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Thread: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    If you say so.

    Everything I've said is simple common sense.
    You are so contradictory too. Why don't we just give them all porn, then they'll just lose interest in real sex altogether.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    Didn't see this coming Female Marines have received ample time (over a year) to prepare for this test which, oh by the way, still isn't to the same standard that it is for males. Sure, they have to get the same bare minimum of 3 that males get. However, their max is 8 whereas mine is 20. So, on a maximum 300 point physical fitness test (PFT) where each of the 3 events (pull ups, crunches, 3 mile run) has the potential to give you 100 points, a female Marine only has to do 40% of the work I have to in order to get 100 points for her pull ups on her PFT. I call bogus. That enables her to be as competitive for promotion as me without having to do the work that I do. Not to mention that she can run her 3 miles in 21 minutes to receive 100 points for that while I have to run it in 18 minutes. If you've ever run a 5K, 3 minutes is an eternity between two runners.

    Some of you will say "Well, that score is only part of what is looked at when considering promotion." I will submit this to you. Every promotion board for E-6, E-7, and E-8/E-9 (this board is conducted jointly) in the Marine Corps has an after action review written for it. In every one of those after action reviews, the board members are asked "What is the first tie breaker between two Marines if there is one spot left in their MOS field to promote?" The answer is ALWAYS "Their PFT score".

    Now, some on this site will say that I am butt hurt because 3 females passed our infantry course. That is mentioned in the article. Not the case. When I know that 16 females began the course and only 3 passed, I'm not worried. Of the 16, 9 failed due to performance reasons. That leaves 7. Of those 7, 4 broke due to hip and knee problems. Those are the classic female breaking points that I've seen in most female injuries. Those occur very frequently at Parris Island as well. So, we have the 3 left. Now, for males, approximately 79% make it through infantry training. 10% of them are dropped for medical reasons. That leaves approximately 11% for performance/legal issues. For those of you who are Marines, it's the classic, always spoken of, 10% that fail. Also of note, the females were required to carry each other during casualty evacuation, movement courses, etc. So, a female weighing 110lbs-140lbs is carrying around her equivalent weight while the males are slinging whichever casualty they see over their shoulder. Again, I call bogus. I'm not a big fan of this social engineering crap. DADT was another issue. I wasn't a supporter of that. It wasn't performance based. A gay guy can fireman's carry a casualty just as effectively (though the casualty may be uncomfortable) as a straight guy. But the vast majority of females cannot do the same. This is a performance thing for me. It is a logistical thing. It is a morale thing. Our military is the best in the world yet we want to mess with the very core of its competence. The members of it. I'm not a big fan.

    Corps Delays Pull-Up Requirements for Female Marines | TIME.com
    Men and women are not equal. We do different things differently-and we are built differently. There are things women can do well in the military-but grunt work isnt one of them.

    Welcome to the liberal fruitopia.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    True, but a man's entire hip isn't going to come apart mid mission if he fails to report an injury either.

    Stress fractures in major load bearing bones are nothing to take lightly.
    I just find it a bit funny because no one's body is made for rucking. LOL
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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    No it isn't because there are PLENTY of people in the military who are not "screwing around." Just because you are weak doesn't mean everyone else is.
    Generally speaking, you're not going to get much of anywhere betting on the "good side" of human nature.

    You're also completely ignoring my point here. Why complicate something that does not need to complicated, especially when there's no guarantee that it will function as effectively as it did before afterwards?

    We'd be needlessly putting women (and men) in harm's way for no objective benefit whatsoever.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    You are so contradictory too. Why don't we just give them all porn, then they'll just lose interest in real sex altogether.
    Ummm... They already have. They have it in droves, as a matter of fact. We were swapping it back and forth on external hard drives like prisoners swap cigarettes when I was overseas.

    Two things though:

    A) In the field, porn isn't really feasible.

    B) Even with porn, many men will still go after the real thing, especially if a woman is actually playing an active role in encouraging contact.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    I just find it a bit funny because no one's body is made for rucking. LOL
    No, they're not.

    However, this doesn't change the fact that women are a lot less able to withstand the strains of it than men happen to be.

    A thirty something year old man who spends 15 years in the infantry is probably going to be in pretty rough shape (bad knees, bad back, marked signs of accelerated aging, etca).

    However, even as bad as it would be for a man, it would be worse for a woman. Most women simply wouldn't survive the job that long. Their body would most likely give out on them.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Generally speaking, you're not going to get much of anywhere betting on the "good side" of human nature.

    You're also completely ignoring my point here. Why complicate something that does not need to complicated, especially when there's no guarantee that it will function as effectively as it did before afterwards?

    We'd be needlessly putting women (and men) in harm's way for no objective benefit whatsoever.



    Ummm... They already have. They have it in droves, as a matter of fact. We were swapping it back and forth on external hard drives like prisoners swap cigarettes when I was overseas.

    Two things though:

    A) In the field, porn isn't really feasible.

    B) Even with porn, many men will still go after the real thing, especially if a woman is actually playing an active role in encouraging contact.
    For no benefit? I beg to differ. Well if the woman is encouraging contact, then she should be disciplined. Just because some people cannot control themselves (and it certainly is FAR from a majority), that is no reason to disallow women who can meet the physical fitness standards. Most of these kinds of women would more than like be "big and strong" women and not the "sex kitten" type that most men would be lusting over all the time.

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    No, they're not.

    However, this doesn't change the fact that women are a lot less able to withstand the strains of it than men happen to be.

    A thirty something year old man who spends 15 years in the infantry is probably going to be in pretty rough shape (bad knees, bad back, marked signs of accelerated aging, etca).

    However, even as bad as it would be for a man, it would be worse for a woman. Most women simply wouldn't survive the job that long. Their body would most likely give out on them.
    Wouldn't know - my husband's out and it was a fight to go out gracefully on a medical retirement due to injuries sustained while in the service. That's my only direct experience.
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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    For no benefit? I beg to differ.
    So, what's the benefit? I see none.

    Men are getting the job done just fine, and have been for centuries. I see no evidence whatsoever to suggest that the inclusion of women would increase combat effectiveness.

    Well if the woman is encouraging contact, then she should be disciplined. Just because some people cannot control themselves (and it certainly is FAR from a majority), that is no reason to disallow women who can meet the physical fitness standards. Most of these kinds of women would more than like be "big and strong" women and not the "sex kitten" type that most men would be lusting over all the time.
    Maybe not, but a lot of men will make due with what's available.

    Again, even putting all of that aside, how does it benefit anyone to introduce this unnecessary dynamic to the battlefield in the first place?

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    So, what's the benefit? I see none.

    Men are getting the job done just fine, and have been for centuries. I see no evidence whatsoever to suggest that the inclusion of women would increase combat effectiveness.



    Maybe not, but a lot of men will make due with what's available.

    Again, even putting all of that aside, how does it benefit anyone to introduce this unnecessary dynamic to the battlefield in the first place?
    Anyone who is willing to put their life on the line for their country is an asset to the military. By observation of this thread, it's pretty clear that the problem isn't the women but the men and how they look at their women counterparts. Grow up!

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    Re: Marine Corp Delays Pull-Up Requirement for Female Marines

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Anyone who is willing to put their life on the line for their country is an asset to the military. By observation of this thread, it's pretty clear that the problem isn't the women but the men and how they look at their women counterparts. Grow up!
    Just because someone thinks that they can do something, doesn't necessarily mean that are actually capable of doing so.

    You are certainly entitled to your opinions on this. I'm simply telling you that everything we know about war and warriors would seem to indicate that gender integrated combat units are not a very good idea.

    Noble intentions are no substitute for practical workability.

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