Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges[W:287]

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

j-mac said:

Just as a question J, how would she be able to tell the difference between a polite knock, and an open handed pounding on the screen door at 4:30 am....Was she there?

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you answer is right in your question, you wanting a difference and playing word games is meaningless!
ive told my own daughter not to "bang" on the door like that, all it means is loud forceful strike unless you know and can show it factually means something else?

you seem to want it to have some type of merit, therefor you want the official report to say something else or just had to add banging, why?


the answer is its meaningless but since the professionals are neutral and educated they use knock because there was no evidence of attempted forced entry (meaning marks on the door etc) there has been no statments made by the home owner about trying to gain access etc.

He didnt talk to the media they didnt even know who he was in the beginning. Did that come from some official report? do you have a link and quote? where does banging come from? did he say that to police, where you there?

So they use knock based on evidence and the home owners words that they know of.


even more evident of your current bias and or lack of being objective is why did you add "politie" to the word knock?
than say "open hand pounding"? seems you are trying to paint a picture based on the opinion in your mind and not reality

knock has no description it could be violent, it could be polite?

just a question, why did you feel the need to change that word based on nothing official?

again my list is based off of the known officially reports facts not fantasy or colorful suggestive language, could they change, yes, but for now they are current

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Tettsuo said:

So pointing a gun at someone's face and shooting them, is not intent to kill? Are you serious?

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Did you bother to read the actual Law?
Of course not.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Tettsuo said:

I didn't know banging on someone's door is now reason enough to shoot their face off.

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Accidental discharge is not called a reason to shoot a person's face off, or didn't you know that?

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

j-mac said:

There you go making **** up again...Nowhere did I say "front door" did I? In fact, the article you cherry picked to refute what I was saying, says this...

"Could there be valid argument of self-defense in this case if the defendant was behind a locked screen door? “Certainly that’s a possibility,” says Henning."

Now instead of making stuff up, and not even apparently reading your own articles, just try being honest for a change.

I don't know if it was a justified shooting or not, but I do know that at 4:30am, in not the best of neighborhoods in Detroit, and you are awoken by a drunk person banging on your door, and shouting at you, that is not going to end well....And it didn't....The justice system will have the final word.

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You bring up something I hadn't thought of. You're right. Shooting "thru the screen" at close range does NOT necessarily mean the screen door was locked OR closed. A lot of screen doors have locks that don't work and a lot of people don't lock them. We don't.

It is possible that at the same time he was opening the door she was opening the screen door. So when he opened the door he saw some covered blood coming at him thru the screen door she was opening and coming towards him at the same time out of the dark at 3:30 am. That would totally freak out and panic anyone. If a person had a firearm and wouldn't used it even in that situation, what good is a firearm? In that sequence, he would have fired thru the screen of the partly open screen door she was coming thru towards him.

There would be no way to know if the screen door was locked or not by evidence. I MAJOR piece of evidence would be whether her DNA and/or prints were on screen door, screen door handle and/or front door. Was she "pounding on the door?" or "pounding on the screen?" She MAY have OPENED the screen door and was pounding on the door. He opens - shotgun in his hand to her right into his face - her all bloody and looking maybe crazed - coming in at him - and boom! What would be your reaction if you opened your front door to someone knocking - and when you did a bloody crazed person was opening the screen door coming starting at you?

I'm not saying that happened, but facts published don't prevent it either. On what has been published, this can be speculated in all different directions.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

j-mac said:

Prove "intent" then in this case....I'll wait.

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The direction the gun was pointed is intentional. Guns don't point themselves. Wherever they are pointed, it is the result of the deliberate and intentional actions of the person pointing it.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

j-mac said:

How do you know he knew it was pointing at her face? Are you serious?

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because when it went off, her face went bye-bye

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Excon said:

Accidental discharge is not called a reason to shoot a person's face off, or didn't you know that?

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"Accident discharge" is just something a person in that situation would say. I don't put much stock in it either way. I think "panic firing" more accurate. Not necessarily a defense to manslaughter, but I think that more accurate as to what happened.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

sangha said:

The direction the gun was pointed is intentional. Guns don't point themselves. Wherever they are pointed, it is the result of the deliberate and intentional actions of the person pointing it.

