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Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

joko104 said:
Apparently you are correct that no squad was the first to reach the Pakistan border in that district less than 1000 strong as you claimed - and when they did they all landed 1000 all together at the Pakistan border. Or at least one person completely agrees with you that is indisputable fact.
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They didn't land at the border. Nor did anyone walk there "village by village" from where they were landing. Take a look at a fricking map.

And Operation Moshtarak involved over 15,000 servicemembers. So yeah. "Thousands".
 
cpwill said:
They didn't land at the border. Nor did anyone walk there "village by village" from where they were landing. Take a look at a fricking map.

And Operation Moshtarak involved over 15,000 servicemembers. So yeah. "Thousands".
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Helmand (hel-MUND; Pashto/Balochi: هلمند) or Hillmand[2] is one of the 34 provinces of Afghanistan, located in the south of the country. It is one of the largest, covering 58,584 square kilometres (20,000 sq mi) area. The province contains 14 districts, encompassing over 1,000 villages, and roughly 1.4 million settled and nomadic people.[1] Lashkar Gah serves as the provincial capital.

Operation Moshtarak - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I never mentioned Operation Moshtarak.

You should go to Wiki and clarify that there were no patrols ever done in the Hellman district whatsoever, only one action involving 15,000 service members who all stuck together as a single unit.:roll:

However, I have to leave this thread. There is no debate, only absurd claims that are so far off in outer space they are ridiculous. There were no patrol units in Afghanistan. The military only uses service members in units of 1000 or more such other crap.

Besides, your side has already lost the debate in the real world or military and civilian command. And hopefully it will forever stay that way. No more years of endless counter productive invasions and occupation wars. Your failed and antiquated views of the military on false visions of opposing armies on battle fronts into the thousands is now just history to be studied of past military mistakes.
 
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joko104 said:
Helmand (hel-MUND; Pashto/Balochi: هلمند) or Hillmand[2] is one of the 34 provinces of Afghanistan, located in the south of the country. It is one of the largest, covering 58,584 square kilometres (20,000 sq mi) area. The province contains 14 districts, encompassing over 1,000 villages, and roughly 1.4 million settled and nomadic people.[1] Lashkar Gah serves as the provincial capital.
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Hey congratulations on a really awesome copy/paste job. I notice that you left out the distance between Marjeh and the Pakistani Border, or what the terrain is like there as well as the size of a battalion area of operations.
 
cpwill said:
Hey congratulations on a really awesome copy/paste job. I notice that you left out the distance between Marjeh and the Pakistani Border, or what the terrain is like there as well as the size of a battalion area of operations.
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I have no doubt that not everyone in the US military was afraid to leave the 15,000 troop collective at Marjeh.

Marines tend to not have that level of fear and have quite different attitudes about war and engagement. They aren't as pansy ass as apparently is your view of ALL US service members in war zones.

NOW you are claiming that the American military never reached the Pakistan border whatsoever. You can't stay consistent even on the same thread on the same day.

Your apparent claim also that the Marines and US military all reported to you - I suppose you are claiming they even checked with you first - all their actions in Afghanistan down to every service member and every day. Or is it that you read something about the operation in Marjeh in the press and now you know it all - and know that is all there was too! :lamo
 
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Lets drop this personal stuff and get back on topic.
 
There is so much Walter Mitty going on and so much false claims it too risky to engage in that I'm out of these topics. It's irrelevant anyway. The military and civilian leadership as left the past behind and advanced to wiser goals and practices learning from terrible mistakes of the past.
 
Seeing as you keep repeating this bs story lets just see if we can point out some of the more out there claims. To start let's look at some of the things you claimed earlier. This guy was supposedly picked out off boot camp because he was a trouble maker and also because he was such a bad ass. No one is picked from basic to go to some super secret unit. There is no chance in basic to prove how awesome you are because just as the name implies everything they teach in basic is basic. There are no complicated missions where you can show off your skills. Everything there is tightly controlled and instructor run. Second elite units are not looking for troublemakers. In fact being one will get you kicked out. SOF units need people they can count on.

joko104 said:
You have us mixed up. It is CPWILL that claims no small units are ever sent out. The account I gave was of a Marine who lead a squad doing exactly what you said is done. To root them out in remote, rugged terrain. On foot. Small unit. Carrying only small arms.

