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Thread: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency declared

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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Yes, it is remarkable that a State and its people would want to fully benefit from a natural resource they have within their borders. Perhaps it would be better to close down the mines and all ancillary industry/business and put the entire State of West Virginia on the dole.
    Reductio ad absurdum. Otherwise known as lazy, dishonest debating.
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Pay attention to the shell game that is going on here.

    Freedom Industries is the name of the org that is responsible for the spill. Now check out this slick move...

    On Thursday, a source close to Freedom Industries, who asked to remain anonymous because of pending lawsuits, told The Charleston Gazette that Chemstream Holdings is owned by J. Clifford Forrest of Kittanning, Pa.

    Forrest is listed as "manager" of Freedom affiliates Etowah River Terminal and Poca Blending in a merger filing from Dec. 31, 2013.

    About an hour after its bankruptcy filing, Freedom filed an emergency motion for what's called "debtor-in-possession," or DIP, financing, which would allow it to secure up to a $5 million loan to continue to function in some capacity. The loan would, according to the filing, "provide additional liquidity to [Freedom] in order to allow it to continue as a going concern."

    The lender in a debtor-in-possession case generally gets first priority when it comes time for the debtor, in this case Freedom, to pay money back.

    "Under the bankruptcy code, when there is DIP financing from a DIP lender, 99 percent of the time, they get priority over all the other creditors," said Bob Simon, a prominent bankruptcy lawyer with the Pittsburgh firm Reed Smith. "You're putting your money in at risk, and the debtor is not going to have a lot of options, so the bankruptcy clerk permits the DIP lender to get priority over all the other lenders."

    Freedom's proposed lender is a company called WV Funding LLC. That company does not exist in West Virginia, according to business records on file with the West Virginia secretary of state. Pennsylvania's secretary of state also has no records online for it.

    The DIP agreement has places to sign for Freedom Industries and for WV Funding "by Mountaineer Funding LLC."

    Mountaineer Funding was incorporated with the West Virginia secretary of state on Friday. Its one listed member is J. Clifford Forrest, Freedom Industries' owner.

    link...

    This looks like Freedom Industries was invented as a company to dump all of the debt of other companies into it and to deflect fault for the spill and sacrifice it with a bankruptcy as a front/cover for the companies really involved.
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Any bets on whether the owners of Freedom Industries will pay for the spill in any way whatsoever?

    It seems the misnamed industry declared bankruptcy in order to avoid paying the lawsuits and cleanup, which would be a lot more than the five million mentioned above anyway, and then was sold to the same people who owned it to begin with.

    That's right, the owners of the corporation sold it to themselves.

    Forrest, through another firm he owns, paid roughly $20 million to acquire Freedom Industries and orchestrate its Dec. 31 merger with four tiny distribution, blending and storage firms that act as middle men between big chemical and big coal companies, according to a person close to the company but not authorized to speak for it. He added that Forrest just “had the misfortune of buying a plant just before all hell broke loose.”
    and the government of, by, and for the people, including, presumably, the ones who lost their water supplies, the one that did not inspect the facilities for more than two decades, makes all of this sort of thing perfectly legal.

    Cue: Republicans blame Democrats and vice versa.
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Pay attention to the shell game that is going on here.

    Freedom Industries is the name of the org that is responsible for the spill. Now check out this slick move...

    On Thursday, a source close to Freedom Industries, who asked to remain anonymous because of pending lawsuits, told The Charleston Gazette that Chemstream Holdings is owned by J. Clifford Forrest of Kittanning, Pa.

    Forrest is listed as "manager" of Freedom affiliates Etowah River Terminal and Poca Blending in a merger filing from Dec. 31, 2013.

    About an hour after its bankruptcy filing, Freedom filed an emergency motion for what's called "debtor-in-possession," or DIP, financing, which would allow it to secure up to a $5 million loan to continue to function in some capacity. The loan would, according to the filing, "provide additional liquidity to [Freedom] in order to allow it to continue as a going concern."

    The lender in a debtor-in-possession case generally gets first priority when it comes time for the debtor, in this case Freedom, to pay money back.

    "Under the bankruptcy code, when there is DIP financing from a DIP lender, 99 percent of the time, they get priority over all the other creditors," said Bob Simon, a prominent bankruptcy lawyer with the Pittsburgh firm Reed Smith. "You're putting your money in at risk, and the debtor is not going to have a lot of options, so the bankruptcy clerk permits the DIP lender to get priority over all the other lenders."

    Freedom's proposed lender is a company called WV Funding LLC. That company does not exist in West Virginia, according to business records on file with the West Virginia secretary of state. Pennsylvania's secretary of state also has no records online for it.