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That's BS!

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Excon said:

Play the video in the player to hear it.

Wafer says: "Uh yes... I just shot somebody on my front porch. with a shotgun, banging on my door." Wafer gives his address (we deleted the address in our post) and ends the call by saying "thank you" and hanging up, even as police dispatch continued.

Audio: 911 call made by Theodore Wafer after he shot Renisha McB - Fox 2 News Headlines​

2.)Please note that he didn't say it was a girl he shot.
He may not have known.


3.). Pointing out it's relevancy should be apparent to you.

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1.) good job with the link but now tell me what banging means (legally) since i have said that to my daughter and what its merit is, also again ill be sticking with the police report since they base it off of evidence see post 251 for further factual explanation of it being meaningless.

2.) so you cant point it out because i didnt, please note i never said he knew it was a girl, another thing i never pointed out because its not fact.
do you understand how a list of facts work?

3.) nope because factually nothing you have pointed out has changed any facts i listed nor are relevant to a list of facts

assumptions on top of the facts are meanignless

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

joko104 said:

"Accident discharge" is just something a person in that situation would say. I don't put much stock in it either way. I think "panic firing" more accurate. Not necessarily a defense to manslaughter, but I think that more accurate as to what happened.

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I don't care whether you think a person would say that or not. He said it. It is the evidence that we have at this time.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Excon said:

I don't care whether you think a person would say that or not. He said it. It is the evidence that we have at this time.

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Well, maybe they'll call you as a PhD linguistics expert with years of research on this specific word usage to explain how every English speaking person uses the word "accidental" exactly as you do. :roll:

People tried to pick apart every single word Zimmerman said too.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

AGENT J said:

you answer is right in your question, you wanting a difference and playing word games is meaningless!

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I wasn't 'playing word games', I was asking a question.

I've told my own daughter not to "bang" on the door like that, all it means is loud forceful strike unless you know and can show it factually means something else?

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No, I get it, and exactly what I am asking....The prosecutor is making the distinction between a "knock", and "banging" which here you agree are two different things....

you seem to want it to have some type of merit, therefor you want the official report to say something else or just had to add banging, why?

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I didn't "add" banging, that was reported by the 911 call as how Wafer described it.

the answer is its meaningless but since the professionals are neutral and educated they use knock because there was no evidence of attempted forced entry (meaning marks on the door etc) there has been no statments made by the home owner about trying to gain access etc.

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I would disagree...I think it has meaning as to what state of mind Wafer may have been in at the time, 4:30am, as you have already agreed that a knock is different from a banging.

He didnt talk to the media they didnt even know who he was in the beginning. Did that come from some official report? do you have a link and quote? where does banging come from? did he say that to police, where you there?

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It is linked in the op, as well as sangha's article from the atlantic....go back and read it.

So they use knock based on evidence and the home owners words that they know of.

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The homeowner, told 911, 'banging'....So what evidence shows the difference between a knock, and a bang?

even more evident of your current bias and or lack of being objective is why did you add "politie" to the word knock?
than say "open hand pounding"? seems you are trying to paint a picture based on the opinion in your mind and not reality

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Oh my....you already acknowledged that a knock is different from a bang.

just a question, why did you feel the need to change that word based on nothing official?

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I was asking you a question....Why do you feel the need to be so defensive?

again my list is based off of know on officially reported facts not fantasy, could they change, yes, but for now they are current

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Ok, so, is there a difference between a 'knock' and 'banging'?

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

A curious question...

Any of you think if he KNEW she was dead that he should have FIRST called an attorney to make certain he perfectly crafted his phone call?

Could/should that be held against him - that he first called an attorney was an indication of feeling guilt or that he did something illegal? I know there are many on this forum who say NEVER talk to the police. What about in this most legally dangerous situation - and you KNOW they are recording you.

Maybe you SHOULD call and attorney and have the ATTORNEY call the police.

Was he even legally required to call 911 at all? If so, what would that law be?

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

A CCW trainer I know ALWAYS tells people if they ever do shoot someone, NEVER talk to the police for 48 hours. Tell them you are too upset to talk to them, too much under stress. If they push you, then say you want an attorney present.

