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Thread: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate’ fo

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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    Is this opposite day or WTF!!!! I don't believe he could've shown more love with those the UMC disagrees than to wed two who love each other. How is being loving and caring to his son, not in that vein? It seems to me that it's the gang who's trying to oust him that have problems "with love to those with whom we disagree."

    If this posts twice, sorry. I can't seem to edit anymore with a double post. I've mentioned it in feedback, but I'm being mostly ignored it seems.
    It did that for me with FIREFOX and I also posted on it. Was urged to use Explorer.

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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    I agree with the original post.

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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    My wife's father is a Methodist minister. He does not oppose gay rights and it seems most the members of his large congregation don't either, but it is an evolving process.

    In the OP story, it wasn't the pastor's congregation that made this decision.That was his son appears to have made the difference. Prejudices often fall away when it becomes your own family member you are suppose to reject or condemn. But this also means he had a stake in his decision either way.

    I would question his son having his father do this given it would cost his father his career and income. The father sacrificed for him, but not the son for the father. In my opinion the son should not have used his father this way. Just my opinion.
    Last edited by joko104; 11-20-13 at 03:47 PM.

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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post

    good for pastor Frank Schaefer for standing up for his son and what he believes is right.

    Also be clear, i also FULLY support the church's right to suspend him etc. That is their right and thier choice, they are free and clear to make it.
    Agree with both statements.
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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    Excellent! The man should be awarded a medal not canned. I'm curious though, at the end of the month, what if he refuses to give up his pastorship? I mean they can keep him from having a congregation, for a while anyway, by kicking out of a particular church, but can they revoke his credentials in such a way as to matter to the state that already recognizes him as a pastor? I didn't think that was possible. So perhaps he should just re-congregate with like minded parishioners
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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    It did that for me with FIREFOX and I also posted on it. Was urged to use Explorer.
    It's never been a problem for me till about three days ago. It is Firefox, I don't have IE and don't really want to install it. One browser should be enough. I've cleared cookies, rolled Firefox back to an earlier version, and allowed scripts globally and still no luck. Thanks for the info.
    jallman: "It's all good. At least you have a thick skin and can take being poked fun back at without crying. "

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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Large religious organizations, like any organization (or government), evolve slowly, but do evolve. For example, while the Catholic church condemns divorce without church permission, and do not allow fornication/unmarried sex or cohabitation, they do not put them out of the church for it. However, such priests won't do a wedding for someone divorced UNLESS the church first has approved of the divorce (which can be done retroactive to the legal divorce.)

    Generally, if anyone curses the doctrines of their own denomination and defies them while doing it, they will be removed.

    Obviously he should stand on his beliefs, and it likely they would not have done this if he preached for gay rights equality. But what he did will get you fired.

    BOSSES - and that's who the home office of the church is - give employees bad and dumb work orders all the time. You can complain of it, but if you just break it you can be fired unless the work order was illegal or clearly dangerous. That is true even with the strictest union job protection contract.

    Again, his son shouldn't have put him in this position, but I get the feeling he wanted to be a martyr maybe anyway.

    BUT was this is best course to change the Methodist Church? OR should he have instead used his status, pulpit and even right to speak at Methodist conventions? "The pen (and voice) is mighty than the sword." But he chose the sword. I think he could have done more in the long run if he had stayed in the church. Was suicide (analogous) really his best choice among his options?

    I don't think so. He could, instead, have attended his son's wedding elsewhere officiated by a non-Methodist minister - but his father could have given a blessing and prayer for the wedding, members of the congregation there - and then had the reception at the church. He could have given them both communion and from the pulpit bragged of his son and his spouse, while making his statements/sermon in support of gay rights. He COULD have pushed the envelope without the employment and status suicide - ie to not have become a hothead.

    It is open in my wife's father's church - and it is a big one, very mainstream - that he and the majority of members, elders, teachers etc support gay marriage rights and LGTB rights. And that is largely probably due to family relationships and friendships - personally and within the church - in such feelings and changing attitudes. BUT the church itself is owned by the denomination. So while he would vote at conventions to allow gay marriages (and gay ministers), he and the members aren't going to take over the church analogous to barracading themselves in it either - nor take actions known to get them permanently evicted from it either.
    Last edited by joko104; 11-20-13 at 03:54 PM.

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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    It's never been a problem for me till about three days ago. It is Firefox, I don't have IE and don't really want to install it. One browser should be enough. I've cleared cookies, rolled Firefox back to an earlier version, and allowed scripts globally and still no luck. Thanks for the info.
    Then DO NOT USE THE BACK BUTTON when doing messages. And if you go to edit it and it adds all the computer cyptology (html language), if you submit that is likely going to also be a double post (or a double thread if your starting one.)

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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Then DO NOT USE THE BACK BUTTON when doing messages. And if you go to edit it and it adds all the computer cyptology (html language), if you submit that is likely going to also be a double post (or a double thread if your starting one.)
    When I try to edit, or even reply though all I get is a blanked out, unusable grey dialog box. With the reply, I can double click the reply and get to a clean new page, but that isn't working for edit. So I guess for a while y'all will just have to forgive some typos and what not, and I'll go back to the old way before forums could be easily edited and just add a post with the correction after an * for anything more important than a typo.
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    Re: Pa. pastor suspended for performing gay wedding says he’ll be ‘outspoken advocate

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    They can't stop him from anything.
    Well, he is an employee. He can be fired. He should quit, if he finds that his proffession is no longer one he can fulfill in good conscience... but it looks like he wants to see himself as some kind of martyr.

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