Whatever he did certainly got some people's attention. His parents are friends with my wife's parents, and her father is their family minister. They had not wanted him to go into the Marines for the reason he was - to literally within the legal context of war hunt and kill people. That was his specific reason. And I know him well enough to know is someone ideally suited to do so. A hunter since a young child. 4.0 smart. State wrestling champ, though not a big guy. Had a couple bigger brothers who'd beat him up, until it came where he could. A natural leader.

He was offered a high paying position training special ops teams - to train them, not lead them - as this to become an increasing direction the military is headed - to take out specific persons and targets including when drones can't get the job done. His family thought he should accept it. He turned it down. That he had done what he set out to do and has no intention of putting up with all the BS he'd have to put up with in such a position. what exactly do you think this guy could teach a SOF unit. Do you really think his self taught hunting skills are more than they teach at any of the SOF sniper skills. Give me a break.

He stated (repeating it) "that Marines walk into battle." I suspect the picture you showed is exactly what he and his squad did, though in his words they preferred to move to small village to small village as temp. base of operation. He wanted the "outsiders" (enemy/insurgents) to see them as vulnerable - particularly at night - but that they actually did most their hunting at night - adding the advantage that they had night vision gear. Most their kills occurred at night. Post like this prove you have no idea how the military functions. No one anywhere close to being fresh out of basic is leading any sort of patrol. The military has a very strict rank structure as well as rules as to what rank you must be to be in any positions.

Is anyone saying that the military never deployed such tactics? To send out search-and-destroy patrols that stayed out more than a few hours? The army would show up as would air support time to time. He said that the army just screwed up their relationship with the locals and when air power showed up they were wasting their time as the enemy would just go into hiding. His view was that if his squad was seen as alone, undermanned and without support then the insurgents were more likely to try to ambush or take them on. The challenge - to his mind - was not successfully killing the enemy. It was getting the enemy to come out of hiding and fleeing to engage them. He also had some tactics to get local villages to give them info of who and where to hunt. Yes the military does conduct patrols like that but they are nut run by as you put it a bunch of troublemakers who they put together at basic and sent on a suicide mission. The military will not let any squad operate for any extended time without control and contact of that unit. For that you need Comms which require batteries as do things like nods which must be hard to come by seeing as you said earlier they didn't get resupplied. And just so we are clear no squad no matter who is in it picks and chooses which village they go to or how they operate. A squad has almost no imput into how they conduct ops. That is why you have things like platoon leaders. Just the fact that you might believe a bs story like this just proves you know absolutely nothing about the military

CPWILLs claims it fact that our military never does anything that doesn't involve the movement of at least 1000 troops as a unit. I say that's BS.
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The last thing I will bring up is how you commented earlier that somehow you badass friend was using a hunting rifle. You do know that no one outside of certain SOF units has any say so at all to what weapon they use. If he was an infantryman he was using a m16, m4, 249 or a 240. The military does not say well this guy is a bad ass hunter lets give him a hunting rifle. Give me a break you are clueless.
 
Paratrooper said:
Lets drop this personal stuff and get back on topic.
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Good idea.

Its worth mentioning that women have a lower survivability with severe injury. They have weaker bones, less blood, less iron, less connective tissue (skin breaks easier), and less cardiovascular reserve. This means an injured female will have less time until irreversible shock, and frankly death.

Ive also read that females have greatly increased rates of UTI's and yeast infections when actively deployed-these aren't life threatening but they are new problems and can easily take a female out of a fight.
 
braindrain said:
Seeing as you keep repeating this bs story lets just see if we can point out some of the more out there claims. To start let's look at some of the things you claimed earlier. This guy was supposedly picked out off boot camp because he was a trouble maker and also because he was such a bad ass. No one is picked from basic to go to some super secret unit. There is no chance in basic to prove how awesome you are because just as the name implies everything they teach in basic is basic. There are no complicated missions where you can show off your skills. Everything there is tightly controlled and instructor run. Second elite units are not looking for troublemakers. In fact being one will get you kicked out. SOF units need people they can count on.