In this situation, should he had only said, "Send an ambulance immediately to (address)" and hung up? There would be no reason for him to even also say "send police" if he believed he had not done anything wrong. Just an ambulance to pick up the body.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

j-mac said:

1.)I wasn't 'playing word games', I was asking a question.
2.)No, I get it, and exactly what I am asking....The prosecutor is making the distinction between a "knock", and "banging" which here you agree are two different things....
3.) I didn't "add" banging, that was reported by the 911 call as how Wafer described it.
4.) I would disagree...I think it has meaning as to what state of mind Wafer may have been in at the time, 4:30am, as you have already agreed that a knock is different from a banging.
5.) It is linked in the op, as well as sangha's article from the atlantic....go back and read it.
6.) The homeowner, told 911, 'banging'....So what evidence shows the difference between a knock, and a bang?
7.) Oh my....you already acknowledged that a knock is different from a bang.
8.) I was asking you a question....Why do you feel the need to be so defensive?



9.) Ok, so, is there a difference between a 'knock' and 'banging'?

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1.) reality seems you are
2.) no by definition they can be the same, one is suggestive though
3.) yes but yet the official police report doesn't use it, so thats adding

if you would like me to add to the facts this line i gladly will

"homeowner claims driver was banging on door"

would you like this added?

4.) no its still meaningless because legally it doesnt change anything and no i have not said they are different, they can be equal but one is suggestive and colorful language.

5.) see #3 and #4, i will add that statement if you like

6.) as i already pointed out they are the same and legally meaningless unless there is physical evidence that would show attempted forced entry, did you not read and understand this the first time

7.) dont want to answer the question because you know it exposes you huh? go it
and oh my lol nope just that one is colorful and suggestive but legally and definition wise they are not

ill ask again, lets see if you dodge it again
why did you add "politie" to the word knock?
than say "open hand pounding"? seems you are trying to paint a picture based on the opinion in your mind and not reality


8.) who is defensive lmao did you think that deflection would work.
now answer the question, why did you feel the need to change my list?

9.) nope, not legally and definition wise they can be the same one is just suggestive

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

FACT LIST

additions made to make everyone happy



car wreck a little before 1
-cell phone was dead
-911 was called to report accident by passer by/ neighbor
-People stopped to help driver
-driver is a 19yr old woman 5'4"
-driver was disoriented and bloody
-driver left scene
-driver returned to scene, 911 was called again to report this about 1:25
-cops and EMS show up to seen about 1:42, driver is gone
-driver left scene
-County prosecutor statement says driver knocked on locked screen door about a mile away and there is no evidence of forced entry
-home owner opened interior door
-home owner is 54yr old man, over 6ft and 200lbs
-driver was shot in the face through locked screen door
-911 was called to report shooting by home owner, home owner claims the following:
"Uh yes... I just shot somebody on my front porch with a shotgun, banging on my door." Wafer gives his address (we deleted the address in our post) and ends the call by saying "thank you" and hanging up, even as ---police dispatch continued.
-911 dispatched police
-911 called homeowner back and he confirmed he shot someone he didnt know on his porch
-police arrive find driver on porch with large hole in face



autopsy confirms homicide and shot in face at a distance
toxicology reveals drinking and weed in driver


Murder 2 charges have been filed along with man slaughter and possession of a firearm during the attempted commission of a felony or commission of a felony.

anything else feel free to add with links

also any further audio of the 911 claims please post the official audio or transcript and ill gladly add them

more specifically the call back

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Excon said:

Wrong you are.
And quite frankly a really absurd reply.
Banging heard from the door would sound like a person trying to break-in through the door, as it obviously did.

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And you know this hoe - were you there? No.

Have you read police reports? No.

Do you have any bad inside info? No.

Are you speculating? Yes.

Are you discounting other folks observations? Yes.

Are you being unreasonable on your analysis? Yes.

Ate you being unjustifiably arrogant? Yes.

Are you acting like a know-it-all? Yes.

Are your assessments just as speculative as everyone else's? Yes.

Are their observations similarly valued as yours? Yes.

Do you need to stop browbeating everyone else and their opinions and use some common sense? Yes.

Are you and your opinions any better or worse than anyone else here? Nope.

