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Thread: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by ItAin'tFree View Post
    I was trying to think of any countries civil war that we became involved in the fighting that did not contain any aggressive acts toward the US. So far I come up empty but maybe I have overlooked one. But I kind of doubt it.
    So it's kinda like one of those, y'know, fantasy things?

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    So it's kinda like one of those, y'know, fantasy things?
    Liberal fantasy land has no limits.
    "“If we don’t deepen our ports all along the Gulf — places like Charleston, South Carolina; or Savannah, Georgia; or Jacksonville, Florida…” -Obama

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by ItAin'tFree View Post
    I was trying to think of any countries civil war that we became involved in the fighting that did not contain any aggressive acts toward the US. So far I come up empty but maybe I have overlooked one. But I kind of doubt it.
    Libya.
    we went in on supposed 'humanitarian reasons'
    (even though NATO wound up dropping bombs on the city of Misrata - how does one humanely drop bombs?) but it was a civil war.

    The NTC came from Bengazi/east Africa one of the sporadic uprising to overthrow Qaddafi.
    Qaddafi was busily shelling their pick up trucks, until we decided to enforce the UN No Fly zone a bit more...shall we say agressively?

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/0...s-NATO-Killed#
    NATO sources say that more than 10,000 sorties have been flown over the oil-rich nation resulting in large-scale destruction of the country’s infrastructure and the reported deaths of 10,000 to 15,000 people.
    The Qaddafi regime for it's part, has made much more modest claims. It was reported, July 14th:

    On Wednesday, Libya’s prosecutor general accused NATO of killing 1,108 people and wounding another 4,500 and filed charges against the alliance’s chief in Libyan court.
    Then there is Afganistan, sucked into that war because of the AQ training camps, but they didn't attack us.

    We're in the Yemenise civil war, one could say we were attacked by the underware bomber.

    And of course good old Vietnam, still can't figure out how they attacked us.
    Last edited by annata; 11-12-13 at 07:58 PM.
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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by annata View Post
    Then there is Afganistan, sucked into that war because of the AQ training camps, but they didn't attack us.
    Um ...
    Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by annata View Post
    Libya.
    we went in on supposed 'humanitarian reasons'
    (even though NATO wound up dropping bombs on the city of Misrata - how does one humanely drop bombs?) but it was a civil war.

    The NTC came from Bengazi/east Africa one of the sporadic uprising to overthrow Qaddafi.
    Qaddafi was busily shelling their pick up trucks, until we decided to enforce the UN No Fly zone a bit more...shall we say agressively?
    Daily Kos: How Many Libyans has NATO Killed?
    Then there is Afganistan, sucked into that war because of the AQ training camps, but they didn't attack us.

    We're in the Yemenise civil war, one could say we were attacked by the underware bomber.

    And of course good old Vietnam, still can't figure out how they attacked us.
    I probably would agree with you on Libya. They were no threat to us or anybody else. However, the fact is they did in the past display aggressive acts against the US as Obama reminded us.

    Afgan- forget about it. You are way off the mark.

    Yemen-The Cole. Plus the carryover from all other muslim terror acts.

    Vietnam-before we had the first combat unit in country, way before; two American service men were murdered by the VC in an attack directed from the North. Then again, the Gulf of Tonken. The first night was for real, the second is debatable.
    "“If we don’t deepen our ports all along the Gulf — places like Charleston, South Carolina; or Savannah, Georgia; or Jacksonville, Florida…” -Obama

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    [QUOTE=ItAin'tFree;1062537139]
    I probably would agree with you on Libya. They were no threat to us or anybody else. However, the fact is they did in the past display aggressive acts against the US as Obama reminded us
    Qaddafi supported terorism, but almost got blown up in his tent by Reagan, Qaddafi's wake up call.
    Afgan- forget about it. You are way off the mark.
    OK. not wanting to quibble

    Yemen-The Cole. Plus the carryover from all other muslim terror acts.
    true enough, AQAP is a nasty bunch, but our drones are ubiquitous.
    we depend on Yemen ground forces to call them in, or fighters in their civil war. They are a bit jumpy in Sanaa, and it isn't from the coffee.
    Yemen

    Vietnam-before we had the first combat unit in country, way before; two American service men were murdered by the VC in an attack directed from the North. Then again, the Gulf of Tonken. The first night was for real, the second is debatable.
    none of which required a fuill scale invasion by the US.
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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by annata View Post

    none of which required a fuill scale invasion by the US.
    That never happened. Not even close.
    "“If we don’t deepen our ports all along the Gulf — places like Charleston, South Carolina; or Savannah, Georgia; or Jacksonville, Florida…” -Obama

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Which civil wars did you have in mind?