The last thing I will bring up is how you commented earlier that somehow you badass friend was using a hunting rifle. You do know that no one outside of certain SOF units has any say so at all to what weapon they use. If he was an infantryman he was using a m16, m4, 249 or a 240. The military does not say well this guy is a bad ass hunter lets give him a hunting rifle. Give me a break you are clueless.
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Only a fool does not understand all military rifles also can be called a hunting rifle. I gather you are an anti gun-freak who claims they are OMG! "ASSAULT RIFLES" that have no other usage. He stated he saw himself as hunting and accordingly referred to his rifle as his hunting rifle. He saw his rifle as for the purpose of hunting down the enemy on patrol. I'm confident you saw yours as only for the purpose of cleaning for inspection.

Does basic training ever filter enlistees into various roles? That some are not suited for frontline combat, but still usable. Others are for regular usage. Others have particular skills. You say NEVER. I see nothing to back that up, nor does that make any sense. Advancement and assign in the military is not by random drawing lots as you seemingly believe. All your view means is that they never saw anything particularly special or skillful about you so you remained just one of the generic herd. Go on to explain there are not such thing as special ops either, and if so they are randomly selected.

YOU SHOULD GO START A THREAD OF YOUR VIEW ENTITLED: "MILITARY ASSAULT RIFLES ARE NOT HUNTING RIFLES!" and then continue with some anti-gun rant.

His primary complaint about the Marines and military in general is not washing out people such as you express yourself to be. His view was the military in terms of ground troops should be limited only to the very best - and everyone else is a liability and handicap. He would have washed you out of his small squad quickly.

Leaders are those who aren't just passive followers of the pack relying on time-senority. I know that fella. He's the diametric opposite of your views, and I do believe such skills and leadership abilities, plus initiative, are exactly what the Marines are watching for. There are 10,000,000 potential enlistees like you. Not many like him. I know many who were in military service. None others like him.
 
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braindrain said:
Seeing as you keep repeating this bs story lets just see if we can point out some of the more out there claims. To start let's look at some of the things you claimed earlier. This guy was supposedly picked out off boot camp because he was a trouble maker and also because he was such a bad ass. No one is picked from basic to go to some super secret unit. There is no chance in basic to prove how awesome you are because just as the name implies everything they teach in basic is basic. There are no complicated missions where you can show off your skills. Everything there is tightly controlled and instructor run. Second elite units are not looking for troublemakers. In fact being one will get you kicked out. SOF units need people they can count on.

The last thing I will bring up is how you commented earlier that somehow you badass friend was using a hunting rifle. You do know that no one outside of certain SOF units has any say so at all to what weapon they use. If he was an infantryman he was using a m16, m4, 249 or a 240. The military does not say well this guy is a bad ass hunter lets give him a hunting rifle. Give me a break you are clueless.
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Yeah. Also apparently he refused orders during a war game in boot camp (they don't run war games in Boot Camp - at most you learn contact front, contact left, contact right, a few hand and arm signals, and how to cross a danger area), and had an entire platoons' worth of M203's in his squad, over which he had control as far as who got assigned. You know, because First Sergeants really reach down and ask recent graduates from Boot Camp how to assign people to rifle squads.
 
US Conservative said:
Good idea.

Its worth mentioning that women have a lower survivability with severe injury. They have weaker bones, less blood, less iron, less connective tissue (skin breaks easier), and less cardiovascular reserve. This means an injured female will have less time until irreversible shock, and frankly death.

Ive also read that females have greatly increased rates of UTI's and yeast infections when actively deployed-these aren't life threatening but they are new problems and can easily take a female out of a fight.
Click to expand...

The scuttlebutt is, that the Chinese Chemical Warfare Corps are already working on a vaginal yeast bomb to be used against our infantry if liberal social engineering continues with in our military and women are allowed to serve as grunts.

Civilians with in the DOD will probably come up with a "Yeast Infection in Combat Medal" to be rated above the Purple Heart.
 
joko104 said:
Does basic training ever filter enlistees into various roles?
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No. You have one "specialized role" that you can identify. It is "the guy who marches in the front of the formation when they go somewhere", which they call a squad leader, who is a trainee like anyone else and exercises zero authority or power. In boot camp you are stripped of decision-making, you go and do exactly where and what you are told. Nor are there war games to deny orders in, for that matter.

