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Thread: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

  1. #31
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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Is the President digging himself a hole that even his own supporters will refuse to dig him out of? Consider Prof. Jonathan Turley, a liberal law professor that has been a supporter, in his testimony before the Judiciary committee.

    Chairman Goodlatte, Ranking Member Conyers, and members of the Judiciary
    Committee, my name is Jonathan Turley and I am a law professor at George Washington
    University where I hold the J.B. and Maurice C. Shapiro Chair of Public Interest Law. It
    is an honor to appear before you today to discuss the constitutional concerns raised by
    recent nonenforcement polices and the President’s duty to faithfully execute the law of
    the United States.

    The issue before the Committee is clearly a difficult one. It is often difficult to
    separate the merits of the underlying policies from the means used to achieve them. It so
    happens that I agree with many of the goals of the Administration in the various areas
    where the President has circumvented Congress. However, in the Madisonian system, it
    is often more important how you do things than what you do.
    We have long benefited
    from a system designed to channel and transform factional interests in the political
    system. When any branch encroaches upon the authority of another, it not only
    introduces instability into the system but leaves political issues raw and unresolved.

    However, to paraphrase one of Benjamin Franklin’s favorite sayings, the Constitution
    helps those branches that help themselves. Each branch is given the tools to defend itself
    and the Framers assumed that they would have the ambition and institutional self-interest
    to use them. That assumption is now being put to the test as many members remain silent
    in the face of open executive encroachment by the Executive Branch.


    While I believe that the White House has clearly “exceeded its brief” in these
    areas
    , this question of presidential nonenforcement has arisen periodically in our history.
    In the current controversy, the White House has suggested an array of arguments, citing
    the interpretation of statutory text, agency discretion, or other rationales to mask what is
    clearly a circumvention of Congress. It also appears to be relying on the expectation that
    no one will be able to secure standing to challenge such decisions in court.

    Finally, there is no question that the President as Chief Executive is allowed to set priorities of the
    administration and to determine the best way to enforce the law. People of good faith can
    clearly disagree on where the line is drawn over the failure to fully enforce federal laws.
    There is ample room given to a president in setting priorities in the enforcement of laws.
    A president is not required to enforce all laws equally or dedicate the same resources to
    every federal program.

    Even with this ample allowance, however, I believe that President Barack Obama has crossed the constitutional line between discretionary enforcement and defiance of federal law.

    Congress is given the defining function of creating and amending federal law. This is more than a turf fight between politicians. The division of governmental powers is designed to protect liberty by preventing the abusive concentration of power. All citizens –Democratic or Republican or Independent – should consider the inherent danger presented by a President who can unilaterally
    suspend laws as a matter of presidential license.


    In recent years, I have testified and written about the shift of power within our
    tripartite government toward a more Imperial Presidential model. Indeed, I last testified
    before this Committee on the assertion of President Obama that he could use the recess
    appointment power to circumvent the Senate during a brief intrasession recess.


    While I viewed those appointments to be facially unconstitutional under the language of Article I
    and II (a view later shared by two federal circuits), I was equally concerned about the
    overall expansion of unchecked presidential authority and the relative decline of
    legislative power in the modern American system. The recent nonenforcement policies
    add a particularly menacing element to this pattern. They effectively reduce the
    legislative process to a series of options for presidential selection ranging from negation
    to full enforcement. The Framers warned us of such a system and we accept it – either by
    acclaim or acquiescence – at our peril.


    The current claims of executive power will outlast this president and members
    must consider the implications of the precedent that they are now creating through
    inaction and silence. What if a future president decided that he or she did not like some
    environmental laws or anti-discrimination laws? Indeed, as discussed below, the
    nonenforcement policy is rarely analyzed to its natural conclusion, which leads to a
    fundamental shift in constitutional principles going back to Marbury v. Madison.


    The separation of powers is the very foundation for our system; the original covenant reached
    by the Founding Generation and passed on to successive generations. It is that system
    that produces laws that can be truly said to represent the wishes of the majority of
    Americans. It is also the very thing that gives a president the authority to govern in the
    name of all Americans. Despite the fact that I once voted for President Obama, personal
    admiration is no substitute for the constitutional principles at stake in this controversy.
    When a president claims the inherent power of both legislation and enforcement, he becomes a virtual government unto himself. He is not simply posing a danger to the constitutional system; he becomes the very danger that the Constitution was designed to avoid.


    http://jonathanturley.files.wordpres...ouse-final.pdf

    Very strong indeed....Remember this is a supporter of Obama saying these things....

    Is Obama overreaching? And will the people put a stop to it?

