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Thread: Senate approves nuclear option

  1. #721
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Visbek View Post
    His "insane" habit is because the Republicans are categorically refusing to accept the basic function of a President to fill nominations.



    91% of Bush's judicial nominees were approved by the Senate. Obama? 76%.

    Bush's appointees had to wait 43 days on average for a confirmation vote. Obama? 107.

    The number of judicial vacancies is increasing. Several agency nominations, such as the CPA and ATF, have been opposed not because time was needed to evaluate the nominees, but out of sheer political opposition to those agencies.


    And let's face it: The filibuster, when sparingly used, is fine. Its use has gone completely off the rails, and its elimination is well overdue. Let's hope this keeps up, and they get rid of it (or at least, permanently revert to talking filibusters) in the near future.
    Where are you getting these numbers. This link quotes completely different data: Are Republicans really blocking Obama

    According to a May report from the Congressional Research Service, President Obama had 71.4% of his circuit court nominees approved during his first term, which is slightly better than George W. Bush’s 67.3% level of success during his first term.

    President Obama also didn't fare the worst when it comes to district court nominees. During his first term, 82.7% of Obama’s district court nominees were approved, George H.W. Bush had 76.9% of his nominees approved
    For example, during Reagan’s first term, it only took 45.5 days for one of his nominees to get approved. That number escalated only marginally over the next 20 years. But by the time George W. Bush was in office, the number skyrocketed to 277 days. Obama has fared slightly better than Bush, with his nominees taking 225.5 days to get approved. But historically speaking, it’s still a severe departure from most presidencies.

    Obama’s district court nominees have also suffered from extended confirmation delays. Again, Reagan’s nominees breezed through, with just a 28-day waiting period during his first term, compared with 215 days for Obama.
    It is out of control, from BOTH SIDES. Who started it, does not matter, but the invokation of the Nuclear Option is a bad move for the Republic.
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  2. #722
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    so sometimes delay is a good thing
    And when "sometimes" become "every time," it is not a good thing. The GOP couldn't play with their toy responsibly, so now nobody gets to have it.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  3. #723
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Ewer View Post
    Democrats don't filibuster presidential appointments.
    That is a republicon thing .
    I'd say you have a very short memory, but chances are, you were never aware of this to begin with:

    During the 108th Congress in which the Republicans regained control of the Senate by a 51-49 margin, the nominees that the Senate Democrats had blocked in the 107th Congress began to be moved through the now Republican Senate Judiciary Committee.[10] Subsequently Senate Democrats started to filibuster judicial nominees. On February 12, 2003, Miguel Estrada, a nominee for the D.C. Circuit, became the first court of appeals nominee ever to be successfully filibustered.[citation needed] Later, nine other conservative court of appeals nominees were also filibustered. These nine were Priscilla Owen, Charles W. Pickering, Carolyn Kuhl, David W. McKeague, Henry Saad, Richard Allen Griffin, William H. Pryor, William Gerry Myers III and Janice Rogers Brown.[11] Three of the nominees (Estrada, Pickering and Kuhl) withdrew their nominations before the end of the 108th Congress.

    As a result of these ten filibusters, Senate Republicans began to threaten to change the existing Senate rules by using what Senator Trent Lott termed the "nuclear option". This change in rules would eliminate the use of the filibuster to prevent judicial confirmation votes. However, in the 108th Congress, with only a two vote majority, the Republicans were in a weak position to implement this procedural maneuver.
    George W. Bush judicial appointment controversies - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Chiefgator View Post
    Where are you getting these numbers. This link quotes completely different data: Are Republicans really blocking Obama



    It is out of control, from BOTH SIDES. Who started it, does not matter, but the invokation of the Nuclear Option is a bad move for the Republic.
    It's just changing certain appointments back to the constitutionally-identified simple majority rather than the de-facto supermajority that it has become. It's hardly an earth-shattering event and I really wish the media would stop referring it by the same name we use to identify the worst weapons ever created by mankind.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  5. #725
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    And when "sometimes" become "every time," it is not a good thing. The GOP couldn't play with their toy responsibly, so now nobody gets to have it.
    I really don't think you or Harry Reid are all that objective when it comes to using the term "responsible"



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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    And when "sometimes" become "every time," it is not a good thing.
    You let us know when, indeed, it becomes "every time."