That some are not suited for frontline combat, but still usable. Others are for regular usage
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That is part of your contract, which is signed well before you get to Boot Camp. Once you leave Boot Camp and go on to your MOS school you may be selected for variations within the MOS you are assigned. For example, I went on a standard UH (infantry) contract, and once I reached SOI was assigned to the 0351 Assaultman package.

Others have particular skills. You say NEVER. I see nothing to back that up, nor does that make any sense. Advancement and assign in the military is not by random drawing lots as you seemingly believe.
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No, it is about time and performance. For example, the highest rank that you can enter the Marine Corps is a Private First Class. 9 months later, you are a Lance Corporal. In the infantry, you may very well get out at this rank, hence the "Terminal Lance Corporal", but as time goes on your cutting score increases and you may pick up Corporal or Sergeant. "Squad Leader" is a Sergeant Billet. A Sergeant in the Infantry is usually either at the very end of his first contract (if he is awesome), or in his second and/or third. However, the billets can be filled by Corporals as needed, who are also usually near the end of their first term.

All your view means is that they never anything particularly special or skillful about you.
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:lol: as opposed to Rambo McNorris, your buddy.
 
Changed my mind, I'm sticking around. You guys are funny in how much you reveal yourselves. With maybe one exception, none of you were military-killer-warriors. You were unit members, tiny cogs of a big machine, generic. But think you are military genius. Its' comical.

I knew plenty of folks in or were in the military. All but 1 are basically like you. That Marine I've written of the exception. A strange guy. Grew up on a farm. Folks that leave rifles and shotguns leaning against the wall at the back door, ammo on the shelf above. Certainly by age 8 he was heading out with a single shot .22. Hunting was his thing. So was fighting. Two bigger brothers who'd beat him up. Until it came he could beat them up. State wrestling champ. He liked being in a good fight. And he like killing animals. That was his thing. Track them down. Kill them. Not dows or buzzards. A 4.0 student, but decided to go into the Marines before college.

His family was alarmed at his reason. He was blunt to anyone who questioned why he was going into the Marines. He wanted to kill men. To hunt them. Not women. Not children. Not just anyone. He wanted to hunt men in the context of legal military service.

Most bitch of boot camp. When he was on leave after it, he said it was easy other than it took a couple weeks to get used to running with that heavy a pack. He also bitched - that in his opinion over half those enlisted should be washed out - that they were not fit and would only be a liability in combat.

He said that in boot camp, since it known they would be immediately deployed to Afghanistan, they had them do urban setting small unit battle games - that were to be treated as 100% real. When his CO told him when his turn came to lead (he said some, not all, were given opportunity to lead a squad) to attack an insurgent position in a house, he refused to do it that way, because that would get his men killed. I balked at that, saying I didn't believe he could refuse an order. He said it doesn't work that way, not anymore. That in such situations, if a CO had given an order that a squad leader on the scene decides is too much a casualty risk, the squad leader was not to do so. That if the CO didn't like his refusal, then it would go to the next level for review. Apparently the CO didn't care to push the issue.

From that, he and a few others were assigned to take the role of the insurgents. The first time they repealed the Marines and the second time they captured one. He stated the officer above his CO told him and that unit they need to let the Marines win - but that he and his small unit were promptly being sent to Afghanistan.

While there, he said he headed a small squad (I don't remember how many he said it was) and the went to and secured village after village, searching the houses and then moving on. He said the reached the Pakistan border and were told they were the first squad to actually go to the physical border. He opted not to enlist and turned down an offer to become part of a training program for special opts units. His squad suffered no casualities. They had killed enemy. He bitcthed about when the Army rolled into a village, explaining they would piss everyone off by shooting up empty houses and overall playing with their 50 cals. He didn't like air support overhead as it scared off the prey.

I find nothing unbelievable of his story whatsoever nor, for him, anything unusual for him to see it as "hunting" and that his issue rifle, all of which except the full auto had some fashion of a 20mm grenade launcher, would be is "hunting rifle" in his view.

The reason it is probably unbelievable to some of you is because you were nothing special, attracted no special attention, and were generic large unit members. Again with one possible exception, none of you were in small unit patrols nor engaged in seek out and destroy missions - something the Marines have done in essentially every war they've ever been in.

