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Thread: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

  1. #21
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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    medicare for all citizens and legal aliens, without regard to age
    our nation's own version of single payer coverage



    and i was initially outraged at ACA, believing it to be a plum given over to the insurance industry
    however, by having insurers administer this program, that eliminated the need for a federal bureauracy to oversee it
    and we know how ineffective government is in that role
    instead, we now have competitive forces moving health care towards more efficiency while the insurers' portion of premiums used for profit and administrative costs cannot exceed 20% ... likely less that what a government bureauracy would cost
    maybe the heritage foundation and the Obama administration got this right
    OK, at what rate would the new Medicare payroll tax be set? The problem, currently with Medicare and Medicaid, is that the single payer (the federal gov't) then sets the "fair" price of care. Unlike SNAP, where the food provider still sets the price, Medicare decides that care procedure X will cost (be reimbursed for) $100, so one then must find (on their own) a care provider that will perform procedure X for $100 (or make up the difference out of pocket). Note how few care providers will now accept Medicare/Medicaid patients because of the reimbursement limits imposed. Imagine a SNAP program that paid $1.50/pound for meat, one then could buy only chicken or pay added cash in order to buy pork or beef.
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 12-03-13 at 10:54 AM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    OK, at what rate would the new Medicare payroll tax be set? The problem, currently with Medicare and Medicaid, is that the single payer (the federal gov't) then sets the "fair" price of care. Unlike SNAP, where the food provider still sets the price, Medicare decides that care procedure X will cost (be reimbursed for) $100, so one then must find (on their own) a care provider that will perform procedure X for $100 (or make up the difference out of pocket). Note how few care providers will now accept Medicare/Medicaid patients because of the reimbursement limits imposed. Imagine a SNAP program that paid $1.50/pound for meat, one then could buy only chicken or pay added cash in order to buy pork or beef.
    and here is where the 2% of the population being elite works for the great American public
    while that 2% can and would pay cash for their health care, their numbers are so small that they cannot sustain the medical industry
    medicare payments would be made for most of the remaining 98%, and medical practitioners would either accept those payment rates or work in another industry or country
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    and here is where the 2% of the population being elite works for the great American public
    while that 2% can and would pay cash for their health care, their numbers are so small that they cannot sustain the medical industry
    medicare payments would be made for most of the remaining 98%, and medical practitioners would either accept those payment rates or work in another industry or country
    Wrong. As we see with Medicare today; private "supplemental" insurance will be available, for those that can afford it, to allow the market price of care to be paid to the provider of their choice. As you note there will be discount care facilities, able to remain profitable on only the Medicare rates, but they are a far cry from that available with cash and/or supplemental insurance, in both the quality of care provided, waiting times for that care and the range of services offered (i.e. specialty care). We now have a two tiered medical care provider system and that will get much worse with more relying on gov't defined reimbursement rates.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    and here is where the 2% of the population being elite works for the great American public
    while that 2% can and would pay cash for their health care, their numbers are so small that they cannot sustain the medical industry
    medicare payments would be made for most of the remaining 98%, and medical practitioners would either accept those payment rates or work in another industry or country
    Its always about getting something for nothing, isnt it?

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Its always about getting something for nothing, isnt it?
    no, you are exposing that you have no understanding about the way insurance works
    we will all be expected to pay for health insurance coverage
    while we do not know whether we will eventually pay for more than we ultimately require
    our risk is pooled. and only a fool would hope to receive more than they contributed, because that would mean you encountered more health problems than the average person
    the objective is to pay more than we use. which meas we would up healthy. the 'surplus' that we paid, which was used by others, paid for the possibility that it could have otherwise been you who needed to access that 'surplus' to cover your extraordinary health costs
    without such a healthcare safety net, those with the least means and greatest health care issues ... which costs of care they could not personally afford, would have certain death as their near term expectation. this safety net changes that
    pay your health care premium and pray you never require use of the 'surplus' that is paid
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    So so much fail. Its not over for obamacare-certainly it is still capable of being overturned.

    And the heritage foundation line is bull**** as well-this law is entirely a dem baby.
    Multiple challenges on the same grounds are very likely to be dismissed as well.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    How many will die if denied free contraception?
    How many will die if we don't make health care more expensive?

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    And this right here is why the court is unfit and not worth the peoples time in respecting. For that matter, a government that doesn't respect the liberty of it's people is unfit to exist.

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    It's a penalty up to $695, assessed only on your tax return. Waived if you have insurance. There is no other enforcement mechanism. Criminal charges are expressly prevented. Only your tax return can be reduced, they can't even garnish wages. Explain to us how you think that's substantively different from what the heritage idiot supported.
    Who the hell cares what heritage supported? It is still forcing people into commerce and ignoring the people right to decide to buy or not buy insurance. That isn't even considering the right of insurance companies to deny to do business with people. Just admit your law is a violation of human rights and move on. Stop trying to pretend anyone cares that the heritage foundation supported the idea in the past or that it even matters.

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    Re: U.S. justices decline to hear another Obamacare challenge

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    So here is my question. If not Obamacare, then what? I would like to hear some good answers on this question. We should act like civilized people, and not as barbarians and animals. For now, despite it's many problems, I think Obamacare is OK, until something better comes along.
    Really now, as if obamacare is civilized. Exactly what part of Obamacare could be described as civilized? What coercive action do you wish to pretend represents civilized behavior today?

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