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Thread: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    It is always interesting to see how the far right finds ways to renege on promises to the people.
    Personally, I would modify that statement to replace "far right" with "politicians".
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by reinoe View Post
    It's a pyramid scheme scheme too. That's also a reality.
    Tell us how many people who have fulfilled their end of the bargain have not gotten their promised benefits in the last 80 years. But now the far right wants to screw them all.
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by Green Man View Post
    So you are arguing that they voluntarily entered into the commitment? That they signed up voluntarily?
    They are here voluntarily and they understand the rules and they stay just the same. Yes - they are exercising free choice.
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Personally, I would modify that statement to replace "far right" with "politicians".
    The only people I see urging we screw the American people on social security is the right.
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    The only people I see urging we screw the American people on social security is the right.
    I thought you were speaking in more general terms, not specifically SS.

    And although I don't know one way or another, I'd guess that some left-leaning persons have suggested such.

    Not far-left, though, probably.
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    It is always interesting to see how the far right finds ways to renege on promises to the people.
    We can deal with the commitments the government made. The overarching question is whether the government ought to be handing taxpayer money to people.

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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by Green Man View Post
    We can deal with the commitments the government made. The overarching question is whether the government ought to be handing taxpayer money to people.
    We had that debate.

    Your side lost.
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I thought you were speaking in more general terms, not specifically SS.

    And although I don't know one way or another, I'd guess that some left-leaning persons have suggested such.

    Not far-left, though, probably.
    If you know of people on the left who have advocated reneging on the commitment of social security, I would welcome examining the evidence of that. The only people I have ever seen advocate that line are those on the right.
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Tell us how many people who have fulfilled their end of the bargain have not gotten their promised benefits in the last 80 years. But now the far right wants to screw them all.
    That's an unquantifiable number. Lots of Blacks were never issued social security numbers and so when it became time to collect they simply could not. Of course, at the early onset of the program there were plenty of people who also collected benefits without ever paying.

    Every time you talk about "promised benefits" it's an appeal to the sunk cost fallacy.

    If it's really a savings system like you claim then it can be ended today, and everyone who has paid into the system can get their money back. If it's a pyramid scheme then it cannot be ended because the people collecting benefits didn't contribute to any sort of worthwhile fund at all.

    Also whether it runs out of money in 2015, 2030, or 2221 if it were really a savings system like you claim then it would be impossible to run out of money at all.
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    Re: Republicans mount shock comeback, erase Democrats’ edge in eyes of Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    If you know of people on the left who have advocated reneging on the commitment of social security, I would welcome examining the evidence of that. The only people I have ever seen advocate that line are those on the right.
    I just said I didn't know...that's what "I don't know one way or another" meant.

    That said, I do not think that any sane person would advocate reneging on the SS commitment - or at least, I don't think such a suggestion would be reasonable.

    Replace it with something else or phase it out, maybe - but this would mean younger persons stopped paying in, and in doing so, cause much of the funding to vanish. So there's THAT huge looming issue.

    But, then, far right and far left individuals aren't necessarily sane, so...
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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