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Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647]

Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

Then your teacher was an ignorant boob. The right to discriminate is a natural consequence of the right to control access to your property.

Pretty sure he is saying that no "natural rights" exist in with any legal standing...
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

1.) Then simply stop selling all wedding cakes.
2.) I am not exactly sure what makes a cake into a wedding cake. Is it the number of layers? Placing figurines on top? Writing something on it?

1.) yep this is an alternative that is legal

2.) nothing in reality its a fallacy you wont get a factual answer on
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

Pretty sure he is saying that no "natural rights" exist in with any legal standing...

Well then, he must be another one of those people that believe the government creates his rights. Gosh, I sure hope they don't decide to take them away. I wonder what he will say if they do. Let me guess, that the law says it is so, but it's not so, even if his basis is the law gets to make the rules on what is so. :lamo
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

I can't wait till those who get tired of this happy horse poop rise up and force you to stop your bigotry against people with religious convictions. You say they have the right to pray and preach but you deny them the right to live out their convictions.

1. The religious guy is a bigot and that is ok but those against his bigotry are bigots for not allowing his bigotry and that is... bad?

2. If they have a business open to the public then they have tacitly agreed to abide by anti-discrimination laws.

3. What is it so difficult to comprehend this?
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

So, what about that vast amounts of knowledge you have on natural rights, again? You know, that thing you didn't even know one of the foundations of? Want to talk about how little you know about property rights?

Because you are either missing the point...are ignorant of it...or are just refusing to accept it. There is no right, "natural" or otherwise to open a business and engage in discrimination. I know that you are attempting to reach so higher platitude where people are free to discriminate as they wish...sorry. There was no "natural right" for the bigots in the 50's to refuse service to black customers....and there is no "natural right" for the bigots here to refuse service to gays. I know you wish it were otherwise...but sorry dude....it just isn't so.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

Well then, he must be another one of those people that believe the government creates his rights. Gosh, I sure hope they don't decide to take them away. I wonder what he will say if they do. :lamo

The government protects our rights... and that is pretty clear here. Protecting the rights of the discriminated.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

Yes, it sucks to be a religious bigot in the US in the 21st century

yep im religious and theres no amount of logic that supports such a stupid decision to break the law and to think he had special rights and gets to treat others as a lesser compared to himself.

plan stupidity
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

1. The religious guy is a bigot and that is ok but those against his bigotry are bigots for not allowing his bigotry and that is... bad?

2. If they have a business open to the public then they have tacitly agreed to abide by anti-discrimination laws.

3. What is it so difficult to comprehend this?

Its not difficult to understand at all...unless of course....you really really really really really wish it wasn't so.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

How is enforcing anti-discrimination laws "trampling the religious freedom of others". This baker has the absolute right to pray and preach to his hearts content. He isn't free however to use his religion as a shield to get around the law and promote his/her bigotry.

its simply not and no amount of fantasy will change that
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

Their "right to live out their convictions" ends when they violate the laws.
The people in some states allow gay rights to trump religious freedoms. Gotcha !
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

Pretty sure he is saying that no "natural rights" exist in with any legal standing...

It's a concept that has been co-opted and corrupted for people who cant deal with authority and generally gain any for themselves.

'Naturally' males just killed other males and took and raped women. Stole food and other resources at will. Their own bodies were not 'property,' that is a legal concept. Infringing on the rights of others is a legal concept. You can infringe on the rights of another person and it has nothing to do with their bodies being property. Rights and laws were developed to enable humans to live in groups that optimally successfully produce the most offspring. It was a natural process to do so I suppose...one developed from the instincts of survival.


Edit: It's also often co-opted by the religious fundamentalists....until they bump against the actual science behind 'natural.' lol
 
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Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

I can't wait till those who get tired of this happy horse poop rise up and force you to stop your bigotry against people with religious convictions. You say they have the right to pray and preach but you deny them the right to live out their convictions.

100% false
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

The government protects our rights... and that is pretty clear here. Protecting the rights of the discriminated.

You mean the rights that apparently both of you think they made up. :lamo We call that privileges, not rights.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

The people in some states allow gay rights to trump religious freedoms. Gotcha !

