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Thread: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency declared

  1. #101
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by orphani View Post
    You know John, wouldn't it be wonderful if we lived in a world where our best understanding of justice was implemented in the minds of all people. If from every corporate boardroom someone said "well, it may not be the most profit maximizing strategy, but in the long run its the right,and moral thing to do". If that were the case we wouldn't be having this conversation. But that's not the world we live in; in this world we have to fight for the right to have clean water, clean air, and a future for our children that doesn't include a decimated planet. When you take a clear unbiased look at carbon fuels, and what the science is clearly telling us; it says we are robbing our children's futures for short sighted gains. The USA has relinquished its role as a leader in new carbon free technologies to pursue a path in carbon extraction that guarantees a risky future. Just like a child grasping for the cartooned, sugar filled, Cocoa puffs; it will take a wise parent leading them to a healthier diet of; tread lightly on our planet, it's the only one we have.

    When Halliburton kills a recommendation for transparency in West Virginia's state legislature by state EPA to make public the chemicals it pumps into the ground in it's fracking operations, you feel the boot of power on the neck of our Democracy.
    I'll leave it with a statement from Eric Waggoner, a long time West Virginia resident.



    Eric Waggoner
    Chair, English department, West Virginia Wesleyan College



    To hell with every single screwjob elected official and politico under whose watch it all went on, who helped write those lax regulations and then turned away when even those weren't followed. To hell with you all, who were supposed to be stewards of the public interest, and who sold us out for money, for political power. To hell with every one of you who decided that making life convenient for business meant making life dangerous for us. To hell with you for making us the eggs you had to break in order to make breakfast.

    To hell with everyone who ever asked me how I could stand to live in a place like this, so dirty and unhealthy and uneducated. To hell with everyone who ever asked me why people don't just leave, don't just quit (and go to one of the other thousand jobs I suppose you imagine are widely available here), like it never occurred to us, like if only we dumb hilljacks would listen as you explained the safety hazards, we'd all suddenly recognize something that hadn't been on our radar until now.

    To hell with the superior attitude one so often encounters in these conversations, and usually from people who have no idea about the complexity and the long history at work in it. To hell with the person I met during my PhD work who, within ten seconds of finding out I was from West Virginia, congratulated me on being able to read. (Stranger, wherever you are today, please know this: Standing in that room full of people, three feet away from you while you smiled at your joke, I very nearly lost control over every civil checkpoint in my body. And though civility was plainly not your native tongue, I did what we have done for generations where I come from, when faced with rude stupidity: I tamped down my first response, and I managed to restrain myself from behaving in a way that would have required a deep cleaning and medical sterilization of the carpet. I did not do any of the things I wanted to. But stranger, please know how badly I wanted to do them.)

    And, as long as I'm roundhouse damning everyone, and since my own relatives worked in the coal mines and I can therefore play the Family Card, the one that trumps everything around here: To hell with all of my fellow West Virginians who bought so deeply into the idea of avoidable personal risk and constant sacrifice as an honorable condition under which to live, that they turned that condition into a culture of perverted, twisted pride and self-righteousness, to be celebrated and defended against outsiders. To hell with that insular, xenophobic pathology. To hell with everyone whose only take-away from every story about every explosion, every leak, every mine collapse, is some vague and idiotic vanity in the continued endurance of West Virginians under adverse, sometimes killing circumstances. To hell with everyone everywhere who ever mistook suffering for honor, and who ever taught that to their kids. There's nothing honorable about suffering. Nothing.

    To hell with you. This is the one moment in my adult life when I have wished I could still believe in Hell as an actual, physical reality, so that I could imagine you in it.
    Thanks for sharing that - it's well said.

    It helps strengthen my view that we need politicians and governments that work more towards what is in the public interest as opposed to what is in their personal, political, interests. It may be idealistic, but so be it.

    I'm not big on government in the lives of individuals, but I have no problem with government as a gatekeeper of what is acceptible business practice and the safe exploitation of resources for the benefit of citizens.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  2. #102
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Thanks for sharing that - it's well said.

    It helps strengthen my view that we need politicians and governments that work more towards what is in the public interest as opposed to what is in their personal, political, interests. It may be idealistic, but so be it.