    The DIP agreement has places to sign for Freedom Industries and for WV Funding "by Mountaineer Funding LLC."

    Mountaineer Funding was incorporated with the West Virginia secretary of state on Friday. Its one listed member is J. Clifford Forrest, Freedom Industries' owner.

    link...

    This looks like Freedom Industries was invented as a company to dump all of the debt of other companies into it and to deflect fault for the spill and sacrifice it with a bankruptcy as a front/cover for the companies really involved.
    Thank you for the details.
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Any bets on whether the owners of Freedom Industries will pay for the spill in any way whatsoever?

    It seems the misnamed industry declared bankruptcy in order to avoid paying the lawsuits and cleanup, which would be a lot more than the five million mentioned above anyway, and then was sold to the same people who owned it to begin with.

    That's right, the owners of the corporation sold it to themselves.



    and the government of, by, and for the people, including, presumably, the ones who lost their water supplies, the one that did not inspect the facilities for more than two decades, makes all of this sort of thing perfectly legal.

    Cue: Republicans blame Democrats and vice versa.
    No doubt.

    Always follow the money.

    Thieves from both parties will have dirty hands on this one.
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    No doubt.

    Always follow the money.

    Thieves from both parties will have dirty hands on this one.
    well someone needs to be held accountable for this.
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Any bets on whether the owners of Freedom Industries will pay for the spill in any way whatsoever?

    It seems the misnamed industry declared bankruptcy in order to avoid paying the lawsuits and cleanup, which would be a lot more than the five million mentioned above anyway, and then was sold to the same people who owned it to begin with.

    That's right, the owners of the corporation sold it to themselves.



    and the government of, by, and for the people, including, presumably, the ones who lost their water supplies, the one that did not inspect the facilities for more than two decades, makes all of this sort of thing perfectly legal.

    Cue: Republicans blame Democrats and vice versa.
    Looks to me like Freedom was invented recently because they knew that there was a spill that was going to get found out and then bankrupt that company so creditors and lawsuits will basically be chasing and targetting a virtual empty phantom company.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    The sad fact is that having a pedophile win is better than having a Democrat in office. I'm all for a solution where a Republican gets in that isn't Moore.

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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    The chemical is NOT lethal (or even harmful) in it's most condensed form...

    I understand these people are worried but they CAN use the water, if they're concerned they can boil it and THEN drink it.

    Of course United States citizens have been conditioned to rely on government - they can't even boil water.
    Go to the link. Boiling the water will not help.

    Geez!

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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Yes, it is remarkable that a State and its people would want to fully benefit from a natural resource they have within their borders. Perhaps it would be better to close down the mines and all ancillary industry/business and put the entire State of West Virginia on the dole.

    I think the people of West Virginia fully expect those corporations that profit in West Virginia to be responsible to the environment, as well as to health and safety concerns. Your implication is that if West Virginians don't want their water poisoned, or environment degraded their only alternative is welfare. This is the same arrogance that allows a chemical storage facility to exist, with virtually no containment, on a hill above the river, just upriver from the drinking water supply of 300,000 people. The people of West Virginia should be outraged at the lack of corporate responsibility, and lax regulation that allowed this to happen. There is a broken trust between industry, and the people that this accident has exposed for all to see, and to imply it should be tolerated because there is no choice denies reason.

    B

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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by orphani View Post
    I think the people of West Virginia fully expect those corporations that profit in West Virginia to be responsible to the environment, as well as to health and safety concerns. Your implication is that if West Virginians don't want their water poisoned, or environment degraded their only alternative is welfare. This is the same arrogance that allows a chemical storage facility to exist, with virtually no containment, on a hill above the river, just upriver from the drinking water supply of 300,000 people. The people of West Virginia should be outraged at the lack of corporate responsibility, and lax regulation that allowed this to happen. There is a broken trust between industry, and the people that this accident has exposed for all to see, and to imply it should be tolerated because there is no choice denies reason.

    B
    No - I won't speak for you, so perhaps you won't speak for me. I not once said that the people of West Virginia don't want responsible businesses exploiting their resources for the benefit of the state's citizens. I fully expect that the good people of West Virginia will do whatever is necessary to have those responsible for this disaster bring full restitution to the state and as well, if proven, pay for any criminal activity involved. It's as it should be.

    My comments were directed at those who seem to think that the only alternative to "water poisoned, or environment degraded" is to eliminate all business activity that may potentially lead to accidents harmful to the environment. The knee-jerk reaction to accidents like this is "blame the mines", "shut down the mines" when in fact the mines had nothing to do with this accident. It's similar to the knee-jerk reaction to an oil pipeline spill to shut down all oil transportation by pipeline when there are far more trains transporting oil now because of blind environmentalists who can't see the forest for the trees.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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