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Pope issues mission statement for papacy

apdst said:
I like how Libbos denounce Christianity as racist and evil, until the Pope makes a statement that can be vaguely interpreted supporting socialism.
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You're trying too hard to make up for the times I've caught you lying in the last few weeks apdst. :)

What idiot taught you that?...lol!

God says earn your living by the sweat of your brow, too; guess that leaves out the welfare class.
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"God" doesn't say anything because "God" doesn't exist. :shrug:
 
justabubba said:
please share with us how that is accomplished when there are more workers than jobs
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Ever wonder why that is?
much racism is conducted in the guise of Christianity ... notice what symbol those burning members form at a KKK rally
a lot of evil results while cloaked in the robes of Christianity
amazes me that you were not well acquainted with that reality
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Your reality is that the burning cross of the KKK is the symbol of Christianity? That must mean that the burning of the American flag is a sign that these people love America.

and the way Pope Francis is turning the direction of the catholic church around deserves praise from all quarters. that he embraces Jesus' admonition to help the least among us seems to aggravate you. why do so many self purported Christians act in ways opposing Jesus' teachings and instead pursue a life dedicated to self interest?
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Christians have always been taught to help the least among us. Nothing new here.
 
Grant said:
God may not exist for you, yet. He certainly exists for others though.
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If god doesn't exist for everyone, he's not omnipotent.


Or are you playing fast and loose with the definition of "god" or "exist"? Or both?
 
Peter Grimm said:
Just keep flapping your gums, clownboy. The Catholic Church does more charity work and gives more of its wealth to the poor than any other institution on earth. It always has. Fact.

So you fail on many levels.
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Utter bull**** and why St Francis of Assisi never made Pope. They preserve their own wealth and pass around the wealth of their followers. They spend other people's money and take the credit upon themselves. Not a fact at all if you consider how little of what they have do they spend on their charitable efforts. Bill and Melinda Gates give more than the church does relatively speaking.
 
clownboy said:
Good grief. He trying to put butts back in the pews and stop the bleeding. The more butts in pews, they more folks who give to the church, the more powerful the church is. It's not about the poor or downtrodden. It's about the church maintaining it's wealth and power. So transparent it's a wonder how folks can buy this nonsense.

If he were at all serious about what he's saying he could lead by example from day one. But that's just not going to happen. The Vatican will retain it's existing wealth and gain more. They won't open their archives, they won't open their books, they won't sacrifice one iota of their wealth to help the poor. But hey, they want you to.

Sucker born every minute.
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from what limited reading i have done, Pope Francis appears to live as he teaches ... certainly predating his papacy

wonder who will be attracted to the church, filling those pews, rich folks or poor people. i am guessing the latter disproportionately. but what he can accomplish, and i would bet it is not lost on him, is a political movement to mimic his new and improved direction of the church. those poor parishioners still have the right to vote (in most countries having sizable catholic populations). his words can move their votes in large blocks
 
justabubba said:
so, you have no facts to support your position. that is what i must assume because all you have offered in reply is an array of very weak anectdotes
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Yeah, just very weak anecdotes. You're probably right about the international influence of Sally Ann, a great organization.
 
justabubba said:
from what limited reading i have done, Pope Francis appears to live as he teaches ... certainly predating his papacy

wonder who will be attracted to the church, filling those pews, rich folks or poor people. i am guessing the latter disproportionately. but what he can accomplish, and i would bet it is not lost on him, is a political movement to mimic his new and improved direction of the church. those poor parishioners still have the right to vote (in most countries having sizable catholic populations). his words can move their votes in large blocks
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What specifically is his "new and improved direction of the church"?
 
Grant said:
So they've stopped teaching history in Oregon.
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Well, since I wasn't educated here can't tell you. My daughter and my grandchildren are though and I can tell you history is still taught in private schools. Though NONE of the states included the history of the Roman Catholic Church in their history modules, so that little comment is a massive fail. Inform us then, why did Peter start the church? And where biblically are any of those principles established in the church. Show your stuff. You claim superior knowledge, let's see it.
 
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clownboy said:
Utter bull**** and why St Francis of Assisi never made Pope. They preserve their own wealth and pass around the wealth of their followers. They spend other people's money and take the credit upon themselves. Not a fact at all if you consider how little of what they have do they spend on their charitable efforts. Bill and Melinda Gates give more than the church does relatively speaking.
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You seem very familiar with Papal history. Where did you study?
 
justabubba said:
please share with us how that is accomplished when there are more workers than jobs


much racism is conducted in the guise of Christianity ... notice what symbol those burning members form at a KKK rally
a lot of evil results while cloaked in the robes of Christianity
amazes me that you were not well acquainted with that reality

and the way Pope Francis is turning the direction of the catholic church around deserves praise from all quarters. that he embraces Jesus' admonition to help the least among us seems to aggravate you. why do so many self purported Christians act in ways opposing Jesus' teachings and instead pursue a life dedicated to self interest?
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Less government...more jobs. Simple!
 