In short, none of you were combat Marines in a hot war zone. One of you may have been in hot zone small unit patrols - something others of you insist never happened.

And you rage because Marines and other small unit hunter-warriors like him were shining stars compared to your military service. So you self defensively ridicule his accounts and those in the military who did similar - and in doing so overall you hope to ridicule the Marines, the Army Rangers, the Seals, all those who were sent out in small unit patrols in hot zones, and the special ops members who take the highest risks of all - all those being roles you have to EARN by excellence, not just being a generic person minimally making it thru boot camp.
 
cpwill said:
No. You have one "specialized role" that you can identify. It is "the guy who marches in the front of the formation when they go somewhere", which they call a squad leader, who is a trainee like anyone else and exercises zero authority or power. In boot camp you are stripped of decision-making, you go and do exactly where and what you are told. Nor are there war games to deny orders in, for that matter.



That is part of your contract, which is signed well before you get to Boot Camp. Once you leave Boot Camp and go on to your MOS school you may be selected for variations within the MOS you are assigned. For example, I went on a standard UH (infantry) contract, and once I reached SOI was assigned to the 0351 Assaultman package.



No, it is about time and performance. For example, the highest rank that you can enter the Marine Corps is a Private First Class. 9 months later, you are a Lance Corporal. In the infantry, you may very well get out at this rank, hence the "Terminal Lance Corporal", but as time goes on your cutting score increases and you may pick up Corporal or Sergeant. "Squad Leader" is a Sergeant Billet. A Sergeant in the Infantry is usually either at the very end of his first contract (if he is awesome), or in his second and/or third. However, the billets can be filled by Corporals as needed, who are also usually near the end of their first term.



:lol: as opposed to Rambo McNorris, your buddy.
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NO ONE would ever call you "Rambo." But do continue your sneering at our military's best warriors who took the most risks.
 
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cpwill said:
No. You have one "specialized role" that you can identify. It is "the guy who marches in the front of the formation when they go somewhere", which they call a squad leader, who is a trainee like anyone else and exercises zero authority or power. In boot camp you are stripped of decision-making, you go and do exactly where and what you are told. Nor are there war games to deny orders in, for that matter.



That is part of your contract, which is signed well before you get to Boot Camp. Once you leave Boot Camp and go on to your MOS school you may be selected for variations within the MOS you are assigned. For example, I went on a standard UH (infantry) contract, and once I reached SOI was assigned to the 0351 Assaultman package.



No, it is about time and performance. For example, the highest rank that you can enter the Marine Corps is a Private First Class. 9 months later, you are a Lance Corporal. In the infantry, you may very well get out at this rank, hence the "Terminal Lance Corporal", but as time goes on your cutting score increases and you may pick up Corporal or Sergeant. "Squad Leader" is a Sergeant Billet. A Sergeant in the Infantry is usually either at the very end of his first contract (if he is awesome), or in his second and/or third. However, the billets can be filled by Corporals as needed, who are also usually near the end of their first term.



:lol: as opposed to Rambo McNorris, your buddy.
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I don't believe what you wrote was the absolute rule during all of the Iraq and Afghanistan era. For a while the military had a deep shortage and had dramatically reduced enlistment requirements and how many they slide thru boot camp. This was particularly true for the Marines. They didn't have enough to go around and re-enlistments were falling thru the floor. I don't know why but the oppressive heat while wearing body armor may have had something to do with that.
 
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joko104 said:
Only a fool does not understand all military rifles also can be called a hunting rifle. I gather you are an anti gun-freak who claims they are OMG! "ASSAULT RIFLES" that have no other usage. He stated he saw himself as hunting and accordingly referred to his rifle as his hunting rifle. He saw his rifle as for the purpose of hunting down the enemy on patrol. I'm confident you saw yours as only for the purpose of cleaning for inspection.

Does basic training ever filter enlistees into various roles? That some are not suited for frontline combat, but still usable. Others are for regular usage. Others have particular skills. You say NEVER. I see nothing to back that up, nor does that make any sense. Advancement and assign in the military is not by random drawing lots as you seemingly believe. All your view means is that they never saw anything particularly special or skillful about you so you remained just one of the generic herd. Go on to explain there are not such thing as special ops either, and if so they are randomly selected.

