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Thread: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Political agenda? Other than the fact everything is political, isn't this the case if whose rights are we talking about? The employer or the employee? This seems like the crux of the issue to me.
    Since when is a specific kind of health insurance a right?
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    Since when is a specific kind of health insurance a right?
    To use an absolutely terrible analogy, if you don't like consuming a small dog every week, but were required to do so by the terms of your health care plan, would you want that health care plan?
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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    Since when is a specific kind of health insurance a right?
    When it's mine to use. When they pay me a salary, the money is mine and not theirs. When they provide insurance as part if MY compensation it is mine and not THEIRS. It is my right to use want us mine as I see fit.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I'm not suggesting they be exempt from the law, just that they be exempt from having to purchase insurance that provides a service they disagree with religiously.

    Although I suppose that is partially exempt from the law.

    If this goes to court, it'll be interesting to see where the arguments go.
    Yes, that is being exempt from the law because you're part of one religion and not another. Would you be alright with a Wiccan employer making their employees work on Easter? It's not their religion to celebrate that day. At what point are you forcing the religion of the employer on the employee? The employer having any say in what kind of insurance the employee gets is definitely forcing one person's religion on the other. Meanwhile, putting money into a pot, some of which pays for things you don't like, but that you aren't personally engaged with, is not.
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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    When it's mine to use. When they pay me a salary, the money is mine and not theirs. When they provide insurance as part if MY compensation it is mine and not THEIRS. It is my right to use want us mine as I see fit.
    What if the employee doesn't even want health insurance? According to your logic, all compensation should be monetary, so the employee could use it for whatever they choose.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    The article is very unclear as to what the actual issue is here. According to the Justice Dept, the Little Sisters are not required to purchase insurance that covers contraception, etc. But the LS's are saying that they do, which seems to be contrary to both what the Justice Dept is saying and what the law says (is ACA does exempt religious orgs like LS from having to purchase insurance that covers contraception, etc)

    The Obama administration had argued that the Little Sisters of the Poor could opt out of the contraceptive coverage requirement by completing “a self-certification form” and providing it to the entity that administers their health benefits. Therefore, the Justice Department said, the contraceptive mandate imposes “no substantial burden on their exercise of religion.”

    “To opt out of providing contraceptive coverage, Little Sisters need only certify that they are nonprofit organizations that hold themselves out as religious and that, because of religious objections, they are opposed to providing coverage for some or all contraceptive services,” the Justice Department told the appeals court on Monday.

    The administration says it has exempted churches from the contraceptive coverage requirement and offered an accommodation to certain religious nonprofit groups. But the Becket Fund argued that “the ‘accommodation’ still forces the Little Sisters to find an insurer who will cover sterilization, contraceptive and abortion-inducing drugs and devices.

    “The Sisters would also be required to sign a form that triggers the start of that coverage,” it said. “In good conscience, they cannot do that. So the ‘accommodation’ still violates their religious beliefs.”
    It sounds as if their complaint is that filling out a form stating that they will not provide coverage for contraception etc because they are a religious org is somehow???? a sin.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    What if the employee doesn't even want health insurance? According to your logic, all compensation should be monetary, so the employee could use it for whatever they choose.
    That's actually not what I said. I said insurance is compensation, and as such belongs to the employee.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Yes, that is being exempt from the law because you're part of one religion and not another. Would you be alright with a Wiccan employer making their employees work on Easter? It's not their religion to celebrate that day. At what point are you forcing the religion of the employer on the employee? The employer having any say in what kind of insurance the employee gets is definitely forcing one person's religion on the other. Meanwhile, putting money into a pot, some of which pays for things you don't like, but that you aren't personally engaged with, is not.
    Yet, as I understand it, an employer doing the "forcing" (not really, since working for them is voluntary) is not unconstitutional, but the government doing any forcing IS unconstitutional.
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    Re: Justice Blocks Contraception Mandate on Insurance in Suit by Nuns

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    That's actually not what I said. I said insurance is compensation, and as such belongs to the employee.
    and how is that related to this topic?
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

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