Be civil, fair and reasonable or leave the thread.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

AGENT J said:

1.) good job with the link

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Oy vey, can your condescending attitude.
It has always been out there, all you had to do was inform yourself of the actual facts of the case.

AGENT J said:

but now tell me what banging means

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Being obtuse again I see. Figures.
You know what banging means. It certainly isn't simply knocking.

He said banging. That is official.
And that banging is what he reacted to, and said he thought someone was breaking-in.
Had he just heard knocking he most likely wouldn't have thought some one was trying to break-in. Or had that not occurred to you?

AGENT J said:

of it being meaningless.

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It isn't meaningless as it is what prompted his response.

AGENT J said:

2.) so you cant point it out because i didnt, please note i never said he knew it was a girl, another thing i never pointed out because its not fact.
do you understand how a list of facts work?

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Being absurd again I see. As I stated, the information you provided is irrelevant unless or until information becomes available to make it relevant.
Or do you not understand that?

AGENT J said:

3.) nope because factually nothing you have pointed out has changed any facts i listed nor are relevant to a list of facts

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What an absurdly wrong thing to say.
Banging is not knocking. They tend to illicit different responses. So yes banging does change the facts as you stated and is relevant.
And you stating their ages and heights was only to further the purpose of showing there is a difference between them, which is irrelevant unless or until further information become available making it relevant.
So can you bs and be honest once in your life.



And since it is obvious that you and other folks have difficulty following along and keeping track of that which has come before, let me include this info again.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

joko104 said:

Well, maybe they'll call you as a PhD linguistics expert with years of research on this specific word usage to explain how every English speaking person uses the word "accidental" exactly as you do. :roll:

People tried to pick apart every single word Zimmerman said too.

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And nothing you said changes the fact that he said it, or that that is the evidence that we have at this time.
No reason to speculate anything else.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

SMTA said:

And you know this hoe - were you there? No.

Have you read police reports? No.

Do you have any bad inside info? No.

Are you speculating? Yes.

Are you discounting other folks observations? Yes.

Are you being unreasonable on your analysis? Yes.

Ate you being unjustifiably arrogant? Yes.

Are you acting like a know-it-all? Yes.

Are your assessments just as speculative as everyone else's? Yes.

Are their observations similarly valued as yours? Yes.

Do you need to stop browbeating everyone else and their opinions and use some common sense? Yes.

Are you and your opinions any better or worse than anyone else here? Nope.

Be civil, fair and reasonable or leave the thread.

Click to expand...

Wow!
You are simply over the top wrong!
The evidence that has been reported is ...

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

AGENT J said:

County prosecutor statement says driver knocked on locked screen door about a mile away and there is no evidence of forced entry

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Your inclusion of this as is only shows you are trying to spin this a certain way.
The prosecutors narrative (which is a biased one, especially as we know he claims she was banging) is based on what the family had been saying from the get. And the family was in no position to know.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

AGENT J said:

1.) reality seems you are
2.) no by definition they can be the same, one is suggestive though
3.) yes but yet the official police report doesn't use it, so thats adding

if you would like me to add to the facts this line i gladly will

"homeowner claims driver was banging on door"

would you like this added?

4.) no its still meaningless because legally it doesnt change anything and no i have not said they are different, they can be equal but one is suggestive and colorful language.

5.) see #3 and #4, i will add that statement if you like

6.) as i already pointed out they are the same and legally meaningless unless there is physical evidence that would show attempted forced entry, did you not read and understand this the first time

7.) dont want to answer the question because you know it exposes you huh? go it
and oh my lol nope just that one is colorful and suggestive but legally and definition wise they are not

ill ask again, lets see if you dodge it again
why did you add "politie" to the word knock?
than say "open hand pounding"? seems you are trying to paint a picture based on the opinion in your mind and not reality


8.) who is defensive lmao did you think that deflection would work.
now answer the question, why did you feel the need to change my list?