YOU SHOULD GO START A THREAD OF YOUR VIEW ENTITLED: "MILITARY ASSAULT RIFLES ARE NOT HUNTING RIFLES!" and then continue with some anti-gun rant.

His primary complaint about the Marines and military in general is not washing out people such as you express yourself to be. His view was the military in terms of ground troops should be limited only to the very best - and everyone else is a liability and handicap. He would have washed you out of his small squad quickly.

Leaders are those who aren't just passive followers of the pack relying on time-senority. I know that fella. He's the diametric opposite of your views, and I do believe such skills and leadership abilities, plus initiative, are exactly what the Marines are watching for. There are 10,000,000 potential enlistees like you. Not many like him. I know many who were in military service. None others like him.
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Sorry nice try but you are the one who said he had a semi auto weapon. And guess what regular infantry do not have any semi auto rifles.
To join a special unit there are more or less set in stone routes to take. They all involve trying out in that units selection program and meeting that units standards. No SOF units standard is to be a badass in basic. And no one gets into those units without meeting those standards or skipping selection. In my job I have worked overseas with almost every other SOF element and none of them are picked right out of basic.
Please show me where I said advancement is random. It is based on meeting requirements such as time in service and passing boards not being a badass. you obviously have no idea what being a leader in the military is.

I love how you are being showed to be clueless about the military and your comeback is to insult me. But you are right there is nothing skillful or special about me. That is why I have spent the last 6 years and 4 combat deployments in Special Operations. Oh and you are right that I only use my rifle for inspections that and also being the honor grad at my Special Forces Sniper Course. Also you say none of us would have been in a small unit doing patrols well than I must have just imagined my last 11 month deployment where me and the other 10 members of my team lived in a afghani compound 2 hours from the nearest coalition force. Funny it sure seemed real
And as to your friend kicking me out of his squad seeing as you implied he only had a small stay in the Marines I can guarantee I out rank him so I don't really see that happening. Nice try though
 
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APACHERAT said:
The scuttlebutt is, that the Chinese Chemical Warfare Corps are already working on a vaginal yeast bomb to be used against our infantry if liberal social engineering continues with in our military and women are allowed to serve as grunts.

Civilians with in the DOD will probably come up with a "Yeast Infection in Combat Medal" to be rated above the Purple Heart.
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What if that medal smelled real bad? :)
 
cpwill said:
Yeah. Also apparently he refused orders during a war game in boot camp (they don't run war games in Boot Camp - at most you learn contact front, contact left, contact right, a few hand and arm signals, and how to cross a danger area), and had an entire platoons' worth of M203's in his squad, over which he had control as far as who got assigned. You know, because First Sergeants really reach down and ask recent graduates from Boot Camp how to assign people to rifle squads.
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I know that message is false. There is no chance they would send Marines into a combat zone with NO small unit engagement games. That would be absurd. There were points in time during Iraq and Afghanistan that upon completion of boot camp those enlistees were almost immediately sent to combat. Whether he did that at boot camp itself or something right after boot camp, I dunno. I didn't make a transcript of what he said.

But you view that a person has to be in the Marines for a couple years before sent out and leading a small squad is just wrong. Most who enlisted were in and out in 2, 3 at the most. I think he was in for 3, but not sure.
 
braindrain said:
Sorry nice try but you are the one who said he had a semi auto weapon. And guess what regular infantry do not have any semi auto rifles.
To join a special unit there are more or less set in stone routes to take. They all involve trying out in that units selection program and meeting that units standards. No SOF units standard is to be a badass in basic. And no one gets into those units without meeting those standards or skipping selection. In my job I have worked overseas with almost every other SOF element and none of them are picked right out of basic.
Please show me where I said advancement is random. It is based on meeting requirements such as time in service and passing boards not being a badass. you obviously have no idea what being a leader in the military is.

