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Thread: India-US diplomat row escalates.

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    India-US diplomat row escalates.

    BBC News - Devyani Khobragade: India-US diplomat row escalates


    India has ordered a series of reprisals against the United States amid a worsening row over the arrest of one of its diplomats in New York.

    Security barricades around the US embassy in Delhi have been removed and a visiting US delegation was snubbed



    Should be interesting to see how this plays out, I do have to question India's descion to remove the barricades around the US embassy. I hope they can protect the embassy because if its attacked during this time they will have a lot to answer for.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    I do have to question India's decision to remove the barricades around the US embassy.
    I do too.

    We should sink their entire navy.

    Other than that, this whole story is tragically comedic.

    You get the impression from following it that India actually care about women and that the United States actually cares about illegal immigration.

    In the end, I figure Obama will buckle and grant her full diplomatic immunity. Because she's brown and because she's a woman. If it were a while German guy he'd be going to jail. But once she's granted immunity she'll be invited to leave the country and never return.
    “Now it is not good for the Christian’s health to hustle the Aryan brown,
    For the Christian riles, and the Aryan smiles and he weareth the Christian down;
    And the end of the fight is a tombstone white with the name of the late deceased,
    And the epitaph drear: “A Fool lies here who tried to hustle the East.”

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Be aware of any spontaneous riots!


    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    BBC News - Devyani Khobragade: India-US diplomat row escalates


    India has ordered a series of reprisals against the United States amid a worsening row over the arrest of one of its diplomats in New York.

    Security barricades around the US embassy in Delhi have been removed and a visiting US delegation was snubbed



    Should be interesting to see how this plays out, I do have to question India's descion to remove the barricades around the US embassy. I hope they can protect the embassy because if its attacked during this time they will have a lot to answer for.

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    BBC News - Devyani Khobragade: India-US diplomat row escalates


    India has ordered a series of reprisals against the United States amid a worsening row over the arrest of one of its diplomats in New York.

    Security barricades around the US embassy in Delhi have been removed and a visiting US delegation was snubbed



    Should be interesting to see how this plays out, I do have to question India's descion to remove the barricades around the US embassy. I hope they can protect the embassy because if its attacked during this time they will have a lot to answer for.
    This is not the first case where there has been tit-for-tat with regard to treatment of diplomats and it most definitely won't be the last one. India's rationale is that the U.S. essentially denied the Indian diplomat the protections accorded her by her diplomatic status and it is responding in kind. Usually, such measures (aside from expulsions) are not permanent. So in time, U.S. diplomats would very likely have their priveleges restored.

    The actual case is more complex.

    First, did her treatment violate the norms of what would be permissible given her diplomatic status (and there is some question as to whether she enjoyed full or limited immunity)?

    Second, for a suspected visa-related issue, was a cavity search even appropriate?

    Third, was the issue one about wages vs. compensation; if, for example, one was dealing with a low wage, but other compensation (partial or full housing allowance, food allowance, etc.), one would be dealing with compensation that exceeded the minimum wage. How in kind compensation is treated could matter.

    I don't know anything more than was reported, so I reserve judgment about the allegations and treatment. The one thing I will note is that arresting her in front of her daughter was not good timing and if she is ultimately not convicted--expulsion not conviction might be the appropriate measure depending on the outcome of the case and her diplomatic privileges--she might have a basis to proceed with legal action of her own.

    In the end, dealing with diplomats is always a sensitive issue. Any perceived mistreatment (whether actual or not) almost always leads to some form of retaliation. I believe that this case could have been handled far better at a bilateral level between the U.S. and Indian governments rather than how it was handled.

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    BBC News - Devyani Khobragade: India-US diplomat row escalates


    India has ordered a series of reprisals against the United States amid a worsening row over the arrest of one of its diplomats in New York.

    Security barricades around the US embassy in Delhi have been removed and a visiting US delegation was snubbed



    Should be interesting to see how this plays out, I do have to question India's descion to remove the barricades around the US embassy. I hope they can protect the embassy because if its attacked during this time they will have a lot to answer for.
    I agree. India may well have agreements with the US that require such situations to be handled differently. And it really makes no sense whatsoever for India to get so pissy, if indeed what the US spokesperson has said is true. But removing protections from our embassy is the response?!?!?!

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    This is not the first case where there has been tit-for-tat with regard to treatment of diplomats and it most definitely won't be the last one. India's rationale is that the U.S. essentially denied the Indian diplomat the protections accorded her by her diplomatic status and it is responding in kind. Usually, such measures (aside from expulsions) are not permanent. So in time, U.S. diplomats would very likely have their priveleges restored.

