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Thread: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

  1. #61
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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by Serenity View Post
    Should we start tasering parents on beaches to prevent them drowing when they swim outside the flags (we all know how dangerous that can be) if they are trying to get to their loved one who is caught in a rip and being dragged out to sea?

    Should we have tasered the young girl who not so long ago showed incredible unexplainable strength when she saved her fathers life by lifting a vehicle that her father was pinned under because she could've broken her back?

    Emergency services personnel should be actively trying to encourage/persuade anyone to not participate in what could be considered a potentially dangerous/life threatening situation but there are limits they should employ and they've gone way to far here.

    I've said it before and i'll say it again. Never under estimate the power of love. Ordinary people can do extraordinary things when a loved ones life is in danger.
    And many times people simply get themselves killed by trying to do such things. We don't hear about those people as often because they simply become another victim, likely lost in the story. And I'm not saying that people shouldn't try to do something if there isn't another alternative. But when professionals who are equipped to do such things aren't able to do it, then there is no reason to believe someone unequipped is more likely to be able just because they are a loved one of the person to be rescued. Especially in such a case as a burning house. The guy and his wife tried to get to the boy once and couldn't do it. There is no reason to believe the second attempt would have been more successful for him.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Considering according to the article I posted, the boy was pulled out of there according to the family, and was still possibly breathing (although not necessarily likely to live either way) which means that they went into the house fairly shortly after the father was pulled from the door. (I believe it said there was a pause of about 2-3 minutes.) That means that yes, they would have had to go in after the guy, save him, and then try to get to his son.

    And yes, the woman could have lost both her husband and her son for nothing since it is almost certain that her husband going in would not have made any difference in the outcome of her son's fate. It sucks when children die, but it sucks more when people do something foolish, like running into a burning building, barefoot and in pajamas, and likely getting themselves killed or at least severely burned unnecessarily.
    If it's foolish to risk your life to save your child, then mark me down as a fool.
    Welfare (Food Stamps, WIC, etc...) are not entitlements. They are taxpayer funded handouts and shouldn't be called entitlements at all. Social Security and Veteran's benefits are 'Entitlements' because the people receiving them are entitled to them. They were earned and paid for by the recipients.

  3. #63
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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by RedAkston View Post
    If it's foolish to risk your life to save your child, then mark me down as a fool.
    It is foolish, not bad, just foolish. It is like in the TV shows when someone gets blown up in a car and someone tries to go toward the car "to save them". Usually there is someone there to stop the person. Why? Because it is foolish to think that the person in the car is alive. Does that make the person who ran toward the car wrong or bad or stupid? Of course. It makes them emotionally human. It makes them irrational due to their feelings. That is why first responders, particularly police officers, are trained to understand that people who are distraught, emotionally unstable because of a situation might do things that are dangerous to them but that they should be stopped from doing.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  4. #64
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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    It is foolish, not bad, just foolish. It is like in the TV shows when someone gets blown up in a car and someone tries to go toward the car "to save them". Usually there is someone there to stop the person. Why? Because it is foolish to think that the person in the car is alive. Does that make the person who ran toward the car wrong or bad or stupid? Of course. It makes them emotionally human. It makes them irrational due to their feelings. That is why first responders, particularly police officers, are trained to understand that people who are distraught, emotionally unstable because of a situation might do things that are dangerous to them but that they should be stopped from doing.
    You're wasting your time if you're trying to convince me that the police officer was in the right. It is not the police officer's job to save me, even if it's "from myself" as you are claiming. A cop that comes between me and trying to save my child is a dead cop. It's just that simple.
    Welfare (Food Stamps, WIC, etc...) are not entitlements. They are taxpayer funded handouts and shouldn't be called entitlements at all. Social Security and Veteran's benefits are 'Entitlements' because the people receiving them are entitled to them. They were earned and paid for by the recipients.

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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by RedAkston View Post
    You're wasting your time if you're trying to convince me that the police officer was in the right. It is not the police officer's job to save me, even if it's "from myself" as you are claiming. A cop that comes between me and trying to save my child is a dead cop. It's just that simple.
    Considering the likely amount of cops on the scene (and if you get confrontational, they are likely to request assistance) and what would likely be you in an emotional state, I'm willing to bet that you wouldn't survive such a situation or at least wouldn't be conscious at the end of it.