    I'm not big on government in the lives of individuals, but I have no problem with government as a gatekeeper of what is acceptible business practice and the
    safe exploitation of resources for the benefit of citizens.
    John, you're standing with a sound footing.
    I would like to add that governments, and politicians will only be responsive to its citizens when they participate within the political process with a keen, educated eye toward the policies being advanced, and the issues they represent. We can achieve a balance between a clean environment, and a strong economy, but not if special interest money buys our political system, and perverts the Democratic process to exclude the voices of our people. This is the heart of our current struggle, whether a small group of plutocrats are going to dictate policy or whether the people take back their Democratic power. I am not opposed to intelligent use of resources, as we agree upon; I am opposed to careless disregard of sensible policies regarding impact mitigation, and public health precautions. Why should I not be allowed to know what a company is pumping into the ground? If you refuse to tell me than I don't want you pumping it in. It's that simple. Is that asking too much? Is it asking too much for chemical companies to know the impact of chemicals they unleash in our water supply? They don't think so. I do. And that's not going to change until political power is restored to the people

    Government must exist to serve all the people with equal justice. Government is merely a tool of the people to achieve our national priorities when it works properly. It's broken- a republic sir, if we can get it back.

    Barry
    Last edited by orphani; 01-21-14 at 03:24 PM.

  3. #103
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    From Somerville's link above:
    EDMONTON - Some Peace River area doctors are afraid to speak out about health impacts of oil and gas activity and in some cases have declined to treat area residents who wondered if their health problems were related to emissions, says one of two independent health experts hired by the Alberta Energy Regulator.
    So, it is happening right here in the USA as well?

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  4. #104
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by orphani View Post
    John, you're standing with a sound footing.
    I would like to add that governments, and politicians will only be responsive to its citizens when they participate within the political process with a keen, educated eye toward the policies being advanced, and the issues they represent. We can achieve a balance between a clean environment, and a strong economy, but not if special interest money buys our political system, and perverts the Democratic process to exclude the voices of our people. This is the heart of our current struggle, whether a small group of plutocrats are going to dictate policy or whether the people take back their Democratic power. I am not opposed to intelligent use of resources, as we agree upon; I am opposed to careless disregard of sensible policies regarding impact mitigation, and public health precautions. Why should I not be allowed to know what a company is pumping into the ground? If you refuse to tell me than I don't want you pumping it in. It's that simple. Is that asking too much? Is it asking too much for chemical companies to know the impact of chemicals they unleash in our water supply? They don't think so. I do. And that's not going to change until political power is restored to the people

    Government must exist to serve all the people with equal justice. Government is merely a tool of the people to achieve our national priorities when it works properly. It's broken- a republic sir, if we can get it back.

    Barry
    In the case outlined in this OP, the simple question has to be why did the jurisdiction give a building and operations permit to this chemical facility allowing them to locate upstream on a waterway that supplies drinking water to 300,000 people? That's the kind of idiotic lack of government oversight and common sense I'm speaking of.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  5. #105
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    In the case outlined in this OP, the simple question has to be why did the jurisdiction give a building and operations permit to this chemical facility allowing them to locate upstream on a waterway that supplies drinking water to 300,000 people? That's the kind of idiotic lack of government oversight and common sense I'm speaking of.
    I wonder what the odds are that someone highly placed in the jurisdiction in question owned the property in question?

    Greetings, CJ.

  6. #106
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    I wonder what the odds are that someone highly placed in the jurisdiction in question owned the property in question?

    Greetings, CJ.
    Good afternoon Lady P.

    I hadn't thought of that and I'm usually far more cynical than you!! You could be right.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    How about the vapors from a hot shower or tub ?
    there are none, don't let programming interfere with critical thought

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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Chemistry
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketman View Post
    there are none, don't let programming interfere with critical thought
    Physics is Phun

  9. #109
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    Re: West Virginia chemical spill cuts water to up to 300,000, state of emergency decl

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Good afternoon Lady P.

    I hadn't thought of that and I'm usually far more cynical than you!! You could be right.
    Beware of cynicism. It can lead you astray as much as 5% of the time.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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