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Thread: Senate approves nuclear option

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    I think we need to remember this current move only applies to non SCOTUS judicial nominees (not legislation), I don't think even Reid will be eager to extend the end to filibuster any farther than this, knowing the shoe will someday be on the other foot. As has been mentioned this move is largely so they can pack the DC court unopposed and while they still have the window to get it done. I think they fear what may be coming in 2014.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by cpgrad08 View Post
    It will come back to hunt them. When there is a Republican President and Republican Majority in the Senate. The Dems will be powerless to stop their Appointments. Also if there is a Dem president and Rep. Senate. The Dems will be powerless to stop the Reps from shooting down all his Appts.
    I disagree...the filibuster isn't possible any longer. It was fine when it was used under special circumstances. A President leaving trying to confirm a large number of individuals before he leaves or when side feels VERY strongly about a nominee but the system has broken down. Dems in the Senate made their decision. They would prefer to actually get some nominations when in charge then get none and chance a rule change if they behave the same way as Republicans. Sorry...the truth is Republicans broke the filibuster.
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I disagree...the filibuster isn't possible any longer. It was fine when it was used under special circumstances. A President leaving trying to confirm a large number of individuals before he leaves or when side feels VERY strongly about a nominee but the system has broken down. Dems in the Senate made their decision. They would prefer to actually get some nominations when in charge then get none and chance a rule change if they behave the same way as Republicans. Sorry...the truth is Republicans broke the filibuster.
    And you think that when the Democrats are a minority again this won't comeback to hunt them since they will have no weapons to fight with remember Dems. filibustered President Bush's nominations.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    But all of us will be affected. After the courts are stacked we will have no recourse to the machinations of the two million busybody bureaucrats who will harass, harry, and hound the citizens. EPA and Interior will be the worst offenders.
    No problem, just let the republicans gain control of the senate while keeping the house and invoke the Senator Harry Reid option and they can do away with the EPA and Interior with just 51 votes in the senate. This may be the best thing the republicans could have hoped for is used right.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I disagree...the filibuster isn't possible any longer. It was fine when it was used under special circumstances. A President leaving trying to confirm a large number of individuals before he leaves or when side feels VERY strongly about a nominee but the system has broken down. Dems in the Senate made their decision. They would prefer to actually get some nominations when in charge then get none and chance a rule change if they behave the same way as Republicans. Sorry...the truth is Republicans broke the filibuster.
    Again, you can keep throwing out this lie but it doesn't make it true. The increase in "filibuster" cloture votes (there have been no actual filibusters during Obama's presidency) is ONLY because of Harry Reid's insane habit of calling for a cloture vote on everything. This isn't up for debate, Reid called 90% of his cloture votes when the votes would not have resulted in a filibuster. He called cloture votes at nearly 3 times the average with an actually serious threat of filibuster happening at a lower rate than any prior senate.

    You have allowed a petty, destructive little man poison your brain with the simplest of political parlor tricks.

    Let's talk numbers for the ignorant left. Let's compare the current Senate (113th) which is the worst year for Obama nominees with a 81% cloture success to the 108th Senate under Republican.

    Care to guess what percentage of Bush nominees made it through the Senate in that Senate session? 15%. FIFTEEN PERCENT.
    Last edited by jmotivator; 11-22-13 at 04:29 PM.
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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    Yeah, I can see that. Wildly swinging pendulum with ever increasing speeds and extremes whipsawing back and forth.
    Not sure that's really the best thing for the country.
    What most people don't realize the filibuster added a bit of stability to our system. It prevented this wild swings. Now that the cat is out of the bag with this nuclear option that can be used by any and all majority leaders, they might as well go ahead and do away with the filibuster completely. An example of would could happen is Obamacare was passed during President Obama and a Democratic majority in the senate. Come 2017, if the GOP wins the white house and take control of the the senate, they can repeal Obamacare by just 51 votes and there is nothing the Democrats can do about it but offer the Republican "CONGRATULATIONS." After all it was the Democrats that let this monster loose.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    What most people don't realize the filibuster added a bit of stability to our system. It prevented this wild swings. Now that the cat is out of the bag with this nuclear option that can be used by any and all majority leaders, they might as well go ahead and do away with the filibuster completely. An example of would could happen is Obamacare was passed during President Obama and a Democratic majority in the senate. Come 2017, if the GOP wins the white house and take control of the the senate, they can repeal Obamacare by just 51 votes and there is nothing the Democrats can do about it but offer the Republican "CONGRATULATIONS." After all it was the Democrats that let this monster loose.




    Pretty much says it all.....and Reid's thinking. No mistaking where he stands now.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    I think it's safe to say that the current filibuster is effectively dead. But I don't think you can lay that on Reid for better or worse.

    I like the filibuster, and think that minority rights are an important part of the Senate. But the filibuster has been broken.

    The bottom line is that the minority party had become obstructionist just to be obstructionist. How can anyone rationally defend holding up a nominee for almost two years; especially when that nominee received 90+ confirmation votes with zero objections? Neither party is going to get a super-majority any time soon. The only way for the senate to function moving forward was for something to happen.

    IMO, the senate needs to settle on a nuclear proof filibuster that is *MUCH* harder to use. Bring back the mandatory speaking part of the filibuster. If you want to stop the senate from functioning, you should have to get up and tell us why.
    I hear you. I think the misuse of the filibuster along with tabling all bills from the house became tit for tat. It is the current leaders in the senate, Reid and McConnell that caused this to happen. Both IMO put their party way above the needs and good of the nation. This would have never occurred when we had Daschle and Lott as leaders of the senate or Dole and Mitchell for way back when Robert Byrd and Howard Baker were the majority and minority leaders. Those leaders knew how to talk to each other, how to work things out with each other, they were willing to compromise, to give and take, to work to move legislation and nominees along. None of them would have thought about bringing up the nuclear option and certainly none would have used it.

    If we had two different leaders in the senate, perhaps an Alexander and a Leahey or you pick them, this would have never happened. it is said politics is the art of the possible. With Reid and McConnell and their attitude of I want 100% or nothing, I want to stop your party cold and give your party the time of day, I do not want you to succeed at anything, I guess this was bound to happen. It is the leaders of the senate that caused this, not the arcane or old rules. They worked just fine and protected the minority party rights, but the leaders have to be willing to work together or as you have seen, you will get nuked.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    The result will become increasing radicalization of federal courts - radically to the left appointees if a Democrat president and senate and radically to the right appointees if a Republican president and senate.

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    Re: Senate approves nuclear option

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    Nice fantasy. The problem is if the ACA exists in 2016 (and, by some miracle against all odds, the Reps can actually win the white house), the ACA will be firmly entrenched and not repeal-able. In fact, you can't really repeal now. You would have to come with something that would protect those that already depend on it (those with pre-existing conditions, for example).
    It is repealable. In fact if and this is a big if, if it looks like the 7 democratic senators from red states like they will lose their seats, it does now for 4 of them. They will join a couple of other conservative democrats like Manchin calling for it repeal early next year to mid summer. When it comes to politicians getting re-elected and self preservation is number one. Me, I will just wait and see what happens. Rumors are already afloat about this.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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