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Thread: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Sure, when you have something more than un named sources.
    My two questions have nothing to do with that. Are you going to answer them, or not?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    No, it's propaganda. pure and simple. Period.
    October 31, 2001: A number of whistleblowers reveal the extent of the NSA’s surveillance of the communications of U.S. citizens. The aforementioned William Binney and J. Kirk Wiebe resign from the Agency because they believe that a component of Thin Thread (which they developed) has been used to illegally spy on Americans' private communications. Moreover, Binney and Wiebe contend that if Thin Thread had been utilized properly, it could have detected the 9/11 plot in its planning phase and thus could have prevented the attacks.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    May 2006: The NSA begins violating the rules governing telephone-record surveillance by collecting metadata on millions of calls that are made to (or from) a select list of nearly 4,000 phone numbers whose owners -- some of whom are based in the United States -- clearly have no terrorist ties. This abuse will continue until January 24, 2009, by which time the list of improperly monitored phone numbers has grown to about 16,000. Moreover, the abuse will not be publicly exposed until September 10, 2013.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    On January 17, 2006, the Center for Constitutional Rights filed a lawsuit, CCR v. Bush, against the George W. Bush Presidency. The lawsuit challenged the National Security Agency's (NSA's) surveillance of people within the U.S., including the interception of CCR emails without securing a warrant first.[179][180]
    In September 2008, the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) filed a class action lawsuit against the NSA and several high-ranking officials of the Bush administration,[181] charging an "illegal and unconstitutional program of dragnet communications surveillance,"[182] based on documentation provided by former AT&T technician Mark Klein.[183]
    AT&T Internet monitoring[edit]
    Further information: Hepting v. AT&T, Jewel v. NSA, Mark Klein, NSA warrantless surveillance controversy
    In May 2006, Mark Klein, a former AT&T employee, alleged that his company had cooperated with NSA in installing Narus hardware to replace the FBI Carnivore program, to monitor network communications including traffic between American citizens.[184]


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Security_Agency
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Everything in those three posts transpired during the Bush administration.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Liberal Obama supporters always ask the question about what would like Obama to do? Well, when he comes out like this, threatening to just go around congress, and make law himself void of the legislative process, then it is no longer the country I recognize...I guess Podesta is already making his presence felt.

    It is no wonder we think Obama is dangerous, because HE IS!

    We have a process in this country to do these things Obama wants to do, and it certainly is not unilaterally. We don't have a King, we don't have a dictator, what we have in Obama may actually be worse.
    I don't think that's what the President is saying.

    People forget that federal executive departments are given a lot of discretion to deal with issues that come up. It's written into the laws that authorize them. They don't make law, they write rules and regulations, and the President has considerable input in that process. For example, it wasn't Congress who told the EPA to regulate CO2. The EPA decided that regulation of CO2 is part of their legal mandate to protect air quality. This, in effect, gave them the legal authority to regulate the whole fossil fuel industry, and so they are in the process of shutting down coal burning plants. None of that was spelled out in the law, but the way the law was implemented gave them the power to do things not foreseen by the legislators who wrote the law.

    The executive, judicial and legislative branches of government are bound by the checks and balances of the Constitution. But those checks and balances have no effect on executive departments that have grown so large and control so much. The constitutional government just fades into the background and the executive branch runs everything.

    But I digress. The point is that yes, the President has a lot of power that can be exercised as a result of the sheer size and complexity of the executive branch and the discretion and independence built into it. It gives him a lot of levers. He need write no new laws.

    This extends to the debate about the ACA, too. Many have been concerned about the way the President has changed details of implementation to address problems that have come up. The law does not authorize him to make those changes, they say. He’s breaking the law, they say. But I'm not sure that the President doesn't have the authority to do those things since such legislation often authorizes an agency to "do what is necessary" to implement broad goals. There are many, many such clauses in the ACA.

    The bottom line is this: A government with the power to do so many things tends toward oligarchic authoritarianism. If we end up in that waste basket, or that ash heap of history, with the old USSR then it’s our own fault.

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes, news that doesn't affirm your belief system is propaganda. I get that. But that has nothing to do with the facts.

    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    My two questions have nothing to do with that. Are you going to answer them, or not?
    Sorry, I've forgotten them....What were they again?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Translation. You got nothing.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Obama On Executive Actions: ‘I’ve Got A Pen And I’ve Got A Phone’

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Translation. You got nothing.
    Nothing for what? Your silliness? Right...
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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