9.) nope, not legally and definition wise they can be the same one is just suggestive

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J, this post just displays why I don't generally try to discuss anything with you...I made the distinction of "polite knock" and "open handed banging" to show in words that the two are completely different in the way they sound inside a house to people....Now, the homeowner says 'banging', and the prosecutor tries, as probably 10 out of 10 prosecutors would to insert 'knocking' in order to downplay the possible state of mind of the homeowner. But I guarantee you that at trial any lawyer representing the homeowner will make a big deal out of the difference between a 'knock' at the door at 4:30am and 'banging' at the door at 4:30am....If you can't see that, then I guess you continue and have a nice day, because we are done.

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Excon said:

1.)Oy vey, can your condescending attitude.
It has always been out there, all you had to do was inform yourself of the actual facts of the case.
2.)Being obtuse again I see. Figures.
3.) You know what banging means. It certainly isn't simply knocking.
4.)He said banging. That is official.
5.) And that banging is what he reacted to, and said he thought someone was breaking-in.
6.) Had he just heard knocking he most likely wouldn't have thought some one was trying to break-in. Or had that not occurred to you?
7.) It isn't meaningless as it is what prompted his response.
8.) Being absurd again I see. As I stated, the information you provided is irrelevant unless or until information becomes available to make it relevant.
Or do you not understand that?
9.)What an absurdly wrong thing to say.
10.) Banging is not knocking.
11.) They tend to illicit different responses. So yes banging does change the facts as you stated and is relevant.
12.) And you stating their ages and heights was only to further the purpose of showing there is a difference between them, which is irrelevant unless or until further information become available making it relevant.
13.) So can you bs and be honest once in your life.

14.)And since it is obvious that you and other folks have dificulty folowing anolg and keeping thrack of that which has come before, let me include this info again.

THE MICHIGAN PENAL CODE (EXCERPT)
Act 328 of 1931

750.329 Discharging firearm pointed or aimed at another person resulting in death; manslaughter; exception; "peace officer" defined.

Sec. 329.

(1) A person who wounds, maims, or injures another person by discharging a firearm that is pointed or aimed intentionally but without malice at another person is guilty of manslaughter if the wounds, maiming, or injuries result in death.

(2) This section does not apply to a peace officer of this state or another state, or of a local unit of government of this state or another state, or of the United States, performing his or her duties as a peace officer. As used in this section, "peace officer" means that term as defined in section 215.​

History: 1931, Act 328, Eff. Sept. 18, 1931 ;-- CL 1948, 750.329 ;-- Am. 2005, Act 303, Imd. Eff. Dec. 21, 2005

Michigan Legislature - Section 750.329​

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1.) always been out there thats cute, that evidence was for you to provide and you did so good job. If that bothers you the issues is yours lol
2.) nope following the rules for a FACTS list that is defeating your posts lol
3.) sorry you are factually wrong banging can indeed be knocking and vice versea, its totally subjective and legally they are meaning by themselves
4.) its his official claim, not a fact and again legally its meaningless
5.) banging does not equal breaking in so again meaningless
6.) complete guess, if a hear banging i dont think somebody is breaking in either :shrug:

again my daughter did it one night about 3 in the morning on time, she didnt have her key, was at the neighbors house sleeping over but they wanted to leave to go to the hospital and she wanted to come home. phones didnt wake us so she knocked on the door, it was a louder knock, banging, you know since it was 3am and we were probably sleeping. It did the trick it woke me up and at no time did i think break in. WHy because thats stupid and banging on a door alone is not equal to breaking in

7.) no its meaningless because banging does not equal break in and what "response" are you talking about
8.) i love when your posts become uncivil and you try to use failed insults and deflections it shows how quickly your posts are falling apart, you opinion on the relvances is meanignless since those are indeed facts and nothing more was made of them. ANother complete fail.
9.) nope its factual but see 8# again anyway lol
10.) yes legally and definition was they factually can be, sorry you are factually wrong
11.) yes they do/can but again thats subjective. WHen my daughter did it in the middle of the day, i was frustrated with her and yelled at her and told her not to knock like that. WHen she did it at night i wasnt i understood she was simply trying to wake us up. Little upset about being waken up but then that went away because it was a good reason.

but again my response is just me and subjective not what everybody would do but most importantly banging alone is 100% completely meaningless to facts, law and my facts list

this is awesome!
12.) again good thing my fact list made no mention of that and you are once again factually wrong and simply making stuff up lol

13.) no i can not bs AND be honest once in my life thats impossible

i can however be honest like i am and always am in my posts and already proven. This however cant be said for your post and again it can be factually proven.