I love how you are being showed to be clueless about the military and your comeback is to insult me. But you are right there is nothing skillful or special about me. That is why I have spent the last 6 years and 4 combat deployments in Special Operations. Oh and you are right that I only use my rifle for inspections that and also being the honor grad at my Special Forces Sniper Course.
And as to your friend kicking me out of his squad seeing as you implied he only had a small stay in the Marines I can guarantee I out rank him so I don't really see that happening. Nice try though
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I do not believe you. He said none of their rifles except one was full auto. I don't remember if he said it was 3-burst or not. But not full auto. Another former Marine also said he did not have full auto. If there are anyone who was in the Marines in the range of about 2-3ish years ago, they can answer whether full autos were standard issue or not. I suppose I could have misunderstood him. I do know his view is that full autos are worthless for the situation he was in, no more useful than would be a full auto rifle for hunting.

I do not believe you are special ops or a sniper school grad. I believe you think you are.
 
You guys should at least first maybe PM each other to try to get your collective attack consistent.

CPWILL claims the military NEVER has any unit in combat that moves in numbers less than 1000 strong, that the minimal group size in the Hellmand District of Afghanistan was 15,000 - and that American troops NEVER reached the Pakistan border nor ever left 1 city in that District.

Others of you are claiming that service members head out in small "over the wire" for weeks at a time without any support, no supply and even no possible medevac. Why don't you all pick ONE story and stick to it. Then make your case that I don't know anything.
 
joko104 said:
I know that message is false. There is no chance they would send Marines into a combat zone with NO small unit engagement games. That would be absurd. There were points in time during Iraq and Afghanistan that upon completion of boot camp those enlistees were almost immediately sent to combat. Whether he did that at boot camp itself or something right after boot camp, I dunno. I didn't make a transcript of what he said.

But you view that a person has to be in the Marines for a couple years before sent out and leading a small squad is just wrong. Most who enlisted were in and out in 2, 3 at the most. I think he was in for 3, but not sure.
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What you seem not to understand is that every position in the military is for a certain rank. For instance a squad leader in the Marines is CPL or a SGT and the team SGT of a ODA is a MSG. Not a guy who was a badass a basic
 
joko104 said:
I do not believe you. He said none of their rifles except one was full auto. I don't remember if he said it was 3-burst or not. But not full auto. Another former Marine also said he did not have full auto. If there are anyone who was in the Marines in the range of about 2-3ish years ago, they can answer whether full autos were standard issue or not. I suppose I could have misunderstood him. I do know his view is that full autos are worthless for the situation he was in, no more useful than would be a full auto rifle for hunting. I do not believe you are special ops or a sniper school grad. I believe you think you are.
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Well guess what weather it is auto or burst doesn't really matter because neither one of those two things are semi auto as you said he carried.
I really couldn't care less if you beleive me or not. But just to make it interesting if I prove that I am how about you admitting you are full of it and stop talking about things you don't know about. What say you
 
joko104 said:
You guys should at least first maybe PM each other to try to get your collective attack consistent.

CPWILL claims the military NEVER has any unit in combat that moves in numbers less than 1000 strong, that the minimal group size in the Hellmand District of Afghanistan was 15,000 - and that American troops NEVER reached the Pakistan border nor ever left 1 city in that District.

Others of you are claiming that service members head out in small "over the wire" for weeks at a time without any support, no supply and even no possible medevac. Why don't you all pick ONE story and stick to it. Then make your case that I don't know anything.
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Can you please show me where anyone said anyone was outside the wire for weeks with no support supply or medevac cause I missed that. Thanks
 
braindrain said:
What you seem not to understand is that every position in the military is for a certain rank. For instance a squad leader in the Marines is CPL or a SGT and the team SGT of a ODA is a MSG. Not a guy who was a badass a basic
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He was in for, I think, 3 years. He wanted his parents to sign off enlistment at 17, explaining that would allow only 2. They refused - and they won't do a physical at age 17 meaning he could not contract/enlist at that age, I would guess it was 3. Whether it was straight out of boot camp or not, I dunno. You do - if you know anything at all - know an enlistment would be at least 2 years and likely 3 during the Afghan war. I am inclined not to believe that.

Therefore you must be claiming a person could not become a CPL or SGT in the Marines within 3 years during the Afghanistan war. He probably told me his rank, but I don't remember. Next time I talk to him I'll ask for more details - to give more specifics some of you can ridicule hot combat zone Marines over claiming they didn't exist or such.
 
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