    "Fundamental Transformation?"
    Congress has the power and the authority, but they won't. The last congress to curb any presidential power was the one right after Watergate. Since then the members of congress from what ever party the president was from have become more a part of the administration than congress itself. There is no pride in being a member of congress and guarding their powers as a co-equal branch of government. Congress readily cedes those powers to the administration. When the party out of power tries to reign in the powers dutifully belonging to congress in the first place, the member of the president's party in congress obstruct them, defend their president and attempt to cede more of congress's power to the president. Thus the formation of the imperial presidency. The one branch that reign in or put a stop to an imperial presidency refuses to do so.

    The SCOTUS usually stays out of these fights knowing that congress has the power and the right to curb the abuses, so it is up to congress to do so, not the SCOTUS which is also a co-equal branch and ruling one way or the other would in essence put them above the other two branches.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  2. #32
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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by Lukas105 View Post
    The inactivity and bickering on capital hill is what makes our Republic work as it should. The thing that ruined it, is the formation of two main parties (Republican and Democrat) fighting for what they want, and only that. We need compromise and the return of the principles or liberty and freedom.
    I would agree to the degree that two parties dominate the election cycle. But in our country anyone can run, they just need get out there. If the people want it, they will vote for it. Libertarians main problem has been that they want the brass ring all at once. Start smaller, and build the recognition then move up the food chain.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

  3. #33
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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    Congress has the power and the authority, but they won't. The last congress to curb any presidential power was the one right after Watergate. Since then the members of congress from what ever party the president was from have become more a part of the administration than congress itself. There is no pride in being a member of congress and guarding their powers as a co-equal branch of government. Congress readily cedes those powers to the administration. When the party out of power tries to reign in the powers dutifully belonging to congress in the first place, the member of the president's party in congress obstruct them, defend their president and attempt to cede more of congress's power to the president. Thus the formation of the imperial presidency. The one branch that reign in or put a stop to an imperial presidency refuses to do so.

    The SCOTUS usually stays out of these fights knowing that congress has the power and the right to curb the abuses, so it is up to congress to do so, not the SCOTUS which is also a co-equal branch and ruling one way or the other would in essence put them above the other two branches.
    Thank you for the lesson, and I will only add that I believe that once this President is fully exposed, and possibly not until after his terms, this Presidency will be seen as the worst, most corrupt in history. Watergate will look like childs play compared to Obama.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    GREAT POST!!!

    The President has exceeded his authority, and needs to be taken to task for it.

    Not because he's "Obama" or because he's a Democrat, but because he is setting a precedent for future Presidents that can lead to unabridged authoritarian rule by the Executive Branch.

    The Congress needs to take back their power, and exert that power themselves.
    Jonathan Turley was right there making similar accusations of the Bush administration. Problem is, nothing happens and we continue down the road to tyranny.

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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    And Obama is more than happy to be their dictator.
    I love it when righties (and the left under Bush) throw around terms like Dictator when they have no ****ing clue what it really means. Oh yeah, Obama is a dictator alright

    Has Obama overstepped his bounds? Yes, in many cases I agree. Is Obama a dictator? Puuuuuhlease, gimme a break. The North Korean leader is a dictator.

    The ones on the right calling Obama a dicator really are showing their ignorance.

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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    The op says Turley is a lefty!!!

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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    I love it when righties (and the left under Bush) throw around terms like Dictator when they have no ****ing clue what it really means. Oh yeah, Obama is a dictator alright

    Has Obama overstepped his bounds? Yes, in many cases I agree. Is Obama a dictator? Puuuuuhlease, gimme a break. The North Korean leader is a dictator.

    The ones on the right calling Obama a dicator really are showing their ignorance.
    I love how Libbos put words in other peoples's mouth when they're trying to be insulting, or don't have anything else to say to defend Dear Leader.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I love how Libbos put words in other peoples's mouth when they're trying to be insulting, or don't have anything else to say to defend Dear Leader.
    Oh now we're back to the "libbo" insult you like to try. Of course your definition of a libbo is anyone that doesn't bash Obama 24/7. What a Con you are.

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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Jonathan Turley was right there making similar accusations of the Bush administration. Problem is, nothing happens and we continue down the road to tyranny.
    exactly. they all claim to want to not usurp power, then as soon as they walk in the Oval Office,
    the power overwhelms any semblance of Constitutional checks and balances
    Oṃ maṇi padme hūṃ

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    Re: Activists urge Obama to go rogue, sidestep Congress

    Quote Originally Posted by annata View Post
    exactly. they all claim to want to not usurp power, then as soon as they walk in the Oval Office,
    the power overwhelms any semblance of Constitutional checks and balances
    And we are about to see it taken further, as evidenced by Podesta being brought in for that purpose.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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