14.) whats this have to do with me? oh thats right nothing, it impacts the facts list ZERO or any statments ive made just more meaningless filler

you seem to like to post failed deflections and insults, lies and meaningless info a lot, you also seem to try and focus on me the poster instead of facts and whats actually said and it never works, your posts always fail.

anyway PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC and try to focus on things actually being said your posts will have better success.

once again nothing has changed
there's factually NOTHING you have pointed out that has changed any facts i listed nor are relevant to a list of facts

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

Excon said:

1.)Your inclusion of this as is only shows you are trying to spin this a certain way.
The prosecutors narrative (which is a biased one, especially as we know he claims she was banging) is based on what the family had been saying from the get. And the family was in no position to know.

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nope its a fact, plain and simple, sorry this fact bothers you, its the country prosecutor and it has nothign to do with the family.

please support your following lie


the country prosecutor is biased
the country prosecutor is basing the investigation fact from the family and not evidence.

we would love to see the proof of these posted lies

Re: Homeowner in Renisha McBride's killing to face murder charges

AGENT J said:

1.) always been out there thats cute, that evidence was for you to provide and you did so good job. If that bothers you the issues is yours lol
2.) nope following the rules for a FACTS list that is defeating your posts lol
3.) sorry you are factually wrong banging can indeed be knocking and vice versea, its totally subjective and legally they are meaning by themselves
4.) its his official claim, not a fact and again legally its meaningless
5.) banging does not equal breaking in so again meaningless
6.) complete guess, if a hear banging i dont think somebody is breaking in either :shrug:

again my daughter did it one night about 3 in the morning on time, she didnt have her key, was at the neighbors house sleeping over but they wanted to leave to go to the hospital and she wanted to come home. phones didnt wake us so she knocked on the door, it was a louder knock, banging, you know since it was 3am and we were probably sleeping. It did the trick it woke me up and at no time did i think break in. WHy because thats stupid and banging on a door alone is not equal to breaking in

7.) no its meaningless because banging does not equal break in and what "response" are you talking about
8.) i love when your posts become uncivil and you try to use failed insults and deflections it shows how quickly your posts are falling apart, you opinion on the relvances is meanignless since those are indeed facts and nothing more was made of them. ANother complete fail.
9.) nope its factual but see 8# again anyway lol
10.) yes legally and definition was they factually can be, sorry you are factually wrong
11.) yes they do/can but again thats subjective. WHen my daughter did it in the middle of the day, i was frustrated with her and yelled at her and told her not to knock like that. WHen she did it at night i wasnt i understood she was simply trying to wake us up. Little upset about being waken up but then that went away because it was a good reason.

but again my response is just me and subjective not what everybody would do but most importantly banging alone is 100% completely meaningless to facts, law and my facts list

this is awesome!
12.) again good thing my fact list made no mention of that and you are once again factually wrong and simply making stuff up lol

13.) no i can not bs AND be honest once in my life thats impossible

i can however be honest like i am and always am in my posts and already proven. This however cant be said for your post and again it can be factually proven.

14.) whats this have to do with me? oh thats right nothing, it impacts the facts list ZERO or any statments ive made just more meaningless filler

you seem to like to post failed deflections and insults, lies and meaningless info a lot, you also seem to try and focus on me the poster instead of facts and whats actually said and it never works, your posts always fail.

anyway PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC and try to focus on things actually being said your posts will have better success.

once again nothing has changed
there's factually NOTHING you have pointed out that has changed any facts i listed nor are relevant to a list of facts

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Wow. Your thoughts are so convoluted. And so perplexing that you think you are right when you are actually wrong.
It really is sad, as you are only fooling yourself if you actually believe what you say.
You are wrong and are just trying to maintain an illusion in your head that you are right.

Banging is not the same as knocking, legal or otherwise. And any competent attorney will demonstrate the difference in the Court to emphasize what the jury already knows... that banging is not the same as knocking.
They will also point out that at oh-dark-thirty in the morning, banging can and does sound like someone could be breaking-in.