    The Congressional Research Service released a report in May analyzing the fate of Mr. Obama’s first-term judicial nominees compared to the fates of those nominated by other presidents. A look at the confirmation rates for district court nominees picked by the past four presidents shows a mixed bag: For Mr. Obama, the Senate approved 143 of his 173 nominees; for President George W. Bush, 170 of 179 nominees; for President Bill Clinton, 170 of 198 nominees; and for President George H.W. Bush, 150 of 195 nominees.

    For federal appeals court nominees, President George W. Bush saw 35 of his 52 nominees confirmed, and, so far, 30 of Mr. Obama’s 42 nominees have been confirmed. Presidents Clinton, George H.W. Bush, and Ronald Reagan all saw significantly higher confirmation rates for their appeals court nominees.

    Mr. Obama is also the only one of the five most recent presidents whose average and median waiting time for circuit and district court nominees from confirmation to nomination was more than six months.
    Do Obama Nominees Face Stiffer Senate Opposition? - Washington Wire - WSJ
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    we can not allow ourselves to devolve into a "winner take all" form of government.
    Winner takes all translates into "majority rule"
    That was good enough for the framers of the constitution but it is not good enough for you?
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    The only way of an easing up of the political poisonous atmospher in D.C. is if we were, as voters to send most packing.
    Actually, if you read Mann and Orenstein's book, you'll see how the voter impulse to "throw out da bums" is counterproductive to that goal.


    Then you have the problem in the house where gerrymandering creats safe districts which in itself causes those who sit in them to become very hard left and right.
    True... but that doesn't explain partisanship in the Senate, Presidency, governorships and so forth.


    Siding with one side or the other is your perogitive. I prefer to blame both parties.
    And again, in this particular case that's not warranted.

    The Republicans, starting with Gingrich, have increasingly chosen not to compromise, and prefer to blow things up when they don't get their way. It's a direct result of their anti-government, anti-democratic attitudes, bomb-throwing tactics, and penchant for disenfranchisement.


    Speaking of irony, how about the party most known for protecting minority rights just nuked the minorty party of its rights.
    No, they certainly haven't. They have not stopped the Republicans from voting on appointments or legislature.

    What happened is in 2005, the Democrats got a bit obstructionist of Bush appointments, so the Republicans started threatening to remove the filibuster. When Obama took office, the Republican obstructionist tactics went off the scale. In addition, both sides made a deal earlier this year -- the Republicans would lift their filibusters on a bunch of appointees, and the Dems wouldn't change the Senate rules during the recess period. The Republicans reneged on the deal, so the filibuster rules got partially removed.


    FYI I was opposed to it in 2005 also. Like I said I am a traditionalist.
    A traditionalist to when? 1975? If you were truly a "traditionalist," you'd be howling over the abuse of the filibuster in the past ~10 years.

    New York was the last state in the US to adopt no-fault divorce. Should they have continued to block no-fault divorces because of "tradition"?

    On a side note, tradition for its own sake is detrimental. The reason why you have a rule is because it accomplishes a goal. When it hinders that goal, it's time to get rid of the rule, no matter how old it is.


    I would rather suffer though non-appointments for a year or two than see protection of the minority eliminated.
    Yeah, that would mean 4 or 5 years. It would mean vacancies at top agencies and judicial appointments. Or, in the case of the ATF, seven.


    Once used, it will become common place, hence I am of the oppinion to just do away with it now.
    That is exactly what has happened to the filibuster. It has become commonplace, and has changed the entire Senate from needing a simple majority (as has been the case for decades) into requiring a supermajority to get anything done.


    I still think they, the Democrats should have listen to Levin. He was in the minority once before....
    So was Reid, who has been a senator since 1987. So have many senators, who have been in office since before 2005.


    I wonder if there are any lessons to be learned for the 21st of November action and if there are, what are they?
    The lesson ought to be: "The time for obstructionism is over."

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    I'd say you have a very short memory, but chances are, you were never aware of this to begin with:


    See the chart and tell me that Democrats abused the filibuster the same as the republicons.
    Again it is a republicon thing to filibuster EVERY nomination.
    filibuster-dead-03.jpg
    McConnell brought this on himself.
    He is a stubborn and stupid man.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    The senate writes their own rules, so let them!

    The filibuster has been used like the Golden Snitch, and Republicans have figured out they can just catch it on the way out on every game. So they get their way, and good for them, but guess what? Nobody gets to play the game.
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