Grant said:
You seem very familiar with Papal history. Where did you study?
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Some of us actually studied relgions before we chose which religion to practice our spirituality within. I paid attention in all the university level comparative religions courses. Not to mention it's been a running discussion with my cousin who is a Catholic priest. Where did you study?
 
clownboy said:
Well, since I wasn't educated here can't tell you. My daughter and my grandchildren are though and I can tell you history is still taught in private schools. Though NONE of the states included the history of the Roman Catholic Church in their history modiles, so that little comment is a massive fail. Inform us then, why did Peter start the church? And where biblically are any of those principles established in the church. Show your stuff. You claim superior knowledge, let's see it.
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In response to
Yeah... it's not like christianity was founded on principles of sharing wealth, renouncing materialism and caring for the poor. Those are all 20th century leftist principles.
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you said
Good point, because it certainly wasn't founded on any of that.
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That's quite a claim. Do you have any support for it?
 
clownboy said:
Some of us actually studied relgions before we chose which religion to practice our spirituality within. I paid attention in all the university level comparative religions courses. Not to mention it's been a running discussion with my cousin who is a Catholic priest. Where did you study?
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I never 'studied' religion. Did read the New Testament though.

I suppose you get the better of your cousin in any religious dispute.
 
justabubba said:
from what limited reading i have done, Pope Francis appears to live as he teaches ... certainly predating his papacy

wonder who will be attracted to the church, filling those pews, rich folks or poor people. i am guessing the latter disproportionately. but what he can accomplish, and i would bet it is not lost on him, is a political movement to mimic his new and improved direction of the church. those poor parishioners still have the right to vote (in most countries having sizable catholic populations). his words can move their votes in large blocks
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Now, if he releases an edict that the poor are no longer required to tithe or give to the church, it'd be a tad more believable. It's not how you walk the walk when you can't make a difference, but how you do it when you have the power that counts here. Thus far he's shown himself no different than any other modern Pope.
 
justabubba said:
to a greater level than the salvation army? do you have a link confirming your assertion?
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Really? Holy **** it's not even close man. JUST IN THE UNITED STATES the catholic church spent 98 billion dollars (not a typo) providing healthcare, and 4.8 billion dollars on handouts and other charity causes.

That doesn't even account for the time donated by church members, nuns, etc who are out working in the community full time for no pay.

Now consider that the vast, vast majority of the church's charitable donations come from and are distributed overseas.... to places that really need it like Africa, Latin America, etc.

So the catholic church worldwide is estimated to be have annual income of $422.098 billion dollars, most of which is spent to do good work (the exact number isn't divulged, but since we know the estimate is about 5% of the American Catholic church's income, if we assume the same worldwide we get annual charitable donations of over 21 billion dollars, and over 200 billion dollars per year operating hospitals.)

Compare that with the Salvation Army, which has a global annual income of about 2 billion dollars, around half of which goes to actual charity work. The Catholic Church is at a minimum 20 times more charitable than the Salvation Army.

Now compare
 
Grant said:
I never 'studied' religion. Did read the New Testament though.

I suppose you get the better of your cousin in any religious dispute.
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I've read the Bible, many editions and translations, a few times. Did the whole Bible study thing for years. And it goes back and forth. We learn much from each other. He collects various translations of the Bible and the Apocrypha so it's always a learning experience speaking with him.
 
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Unitedwestand13 said:
If it were that simple, Somalia would be the jobs capital of the world right now.:roll:
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Somalia could be an example of any point we wanted to prove but perhaps we should focus on more democratic environments. Somalia would be Islamic, btw, and has nothing to do with the Pope. Too bad, really.
 
clownboy said:
Utter bull**** and why St Francis of Assisi never made Pope. They preserve their own wealth and pass around the wealth of their followers. They spend other people's money and take the credit upon themselves. Not a fact at all if you consider how little of what they have do they spend on their charitable efforts. Bill and Melinda Gates give more than the church does relatively speaking.
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You might read the post I just replied to justabubba with the financial info I was able to google up. Regardless, the church operates its own charities, and the Vatican being a nation in itself it's hard to find tax records or anything that would show how much of the church's finances go to charitable causes.

However, if you have eyes in that head of yours, you'll see for yourself that catholic charities are everywhere. Soup kitchens, etc. Nuns doing volunteer work. And not just here - we're the richest country on earth least in need of charity. Most of the church's work is in places like south america, africa, etc where people are really starving.
 
Grant said:
Somalia could be an example of any point we wanted to prove but perhaps we should focus on more democratic environments. Somalia would be Islamic, btw, and has nothing to do with the Pope. Too bad, really.
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I made my comment a response to adspts comment that "less government = more jobs" and I was pointing out the flaw behind what he said.
 
Grant said:
God may not exist for you, yet. He certainly exists for others though.
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Either it does or doesn't. You can't have it both ways.
 
Peter Grimm said:
You might read the post I just replied to justabubba with the financial info I was able to google up. Regardless, the church operates its own charities, and the Vatican being a nation in itself it's hard to find tax records or anything that would show how much of the church's finances go to charitable causes.

However, if you have eyes in that head of yours, you'll see for yourself that catholic charities are everywhere. Soup kitchens, etc. Nuns doing volunteer work. And not just here - we're the richest country on earth least in need of charity. Most of the church's work is in places like south america, africa, etc where people are really starving.
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"For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be. ... of him shall be much required". I doubt highly that means you get to live in the lap of luxury while giving away a portion of the wealth folks have donated for just that charitable purpose.
 
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