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Thread: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    Yes, I would like to get Catholic charities out of the business of health care since they are incapable of leaving their religious beliefs out of their medical care practices.

    Unfortunately, they have a lot of money and are taking over hospitals across the country.

    I don't know in this particular case what happened, but usually there is a hospital there providing care; then the Catholic hospital comes in and acquires it.

    I don't think religions should run hospitals anymore than I think govts should run churches.
    Well, see, until the government takes over full control of healthcare and hospitals, you don't get to say who can run a hospital and you don't get to say what services they must provide. Even then, good luck. Just as an aside, Catholic hospitals here in Canada, with UHC, don't provide abortion services.

    And just to clarify, since you continuously say this is not about abortion, please tell us what religious beliefs you're talking about that guided the treatment the hospital offered.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    The Catholic Church is buying up secular hospitals all over the US.

    The Catholic hospitals and clinics in the USA now get 1 out of every 6 patients.
    There are a lot of areas in the USA such as the state of Washington where patients just don't have a choice within 100 's of miles.

    The hospital the women who miscarried in the OP went to was the only one within 30 miles.
    1. About 23% of the adult US population is Catholic so 1 out of every 6 patients being served by a Catholic hospital or clinic is underservice if you believe that all Catholic hospitals do is provide bible based health care.

    2. Why do you think Catholic charities are "buying up secular hospitals"? Are they trying to take over the world, one denied abortion at a time? Or could it be that running a hospital is becoming a money loser and not worth the regulatory and legal hastle for those who would operate them?

    3. How close do pregnant women and women in general believe it is their "right" to have a hospital or clinic that will bow to their every wish and demand? 30 miles is too far apparently - what, about a 30 to 45 minute drive? - how about 10 miles? 1 mile? Around the corner? In their backyard?

    Don't like the medical care you're receiving in small or remote communities, open your own all service hospital with your own money or move to an area where all your demands can be met within walking distance.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Then why is Faux the source of the daily outrage? This is a rare left outrage, maybe.
    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    There is major info missing from that article. This is like the Trayvon martin case or that lesbian waitress a few weeks ago. We are supposed to "feel" without facts, as in the classic liberal manner.
    God Bless the Marine Corps.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Apparently according to the legal complaint the woman was in pain with cramping , her water had broken, the doctors knew by the small amount of amniotic fluid left that the fetus would either be stillborn or would only live a short times ( hours ) but the 18 week fetus still had a heartbeat.

    Why didn't they give meds that would induce labor ?

    standard care would call for labor to be induced and the fetus delivered.

    Is inducing labor when they knew the fetus would not live because there was not enough amniotic fluid considered an abortion and against the Catholic directive?
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Apparently according to the legal complaint the woman was in pain with cramping , her water had broken, the doctors knew by the small amount of amniotic fluid left that the fetus would either be stillborn or would only live a short times ( hours ) but the 18 week fetus still had a heartbeat.

    Why didn't they give meds that would induce labor ?

    standard care would call for labor to be induced and the fetus delivered.

    Is inducing labor when they knew the fetus would not live because there was not enough amniotic fluid considered an abortion and against the Catholic directive?
    There may be a valid point when it comes to the provision of medical care - that's the American passtime, after all - spin the lawsuit lottery wheel - but that's for a court to decide. But when you couch your complaint about medical care with suggestions like "against the Catholic directive", then you cheapen and lose the argument.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Thats not a condition of funding. The govt wont be able to to meet anywhere near the demand if religious hospitals shut down.
    Why aren't you a patient advocate, nurse?
    I am. The kind that could die are very important to me. For the record, I am ok with them not providing the service. I AM NOT ok with them refusing to tell her the risks of her condition - which could be deadly. It is simply explaining the risks and options. If (yes if) she was in extreme danger because of the retained failing pregnancy she should have been notified. Hell, on a religious level - if they were gonna play the religion card....why not just send a Priest in to give her the message.(yes, that was sarcastic)

    I am a patient advocate, I believe they should understand the severity of their condition. If they did not inform them, this is in my book the same as the OBGYNs that do not tell their patients of severe anomalies found on testing/ultrasound because they are afraid their patient will seek abortion.

    Yes, a patient advocate. All of them.

    Why not inform the woman of how bad it could get. They do not have to end her pregnancy, they just need to inform her of the real risks. IF they did not inform her of the risks involved in her problematic pregnancy I hope they are held accountable.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    There may be a valid point when it comes to the provision of medical care - that's the American passtime, after all - spin the lawsuit lottery wheel - but that's for a court to decide. But when you couch your complaint about medical care with suggestions like "against the Catholic directive", then you cheapen and lose the argument.
    I used the term Catholic directive because I am trying to understand if the Catholic Church really believes that inducing labor in a case like hers would be considered a direct abortion.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    I used the term Catholic directive because I am trying to understand if the Catholic Church really believes that inducing labor in a case like hers would be considered a direct abortion.
    The hospital, as I understand it, delivered the child who then passed away a short time later. How do you think that happened?

    I realize that many here would prefer the tweeze and suction method of ridding the womb of the "parasite" as some call it, but some hospitals, some doctors, believe in making every attempt to save a life, no matter how fragile or unlikely to survive.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    I am. The kind that could die are very important to me. For the record, I am ok with them not providing the service. I AM NOT ok with them refusing to tell her the risks of her condition - which could be deadly. It is simply explaining the risks and options. If (yes if) she was in extreme danger because of the retained failing pregnancy she should have been notified. Hell, on a religious level - if they were gonna play the religion card....why not just send a Priest in to give her the message.(yes, that was sarcastic)

    I am a patient advocate, I believe they should understand the severity of their condition. If they did not inform them, this is in my book the same as the OBGYNs that do not tell their patients of severe anomalies found on testing/ultrasound because they are afraid their patient will seek abortion.

    Yes, a patient advocate. All of them.

    Why not inform the woman of how bad it could get. They do not have to end her pregnancy, they just need to inform her of the real risks. IF they did not inform her of the risks involved in her problematic pregnancy I hope they are held accountable.
    Do you know for a fact this didn't happen? Do you know what private and confidential doctor/patient conversations took place at the hospital on each of the occasions on which she visited? As I understand it, her lawsuit, filed by the ACLU, doesn't name the specific doctors involved - why's that? Could it be they have bigger agenda issues to pursue and this woman happens to be a convenient pawn?

    As for informing her of "the risks involved in her problematic pregnancy", are you claiming this hospital was her primary prenatal care provider? Where's her own doctor in all of this if her "problematic pregnancy" was so evident for all the world to see? Is he/she being sued for not fully informing her of the risks involved?

    No, this has all the odor of a trumped up showcase to push the pro-abortion agenda of forcing all facilities, irrespective of their constitutional rights, to provide abortion on demand.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    re: Catholic hospital 'risked woman's life by forcing her to deliver 18-week fetus[W:465]

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    Thanks for the link. It appears that in the suit, the ACLU is alleging that the hospital didn't inform her that the best option would be to induce labor and abort. The problem I have with this, is that an 18 week fetus will not automatically die. It could have been delivered and sent to a neonatal intensive care unit, where the chances for survival aren't great, but are at least possible. I'm not sure why this would not have been an option for her. I still don't see why we are not seeing any information regarding her doctor in any of the stories which have been published about it, and I really don't think this is about anything more than the ACLU wanting to force a religious hospital to provide services which are against their own policies.
    If their policy is negligent, particularly their policy of not providing complete info about the best treatment options, then why should they be allowed to continue them?
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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