    Again, any specifics?
    1. Cuba, Viet Nam, Somalia, Philippines, Yemen, Nicaragua, El Salvador, after we invaded: Iraq and Afghanistan

    2.

    ".....
    10. United Technologies (UTX) -- aircraft, electronics, engines
    Arm sales: $11.6 billion, total sales: $58.2 billion
    Gross profit: $5.3 billion, total workforce: 199,900
    United Technologies makes a wide range of arms — notably military helicopters, including the Black Hawk helicopter for the U.S. Army and the Seahawk helicopter for the U.S. Navy. The company was the biggest employer in the top 10 though arms sales accounted for just 20% of revenue. UTX also produces elevators, escalators, air-conditioners and refrigerators. International sales comprised 60% of the company's revenue in 2012.

    [ranked #56 overall campaign donor http://www.opensecrets.org/overview/topcontribs.php]

    9. L-3 Communications (LLL) -- electronics
    Arm sales: $12.5 billion, total sales: $15.2 billion
    Gross profit: $956 million, total workforce: 61,000
    Some 83% of L-3 Communications sales in 2011 came from arms sales, but this was down from what it sold the prior year. The company has four business segments: electronic systems; aircraft modernization and maintenance; national security solutions; and command, control, communications, intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance. Among many products manufactured, the company has become a major provider of unmanned aircraft systems.

    8. Finmeccanica -- aircraft, artillery, engines, electronics, vehicles and missiles
    Arms sales, $14.6 billion, total sales: $24.1 billion
    Gross profit: $ -3.2 billion, total workforce: 70,470
    Italian company Finmeccanica makes a wide range of arms, including helicopters and security electronics. Nearly 60% of the company's sales in 2011 were in arms. Finmeccanica lost $3.2 billion in 2011. The Italian company is currently fending off allegation that it paid bribes to win an approximately $750 million contract to provide 12 military helicopters to the Indian government in 2010. The then-head of the company, Giuseppe Orsi, was arrested in February but has denied wrongdoing. Other executives, including the head of the company's helicopter unit, have been replaced, and the company has delayed the release of recent financial results.

    7. EADS -- aircraft, electronics, missiles and space
    Arm sales: $16.4 billion, total sales: $68.3 billion
    Gross profit: $1.4 billion, total workforce: 133,120
    The European Aeronautic Defense and Space Company (EADS), based in the Netherlands, had sales in 2011 roughly in line with the prior year. Arms sales comprised just 24% of the company's revenue. EADS and BAE Systems unsuccessfully attempted to merge for $45 billion in 2012, which would have created the world's largest aerospace company. The deal collapsed in October after German Chancellor Angela Merkel expressed concerns about the merger.

    6. Northrop Grumman (NOC) -- aircraft, electronics, missiles, ships, space
    Arm sales: $21.4 billion, total sales: $26.4 billion
    Gross profit: $2.1 billion, total workforce: 72,500
    Northrop Grumman's 2011 arms sales comprised about 81% of total sales even after a sharp decline in arms sales year over year. The company attributed the decline to reduced government spending on defense projects. Nevertheless, the company was more profitable than in the prior year.

    [Ranked #58 largest donor $19,217,280 1989-2012 http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php]

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    5. Raytheon (RTN) -- electronics, missiles
    Arm sales: $22.5 billion, total sales: $24.9 billion
    Gross profit: $1.9 billion, total workforce: 71,000
    Raytheon, based in Waltham, Mass., is one of the largest defense contractors in the U.S. The company makes the Tomahawk Cruise Missile, among others. Arms sales comprised about 90% of the company's sales in 2011 though they as a total they were lower than in the prior year. The slide hasn't let up. Total sales in 2012 fell 1.5%, and Raytheon is expecting sales to fall 3% in 2013, a projection which doesn't take into account the effects of mandated budget cuts. The company can rely on overseas customers to somewhat offset weak sales at home. As of January, approximately 40% of the company's backlog was booked overseas. The company expects approximately a 5% increase in international sales in 2013.