    The actual case is more complex.

    First, did her treatment violate the norms of what would be permissible given her diplomatic status (and there is some question as to whether she enjoyed full or limited immunity)?

    Second, for a suspected visa-related issue, was a cavity search even appropriate?

    Third, was the issue one about wages vs. compensation; if, for example, one was dealing with a low wage, but other compensation (partial or full housing allowance, food allowance, etc.), one would be dealing with compensation that exceeded the minimum wage. How in kind compensation is treated could matter.

    I don't know anything more than was reported, so I reserve judgment about the allegations and treatment. The one thing I will note is that arresting her in front of her daughter was not good timing and if she is ultimately not convicted--expulsion not conviction might be the appropriate measure depending on the outcome of the case and her diplomatic privileges--she might have a basis to proceed with legal action of her own.

    In the end, dealing with diplomats is always a sensitive issue. Any perceived mistreatment (whether actual or not) almost always leads to some form of retaliation. I believe that this case could have been handled far better at a bilateral level between the U.S. and Indian governments rather than how it was handled.
    What's the better political position for the US (because we know truth doesn't trump anything) for the US to acknowledge that arresting officers were inappropriate to perform a cavity search, apologize and try to move on, or insist that all foreign diplomats on her level would receive the same treatment in such situations?

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    What's the better political position for the US (because we know truth doesn't trump anything) for the US to acknowledge that arresting officers were inappropriate to perform a cavity search, apologize and try to move on, or insist that all foreign diplomats on her level would receive the same treatment in such situations?
    If the visa fraud allegations are the sole basis for her being charged, a cavity search should not have been performed. Such a search was inconsistent with the allegations at hand and not germane to the legal issues involved. We don't know if those allegations are accurate, as the individual who made the claim has since "disappeared" according to some news sources and we don't know if payments were made in cash or by some method that could substantiate them.

    IMO, the better procedure would have been:

    1. Notify the Indian government of the allegations.
    2. Ask the Indian government to withdraw her or allow her to be charged. The latter would essentially be a request for a waiver of immunity under the Vienna Convention.
    3. If a waiver were granted, proceed with a legal case by asking her to appear in court.

    This case was handled badly. I'm not at all surprised by the retaliation that has occurred. Indeed, given some of high profile abuses of women that have occurred in India (gang rapes, etc.), the Indian government had to act decisively when one of its women was allegedly mistreated. In other words, there was a 100% probability of retaliation and a fairly high probability that the retaliation would be more than proportionate.

    To avoid further damage, the U.S. should terminate the case and ask her to leave the country. India would almost certainly respond by expelling a U.S. diplomat at her level (or several lower-ranking ones). However, that would be the end of the matter.

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Quote Originally Posted by soot View Post
    I do too.

    We should sink their entire navy.

    Other than that, this whole story is tragically comedic.

    You get the impression from following it that India actually care about women and that the United States actually cares about illegal immigration.

    In the end, I figure Obama will buckle and grant her full diplomatic immunity. Because she's brown and because she's a woman. If it were a while German guy he'd be going to jail. But once she's granted immunity she'll be invited to leave the country and never return.
    Nothing funny about removing security barriers from our embassy.

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    From today's edition of The Washington Post concerning the Indian diplomat in question:

    Her relationship with the babysitter, Sangeeta Richard, had been troubled almost from the time Richard arrived in the United States to begin working for her as Khobragade started her new job as deputy consul general for political, economic, commercial and women’s affairs at the consulate general in New York in November 2012. Khobragade’s father, Uttam, said the babysitter tried to extort money from her employer — now the subject of a pending case in the Delhi High Court — and disappeared completely in June.

    India says it will transfer deputy consul at center of crisis over strip-search arrest - The Washington Post

    And from the Indian media:

    ...India has accused US authorities of conspiracy and immigration fraud by allowing the family of Sangeeta Richard, the domestic help of Indian diplomat Devyani Khobragade, to move to America.

    Devyani Khobragade arrest row: India accuses US of immigration fraud | NDTV.com

    Right now, what is known is that the U.S. handling of what may be a highly complex case has sparked a diplomatic dispute. However, at this point in time, there are only allegations concerning the legal cases. The facts remain to be examined.

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    Re: India-US diplomat row escalates.

    Apparently we're doing a good job of pissing off the World lately.

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