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Thread: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    If they wanted to, they could lock down the East China Sea within moments by preventing any ship from entering the area.
    That is a rather gross overstatement.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Do you know what sailors call a Carrier without a Carrier Strike Group to support it?

    HINT: It's also the name of a major retail chain, and it rhymes with "Schmarget".







    this is a toy they are selling in Japan. Recognize that swoop-deck in the background?
    Well if that carrier does find itself in disputed waters during an incident it may well end up joining the Bel Grano.... Showing off your new toys sometimes gets them scratched....
    "Truly I was born to be an example of misfortune, and a target at which the arrows of adversary are aimed"

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    They do the comparison here with the Ford-class (and by extension, Nimitz-class), but it's arguably more comparable to our Wasp-class. Somewhere in between, I suppose.
    It is by no means comparable to a US Super Carrier. It is larger than the Wasp Class but smaller than the Nimitz Class. It is a Stobar Class which the US doesn't have. There are only three in service; 1 Russian, 1 Indian, and this Chinese Liaoning.

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    It's an old Russian carrier they've been futzing with for years. They don't have any operational planes to fly from it.
    Unfortunately, they do have A/C to fly from it. Did you see the video I posted in this thread?

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    Unfortunately, they do have A/C to fly from it. Did you see the video I posted in this thread?
    Their J-15 isn't ready; at the moment, it's at best a chopper carrier. You mean the clip from Red October?
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    ... You mean the clip from Red October?


    No.

    The clip released by China showing the aircraft landing and taking off from the Liaoning.
    http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaki...post1062603864
    No disrespect, it just made me laugh.

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post


    No.

    The clip released by China showing the aircraft landing and taking off from the Liaoning.
    http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaki...post1062603864
    No disrespect, it just made me laugh.
    They've done some takeoff and landing trials, but they have a ways to go before they're operational.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    That is a rather gross overstatement.
    Really you say?

    The Pentagon has used the term anti-access weapons for missiles and other weapons that can keep U.S. forces away from China’s coasts, and in particular to prevent the rapid deployment of U.S. naval forces in the Western Pacific to aid Taiwan in any future conflict with China. Deputy Defense Secretary William J. Lynn III said during a speech outlining the administration’s missile-defense priorities that “potential adversaries are planning to employ ballistic missiles in anti-access tactics. Mr. Lynn also said ”Like asymmetric threats, anti-access tactics are designed to offset our conventional dominance. The proliferation of short- and medium-range ballistic missiles will put U.S. forces on land and at sea at increasing risk of ballistic missile attack. This risk could push our forces further from the battlespace, compromising our ability to bring our conventional superiority to bear.”

    Let's talk about that capability then. To start, you have to talk about the new unprecedented carrier-killing missile called the Dong Feng 21D that could be launched from land with enough accuracy to penetrate the defenses of even the most advanced moving aircraft carrier at a distance of more than 1,500 kilometers (900 miles). The missile is fired from a mobile truck-mounted launcher into the atmosphere, with over-the-horizon radar, satellite tracking and possibly unmanned aerial vehicles each providing guidance. It also incorporates a manoeuvrable warhead to help find its target.

    "The Navy has long had to fear carrier-killing capabilities," said Patrick Cronin, senior director of the Asia-Pacific Security Program at the nonpartisan, Washington-based Center for a New American Security. "The emerging Chinese antiship missile capability, and in particular the DF 21D, represents the first post-Cold War capability that is both potentially capable of stopping our naval power projection and deliberately designed for that purpose."

    But Beijing does not need to match the U.S. carrier for carrier. The Dong Feng 21D, smarter, and vastly cheaper, could successfully attack a U.S. carrier, or at least deter it from getting too close. U.S. Defense Secretary Robert Gates warned of the threat in a speech last September at the Air Force Association Convention. "When considering the military-modernization programs of countries like China, we should be concerned less with their potential ability to challenge the U.S. symmetrically — fighter to fighter or ship to ship — and more with their ability to disrupt our freedom of movement and narrow our strategic options," he said. Gates said China's investments in cyber and anti-satellite warfare, anti-air and anti-ship weaponry, along with ballistic missiles, "could threaten America's primary way to project power" through its forward air bases and carrier strike groups.


    (The Above Came From the Following Three Articles.)
    Threat in Asia is anti-ship missiles
    Chinese missile could shift Pacific power balance
    China Takes Aim at U.S. Naval Might

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    They've done some takeoff and landing trials, but they have a ways to go before they're operational.
    According the Jane's, they've deployed with aircraft to this event.

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    Re: China warplanes tail U.S. and Japan fighter jets; How Far Will China Go?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Really you say?
    Yes, I really say that this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    If they wanted to, they could lock down the East China Sea within moments by preventing any ship from entering the area.
    Is a gross overstatement.

    The Pentagon has used the term anti-access weapons for missiles and other weapons that can keep U.S. forces away from China’s coasts, and in particular to prevent the rapid deployment of U.S. naval forces in the Western Pacific to aid Taiwan in any future conflict with China. Deputy Defense Secretary William J. Lynn III said during a speech outlining the administration’s missile-defense priorities that “potential adversaries are planning to employ ballistic missiles in anti-access tactics. Mr. Lynn also said ”Like asymmetric threats, anti-access tactics are designed to offset our conventional dominance. The proliferation of short- and medium-range ballistic missiles will put U.S. forces on land and at sea at increasing risk of ballistic missile attack. This risk could push our forces further from the battlespace, compromising our ability to bring our conventional superiority to bear.”

    Then let's talk about that capability then. To start, you have to talk about the new unprecedented carrier-killing missile called the Dong Feng 21D that could be launched from land with enough accuracy to penetrate the defenses of even the most advanced moving aircraft carrier at a distance of more than 1,500 kilometers (900 miles). The missile is fired from a mobile truck-mounted launcher into the atmosphere, with over-the-horizon radar, satellite tracking and possibly unmanned aerial vehicles each providing guidance. It also incorporates a manoeuvrable warhead to help find its target.

    "The Navy has long had to fear carrier-killing capabilities," said Patrick Cronin, senior director of the Asia-Pacific Security Program at the nonpartisan, Washington-based Center for a New American Security. "The emerging Chinese antiship missile capability, and in particular the DF 21D, represents the first post-Cold War capability that is both potentially capable of stopping our naval power projection and deliberately designed for that purpose."

    But Beijing does not need to match the U.S. carrier for carrier. The Dong Feng 21D, smarter, and vastly cheaper, could successfully attack a U.S. carrier, or at least deter it from getting too close. U.S. Defense Secretary Robert Gates warned of the threat in a speech last September at the Air Force Association Convention. "When considering the military-modernization programs of countries like China, we should be concerned less with their potential ability to challenge the U.S. symmetrically — fighter to fighter or ship to ship — and more with their ability to disrupt our freedom of movement and narrow our strategic options," he said. Gates said China's investments in cyber and anti-satellite warfare, anti-air and anti-ship weaponry, along with ballistic missiles, "could threaten America's primary way to project power" through its forward air bases and carrier strike groups.
    This is all about plans, theory, could, maybe. That's a far, far cry from it being reality, as you say it is.

    It also entirely discounts any countermeasures on our part.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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