged. “It has always been presented as such by us, and by me. We presented that theory as a way to get at the most important and, as yet, totally unexplained question still at the center of this unfolding scandal which is, Why? What is the plausible explanation for this? Why did whoever ordered those lanes closed order those lanes closed?”

    and if you hold to an irrational hatred of a very intelligent person, you can always read NewsMax - Poll: Most New Jersey Voters Believe Christie Knew About Lane Closures, Should Resign if Proven
    Where was Maddow on any of the scandals in the Obama administration? Oh, that's right, she was furthering the WH narrative that there was nothing there...Yet with Christie, it is just shocking scandal.... Please.

    As for the NewsMax reporting of a Rasmussen poll, I find nothing shocking there...NJ is a blue state, with rough and tumble politics that is routine there. That many of its residents believe Maddow as much as you do is nothing buy expected, after all even if they voted for him, liberals voting for a republican Gov. are not known for their unwavering support.
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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh, so you are saying that the progressive manufactured story of a traffic jam, is actually the type of corruption that exists on a larger scale in DC....I agree.



    Where was Maddow on any of the scandals in the Obama administration? Oh, that's right, she was furthering the WH narrative that there was nothing there...Yet with Christie, it is just shocking scandal.... Please.

    As for the NewsMax reporting of a Rasmussen poll, I find nothing shocking there...NJ is a blue state, with rough and tumble politics that is routine there. That many of its residents believe Maddow as much as you do is nothing buy expected, after all even if they voted for him, liberals voting for a republican Gov. are not known for their unwavering support.
    The bottom line is that there is clear evidence of widespread corruption in New Jersey. Lanes were closed to make a political statement without any defensible justification to the public good. It's a clear abuse of power. It is also clear that either the Mayor of Hoboken is lying under oath, or the lieutenant governor is. And quite frankly, it is difficult to believe that Mayor Zimmer would act as she had, if she did not believe what she says. I mean, her "diary" looks like it was written by a 6 year old. If she was going to fake a diary, you'd think she'd make it look nicer. Also, her political career is finished unless people go to jail for her accusations. She has to believe that people in the Christie Administration are corrupt, and that the investigators will find proof.

    We all know that New Jersey has a long history of bipartisan corruption. D's and R's are both partisans of $'s and ¢'s. Christie may be complicit, he may not be. If he is involved, it doesn't make him the most corrupt NJ Governor in modern history; it just makes him bad at being corrupt. He might also be relatively innocent. In any case, investigations need to continue.

    Rod Blagojevich was a corrupt Democratic Governor, and now he's in jail. And of course there are other corrupt officials of both parties across the US. That shouldn't excuse the Christie administration.

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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    If I had to guess, I'd say that the usual party players will diminish seriousness of any sort of "scandal" being attached to this, but only in guarded ways, largely because of how divisive political climate is today. Most will caveat their support with "If he's telling the truth", because outright support will turn out to be used against them by liberals if it turns out that Christie knew. But as scandals go this one is weak, and liberals are inflating it to pre emptively take out the one GOP hopeful that has already polled to beat Hillary.

    Also, I'll just say that because liberals hammered repubs so hard during the Bush years, then promised to change the way things are done in DC, when all we got is ramped up corruption, and when questioned, usually a reply of 'sit down and shut up' by liberals who just ram through like a bull in a china shop, and
    then say if you don't like TFB!
    To be accurate, they said TFB, WE WON

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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    The bottom line is that there is clear evidence of widespread corruption in New Jersey. Lanes were closed to make a political statement without any defensible justification to the public good. It's a clear abuse of power. It is also clear that either the Mayor of Hoboken is lying under oath, or the lieutenant governor is.
    First off, I am going to take the usual democrat party line when things like this happen...Investigations are under way, and it is premature to reach conclusions. People were fired, and the Governor has stated publicly that he had no knowledge of the situation. As for the Mayor of Hoboken, she made statements earlier that political considerations had nothing to do with Sandy funds, now she changes her tune when the political situation presents itself...Convenient wouldn't you say?

    And quite frankly, it is difficult to believe that Mayor Zimmer would act as she had, if she did not believe what she says. I mean, her "diary" looks like it was written by a 6 year old. If she was going to fake a diary, you'd think she'd make it look nicer.
    Why? Because that's what you'd do? You'll take a Mayor that has changed her position completely for political expediency, yet you are skeptical of the Governor in all of this....Hmmmmm....Partisan politics? I don't know.

    Also, her political career is finished unless people go to jail for her accusations. She has to believe that people in the Christie Administration are corrupt, and that the investigators will find proof.
    Who cares what she believes? She's one Mayor out of what 60 plus?

    We all know that New Jersey has a long history of bipartisan corruption. D's and R's are both partisans of $'s and ¢'s. Christie may be complicit, he may not be. If he is involved, it doesn't make him the most corrupt NJ Governor in modern history; it just makes him bad at being corrupt. He might also be relatively innocent. In any case, investigations need to continue.
    You have to prove it first...Unless you are a person that believes what is said based on party affiliation.

    Rod Blagojevich was a corrupt Democratic Governor, and now he's in jail. And of course there are other corrupt officials of both parties across the US. That shouldn't excuse the Christie administration.
    Who said it should? You have me confused with a Christie supporter.
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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by bubbabgone View Post
    To be accurate, they said TFB, WE WON
    True, I hope they remember when we win.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: For Christie and MSNBC, a Messy Divorce Plays Out in Public View

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    First off, I am going to take the usual democrat party line when things like this happen...Investigations are under way, and it is premature to reach conclusions. People were fired, and the Governor has stated publicly that he had no knowledge of the situation. As for the Mayor of Hoboken, she made statements earlier that political considerations had nothing to do with Sandy funds, now she changes her tune when the political situation presents itself...Convenient wouldn't you say?

    Why? Because that's what you'd do? You'll take a Mayor that has changed her position completely for political expediency, yet you are skeptical of the Governor in all of this....Hmmmmm....Partisan politics? I don't know.

    Who cares what she believes? She's one Mayor out of what 60 plus?

    You have to prove it first...Unless you are a person that believes what is said based on party affiliation.

    Who said it should? You have me confused with a Christie supporter.
    I really don't get the poo pooing of this scandal. This is exactly why Conservatives don't like big government and insist on transparency. It shouldn't matter who's in charge. A few points:

    First, I'd hesitate to say that the mayor changed her position. She acted exactly like someone who was being shaken down. It's not surprising that she would publicly support an administration who was willing to play hardball with funding; only coming forward when she feels safe to do so.

    Second, how can you discount what she says? She's a mayor of 50,000 people. It's difficult to see how a sane person would lie to the feds under these circumstances. If she's lying, she'll face criminal charges and jail time without any real political gain.

    Third, there's more than just smoke here. There's a pretty visible fire as well. We have clear and compelling evidence of widespread corruption in a state that is known for widespread corruption.

    Fourth, notice none of the above contains the words Christie or Republican. There's no reason why Conservatives should be defending Christie any more than deferring judgement until after the investigations are complete. And for the record, I'd be shocked if some D's don't go down as well.

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