    But that would very likely be a good reason why the cops used a tazer on the guy in the story. Kinda hard to harm a cop after you've been tazed. You all are acting like it is your right to put others in harms way for a situation that you simply cannot know. The guy in this case had no way of knowing what condition his son was in nor if he really would have been any help to him. And he had no way to know that his trying to "save" his son wouldn't have actually put him in more danger. The same could easily be true for you given such a situation. Would you want to put your child in more danger just because of your pride in insisting that you might be able to save him? Because making the first responders respond to you rather than concentrating on saving your child, putting out the fire, makes it less likely that the child will be saved, if he/she could be.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Why is it so hard to see that there is no "bad guy" in this situation?

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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Considering the likely amount of cops on the scene (and if you get confrontational, they are likely to request assistance) and what would likely be you in an emotional state, I'm willing to bet that you wouldn't survive such a situation or at least wouldn't be conscious at the end of it.

    But that would very likely be a good reason why the cops used a tazer on the guy in the story. Kinda hard to harm a cop after you've been tazed. You all are acting like it is your right to put others in harms way for a situation that you simply cannot know. The guy in this case had no way of knowing what condition his son was in nor if he really would have been any help to him. And he had no way to know that his trying to "save" his son wouldn't have actually put him in more danger. The same could easily be true for you given such a situation. Would you want to put your child in more danger just because of your pride in insisting that you might be able to save him? Because making the first responders respond to you rather than concentrating on saving your child, putting out the fire, makes it less likely that the child will be saved, if he/she could be.
    You really aren't getting this at all so let me spell it out for you in a way you might understand.

    I am responsible for myself and my actions. If I want to try to save my child who is in a burning house, you, the police any any other mother ****er has no right to say that I can't. If I want to pour gasoline all over myself and light a match, you, the police or any other mother ****er has no right to say that I can't. These would be choices that I alone would be making. I would not be physically harming anyone but myself and I would have no one to answer to other than my own conscience.
    The FD chose not to go in after the kid, but what right does the police officer have to say that I can't enter my own property to try to save one of my own?

    Let me clue you in on the answer - they have none. You can keep on with your charade but it's not going to make you right. You will never convince me that I don't have the right to make my own choices, sorry.
    Welfare (Food Stamps, WIC, etc...) are not entitlements. They are taxpayer funded handouts and shouldn't be called entitlements at all. Social Security and Veteran's benefits are 'Entitlements' because the people receiving them are entitled to them. They were earned and paid for by the recipients.

  8. #68
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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Considering the likely amount of cops on the scene (and if you get confrontational, they are likely to request assistance) and what would likely be you in an emotional state, I'm willing to bet that you wouldn't survive such a situation or at least wouldn't be conscious at the end of it.

    But that would very likely be a good reason why the cops used a tazer on the guy in the story. Kinda hard to harm a cop after you've been tazed. You all are acting like it is your right to put others in harms way for a situation that you simply cannot know. The guy in this case had no way of knowing what condition his son was in nor if he really would have been any help to him. And he had no way to know that his trying to "save" his son wouldn't have actually put him in more danger. The same could easily be true for you given such a situation. Would you want to put your child in more danger just because of your pride in insisting that you might be able to save him? Because making the first responders respond to you rather than concentrating on saving your child, putting out the fire, makes it less likely that the child will be saved, if he/she could be.
    They weren't trying to save the child because they deemed they couldn't. They don't HAVE to go after me it THEIR choice whether or not to do so, I wont and don't expect them to. Its MY RIGHT to make the call not your not theirs and that is the point you don't get, and apparently never will. I don't give a goddamn about the peoples perception of the police, and to be blunt neither should the police. If they are too busy worrying about the perception of themselves they are in the wrong ****ing field.
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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Why is it so hard to see that there is no "bad guy" in this situation?
    No there isn't a bad guy, but there is a wrong guy and that's the police in this situation. They made the wrong call.
    Semper Fidelis, Semper Liber.
    I spit at lots of people through my computer screen. Not only does it "teach them a lesson" but it keeps the screen clean and shiny.
    Stolen fair and square from the Capt. Courtesey himself.

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    Re: Missouri man trying to save stepson from fire hit with stun gun by police

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    Isn't suicide illegal? So weren't the police preventing a crime?

    Not that I'm please about this but I think that will be the defense.
    Suicide is not illegal in the US.

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