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Thread: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

  1. #31
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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Well, maybe those 18-22 year olds need to be taught some professionalism. Either that or maybe they are just TOO young and immature to be in the military at all?
    You've never been in the service, either. Huh? Soldiers require constant adult supervsion and that's a reality that's never going away.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You've never been in the service, either. Huh? Soldiers require constant adult supervsion and that's a reality that's never going away.
    Are you saying they aren't adults?

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    The view that the Marines consist singularly of ground assault soldiers is nave and false. And hand-to-hand combat is increasingly irrelevant anyway. Are men inherently better shots? If not, then the complaint is nothing.

    In addition, there are many situations where women would be more suited than men in foreign countries, given that men aren't even allowed in some settings, just like women are not in other settings. There are situations where women would be more persuasive.

    One real problem Hitler had taking Stalingrad was German troops were limited only to men, Russian troops were not. Women served not only in front line combat groups, but numerous support roles too.

    It has often been pointed out that whether it be Muslim or otherwise, a society that only uses 1/2 it's population are also those most impoverished and limited societies.

    Women have some inherent superiorities. For example, on average women can take more pain than a man.

    But, on the bottom line, the measure of a good soldier being the one who can do the most pull-ups is - simply put - absurd. Even for Marines.
    Women in The Red Army served in all female units.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    .....how long has it been since you spent much time as a single young female in the company of lots of ramped-up, in-shape 18-22 year old males, who were self selected to have a higher bias towards aggression and alpha-male typology and then trained to think they were invincible?

    We had females come out to the FOB. It was the same disaster story it is everywhere else it is tried. The concept of team broke down as everyone tried to get laid. It's a huge problem in the mixed-gender units as well, both on deployment and in the rear. That's why they have to go to all the lengths they do on deployment to try to stop people from hammering away like rabbits.

    If we sent our 50 year olds into combat sure. Maybe. But our 18-22 year olds suffer from the fact that they are between the ages of 18 and 22.

    Now is the part where (typically) the response is "professionalism" and my response is "reality - and in reality appealing to professionalism to paper over real problems results in more dead 18 year old kids" No thanks. I've said enough good-bye's to last me at least until I'm old enough that at least my friends are dying of old age.
    What a bunch of junk.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Women in The Red Army served in all female units.
    And your point is?

    So the debate has now shifted from women in the Marines to men and women in the same tent?

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Unless you're challenging the enemy to a grunting match at the gym; who cares?

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Are you saying they aren't adults?
    I'm serving now, though not with soldiers but sailors, and I can attest to this. It can be hard to tell the difference between my shop and middle school.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Sorry....but despite what you and NP say, we have the best military in the world and the men and women who defend this country deserve respect....not the badmouthing and moaning that you guys engage in.
    We use to have the best military in the world, it's been so dumbed down in the past four years, I don't even recognise it today.

    They have actually pulling entire fighter squadrons out of the air in the middle of a week long combat training mission because the entire squadron has to attend mandatory classroom sensitivity training.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Pull ups.

    Yes, the next war will be decided by who is better with a battle ax.

    Give me a statistic of who many enemy casualties we caused and we suffered in hand-to-hand unarmed combat in Afghanistan and Iraq, since it appears many believe that still determined the outcome of a battle?
    Pull ups were important enough that we had to do them every day in Airborne school to strengthen our upper body in preparation for steering a parachute.

    When I was in instructor one of the lanes I ran was light maneuver operations. One particular lane that really kicked peoples butt (especially the woman) was having to climb a wall and then low crawl a fairly long distance under barbed wire and in sand up to an area where we had them throw hand grenades. What made this tough for many of them is that they had to do it in full gear (including body armor).

    These were Army Warrior Task that every soldier is expected to know and be able to perform. Clearly these task required upper body strength and having some ability to measure that to ensure troops are battle ready is important.

    In the middle of a firefight is not a good time to find out that your fitness isn't really up to par.

    I'm all for continuing to evaluate our physical test to determine if they are a good measure of strength and endurance for the mission but we shouldn't have different standards for different genders (especially in combat arms)

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawker30 View Post
    I'm serving now, though not with soldiers but sailors, and I can attest to this. It can be hard to tell the difference between my shop and middle school.
    Well, I do acknowledge that some of them are fresh out of high school, but that is no excuse for that type of behavior. These are supposed to be people have self-discipline and a lot of GOOD qualities, so I find these claims rather surprising. I'm sorry, but just because there are women around is no reason to lose your mind.

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