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Thread: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647]

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    Do I even have to spell it out for you? And I thought you gonna leave it? Guess not.
    Fine spell it out

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    What are the bakers contributing? They are getting paid.

    the problem with your argument is that if you use it to defend one group you have to use it to defend ALL groups. Meaning, Winston, if a bakery had owners who were black and refused to bake something for a KKK rally then(following the logic of your argument) you would have to defend the KKK group's right to be served. After all, the bakery is getting PAID, isn't it?

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeTrumps View Post
    the problem with your argument is that if you use it to defend one group you have to use it to defend ALL groups. Meaning, Winston, if a bakery had owners who were black and refused to bake something for a KKK rally then(following the logic of your argument) you would have to defend the KKK group's right to be served. After all, the bakery is getting PAID, isn't it?
    As much as the KK repulses me I do think the bakers should bake the cake within the normal course of business and products offered.

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    As much as the KK repulses me I do think the bakers should bake the cake within the normal course of business and products offered.
    you're just saying that so you don't sink your own argument. If that was a real situation there is no way you would force a black owner to do business with the klan. come on, be honest with yourself for one second.

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeTrumps View Post
    you're just saying that
    No I'm not just saying that

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    then you're misguided.

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    It's getting very tiresome for me to have to repeat myself over and over again to the same old points you kept recycled ad nauseam.

    Bottom line is:

    1. gay couples committing to marriage is a small percentage of the whole gay community and therefore do not represent the whole calss.
    The number of gay couples getting married is irrelevant to the situation at hand. The case is about a single couple.

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    2. Refusal to bake wedding cake for gay couples planning to get married does not constitute discrimination against the whole class of gay people and since the baker was willing to bake any other types of cakes to any gay people including the gay couple in question, it is therefore not a discrimination against gays based on sexual orientation.
    It doesn't have to be discrimination against the whole class of people, it only needs to be discrimination against that couple for the item for sale.

    And you put your finger on the exact point as to why the baker was in violation of Colorado Statute 24-34-601. He was willing to sell any cake to a straight couple or individual but only some cakes to a homosexual couple. That statute indicated that "Full and Equal" services must me provided. He refused to proved the same services.

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    3. The baker's refusal to bake gay wedding cake for gay couples was due to the sole reason of not wanting to be compelled to participate or contribute to any part of the gay lifestyle that runs antithesis to his religious belief. The couples being gay is just incidental.
    There are no exceptions listed under the law as to WHY the discrimination occurred, the discrimination itself is what is against the law. Actually the couple being gay was the core reason the baker wouldn't make the cake. If they weren't gay, he have made the wedding cake.

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    4. Per #2 and #3 above, there is therefore no violation of the state law you cited, which was about discrimination against the whole class of protected class of people and not particular event.
    #1 is irrelevant and #2 & #3 are an incorrect interpretation of the law as demonstrated by multiple states in multiple cases involving essentially the same issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    5. The judge and you are wrong.
    Actually the Judges decision was in line with the law and precident. Under the law the Judge made the right call.

    Now he could have been an activist Judge and disregarded the law, but that is not what judges are supposed to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    That's my opinion. Take it or leave it.
    Well of course your welcome to your opinion. However your opinion does not comport with the law.

    Some people are just not willing to separate what they think the law **should** be from reality.

    Have a good day.


    >>>>

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Fine spell it out
    OK.

    Whether paid or not, it's still contributing to the event.


    For instance, if someone hired you, who is an expert in bomb building, to build a pipe bomb so he could murder someone, by law are you not contributing to the crime of murder? Can you then tell the judge and jury that since it's a transaction where you are getting paid for your service and that you weren't on-site at the murder scene to attend the murder event therefore you are not held accountable for the murder?


    Of course not.


    Same for a christian who believe that he will one day have to answer to God about his contribution to the abomination God spoke about in the Bible that he should have no part thereof.

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldWatcher View Post
    The number of gay couples getting married is irrelevant to the situation at hand. The case is about a single couple.



    It doesn't have to be discrimination against the whole class of people, it only needs to be discrimination against that couple for the item for sale.

    And you put your finger on the exact point as to why the baker was in violation of Colorado Statute 24-34-601. He was willing to sell any cake to a straight couple or individual but only some cakes to a homosexual couple. That statute indicated that "Full and Equal" services must me provided. He refused to proved the same services.



    There are no exceptions listed under the law as to WHY the discrimination occurred, the discrimination itself is what is against the law. Actually the couple being gay was the core reason the baker wouldn't make the cake. If they weren't gay, he have made the wedding cake.



    #1 is irrelevant and #2 & #3 are an incorrect interpretation of the law as demonstrated by multiple states in multiple cases involving essentially the same issue.



    Actually the Judges decision was in line with the law and precident. Under the law the Judge made the right call.

    Now he could have been an activist Judge and disregarded the law, but that is not what judges are supposed to do.



    Well of course your welcome to your opinion. However your opinion does not comport with the law.

    Some people are just not willing to separate what they think the law **should** be from reality.

    Have a good day.


    >>>>
    Yes, it is relevant.

    It shows that the baker was willing to serve the gay people, even those having the gay wedding, just not be compelled against his religious belief to provide something against his religious principle, which by the way is protected by the Constitution.

    When there is a conflict between State or Federal laws versus the Constitution, you should know which one should give way, right?

    And yet in this case, the baker did not discriminate against the whole class of gay people because of their sexual orientation. He simply refused to be forced to contribute to an event which violates his religious principle. As such, the baker did not even violates the State law you cited.

    Now, regarding the judge, he didn't just err in his decision. He violated the baker's Constitutional right to exercise his religious belief as protected by the Constitution when he compelled the baker to bake the wedding cake for the gay wedding.

    I'm not going to read any further of your post just to re-harsh to death the same old same old. What I have just stated above is more than enough to refute your argument on this case. And I'll leave it at that even if you won't.
    Last edited by dolphinocean; 12-13-13 at 06:22 AM.

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    Re: Colorado Judge: Bakery Owner discriminated against gay couple [W:113:123:292:647

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    OK.

    Whether paid or not, it's still contributing to the event.


    For instance, if someone hired you, who is an expert in bomb building, to build a pipe bomb so he could murder someone, by law are you not contributing to the crime of murder? Can you then tell the judge and jury that since it's a transaction where you are getting paid for your service and that you weren't on-site at the murder scene to attend the murder event therefore you are not held accountable for the murder?


    Of course not.


    Same for a christian who believe that he will one day have to answer to God about his contribution to the abomination God spoke about in the Bible that he should have no part thereof.
    Wow....where do you come up with these completely unrelated analogies? Serious dude......

    and BTW if this guy truly WERE a Christian he would exhibit more Christlike behavior. This guy is "Christian" in name only.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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