    [Ranked #68 largest donor $16,699,598 1989-2012 http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php]

    4. General Dynamics (GD) -- artillery, electronics, vehicles, small arms, ships
    Arm sales: $23.8 billion, total sales: $32.7 billion
    Gross profit: $2.5 billion, total workforce: 95,100
    With 18,000 transactions in 2011, General Dynamics was the third-largest contractor to the U.S. government. Of those contracts, approximately $12.9 billion worth went to the Navy, while an additional $4.6 billion went to the Army. The company's arms sales in 2011 comprised 73% of total sales. Arms sales in 2011 were slightly below 2010 levels. The company makes a host of products, including electric boats, tracked and wheeled military vehicles, and battle tanks. The company announced layoffs in early March, blaming mandated federal budget cuts.
    [Ranked 368 overall donor $562,933 http://www.opensecrets.org/overview/topcontribs.php]

    3. BAE Systems -- aircraft, artillery, electronics, vehicles, missiles, ships
    Arm sales: $29.2 billion, total sales: $30.7 billion
    Gross profit: $2.3 billion, total workforce: 93,500
    BAE Systems was the largest non-U.S. company based on arms sales. Arms sales represented 95% of the company's total sales in 2011 even though they were lower as a total of overall sales compared to the prior year. The products BAE sells include the L-ROD Bar Armor System that shields defense vehicles and the Hawk Advanced Jet Trainer that provides sophisticated simulation training for military pilots. In 2013, the company said its growth would likely come from outside the U.S. and Great Britain — its home market. BAE noted that its outlook for those two countries was "constrained," likely due to the diminished presence in international conflicts and government budget cuts.

    2. Boeing (BA) -- aircraft, electronics, missiles, space
    Arm sales: $31.8 billion, total sales: $68.7 billion
    Gross profit: $4 billion, total workforce: 171,700
    Boeing was the second-largest U.S. government contractor in 2011, with about $21.5 billion worth of goods contracted. The Chicago-based company makes a wide range of arms, including strategic missile systems, laser and electro-optical systems and global positioning systems. Despite all these technologies, just 46% of the company's total sales of $68.7 billion in 2011 came from arms. Boeing is the largest commercial airplane manufacturer in the world, making planes such as the 747, 757 and recently, the 787 Dreamliner. The company is also known for its space technology — Boeing had $1 billion worth of contracts with NASA in 2011.

    [ranked #60 largest donor $21,053,012 http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php]

    1. Lockheed Martin (LMT) -- aircraft, electronics, missiles, space
    Arm sales:$36.3 billion, total sales: $46.5 billion
    Gross profit: $2.7 billion, total workforce, 123,000
    Lockheed Martin notched $36.3 billion in sales in 2011, slightly higher than the $35.7 billion the company sold in 2010. The arms sales comprised 78% of the company's total 2011 sales. Lockheed makes a wide range of products, including aircraft, missiles, unmanned systems and radar systems. The company and its employees have been concerned about the effects of the "fiscal cliff" and sequestration, the latter of which includes significant cuts to the U.S. Department of Defense. In the fall of 2012, the company planned on issuing layoff notices to all employees before backing down at the White House's request."
    [Ranked #32 largest donor $26,405,806 1989-2012 http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php]

    10 companies profiting the most from war

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    Re: America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' [W:306]

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    Vietnam vets will never accept and apology from this woman. She should be charged and tried as a traitor to this country......what she said and did is inexcusable May she rot in hell..

    America's top UN diplomat has high praise for 'Hanoi Jane' | Fox News
    Get over it. It was decades ago, by a young person who has since said she made a bad mistake. Let whosoever has not sinned, cast the first stone.

    If only everyone would recognize their mistakes they made when they were young and stupid, the world would be a better place.

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