There is no "religious freedom" or "right" to discriminate. I know you folk are trying to use your religion as a shield to violate the law....but you can't do it. Sorry.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

I find it quite hilarious how many so called "religion" advocates are fighting so hard to engage in their discrimination and bigotry. If they spent even 1/2 the energy just trying to be more "Christ-like" or spending time actually studying the teachings of Christ.....they would be much better off.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

The government protects our rights... and that is pretty clear here. Protecting the rights of the discriminated.

I guess it depends on who you think is being discriminated against. Those who have decided that gay rights trump religious freedom means the one who is denied the ability to live out his moral convictions is the one being discriminated against.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

The people in some states allow gay rights to trump religious freedoms. Gotcha !

Why is it trumping? No one says one is more important than the other, just that one must comply with the law. Anti-discrimination laws are the law of the land and every business knows it. Personally, I think most people like the business in this story are being selective in their 'offense,' as I listed a host of other similar....and silly prejudices that a religious business owner could attempt to employ...but (nearly) all CHOOSE NOT TO.

(See post 790)
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

I find it quite hilarious how many so called "religion" advocates are fighting so hard to engage in their discrimination and bigotry. If they spent even 1/2 the energy just trying to be more "Christ-like" or spending time actually studying the teachings of Christ.....they would be much better off.

I think it's pretty hilarious that you guys believe in privileges and yet call them rights. Guess where the term human rights comes from?
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

Then I suppose you wouldn't have a problem if I passed a law giving people a claim to your house or your body. Just so you know, I expect you to provide them services that you have provided other people. I hope you don't feel the need to discriminate.

I am sorry, but I was not aware my body was a business? I was not aware that my house was a business? I do not rent out my body or my house or provide any commercial service. What you suggest is ridiculous because we were talking about businesses and nothing else.

Law doesn't change peoples attitudes towards whatever it is acting on. Forcing someone to comply to something can never dream of changing how people feel towards it. People must decide on their own to change, just like society can only ever hope to change itself. Law can make people comply with the use of threats and force, but it has no ability to change peoples attitudes.

No, sadly laws do not change the attitudes of idiotic bigots. Forcing bigots to not discriminate might not be the ideal situation but allowing them to discriminate with no consequences is even less ideal, to be honest allowing that is almost unthinkable IMHO.

People have to decide for themselves, but if they own a business that sells can bakes cakes then that business does not have the right to deny service or discriminate.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

I think it's pretty hilarious that you guys believe in privileges and yet call them rights. Guess where the term human rights comes from?

You obviously cannot distinguish between them. Then again...somewhere you believe there is a "natural right" to discriminate. I find that absolutely hilarious.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

I find it quite hilarious how many so called "religion" advocates are fighting so hard to engage in their discrimination and bigotry. If they spent even 1/2 the energy just trying to be more "Christ-like" or spending time actually studying the teachings of Christ.....they would be much better off.

Christ was a Jew, he was taught that homosexuality was an abomination to God. Now who is the one being more "Christlike"?
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

I guess it depends on who you think is being discriminated against. Those who have decided that gay rights trump religious freedom means the one who is denied the ability to live out his moral convictions is the one being discriminated against.

100% false and its been proven false every time you say it

if you disagree simple show how dhe isnt allowed lol
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

The people in some states allow gay rights to trump religious freedoms. Gotcha !

Baking a cake is not a religious practice, and not protected by the constitution
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

Christ was a Jew, he was taught that homosexuality was an abomination to God. Now who is the one being more "Christlike"?

Christ taught no such thing....and I venture to say....Jesus Christ would be appalled at the idea of someone using his name to promote bigotry and discrimination. Study the life of Jesus Christ and you will understand why I say that.
 
Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:123]

I am sorry, but I was not aware my body was a business? I was not aware that my house was a business? I do not rent out my body or my house or provide any commercial service. What you suggest is ridiculous because we were talking about businesses and nothing else.

Why couldn't it be? We can make you have to service whoever we wanted. Why don't you accept that? You seemed to accept it for other kinds of property, right? Why is my proposal not fair? We can put it in a contract to practice your rights. What about that? If you don't like it all you have to do is not sign the contract.
 
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