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Common Core lessons blasted for sneaking politics into elementary classrooms

rabbitcaebannog said:
Yes, high school students may not get a diploma if they don't show proficiency.
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That's the exit exam.

At all other levels, it doesn't matter to the student how well or how poorly he does on the test. That's why the results are not reliable.
 
Dittohead not! said:
That's the exit exam.

At all other levels, it doesn't matter to the student how well or how poorly he does on the test. That's why the results are not reliable.
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We still need to find a way to measure that teachers are actually getting results....This thread so far seems to be long on excuses from the education circles on why our system is failing, and surprisingly not a lot of it has to do with teachers, why, color me shocked that those experiencing scrutiny want to deflect it away from themselves.
 
j-mac said:
We still need to find a way to measure that teachers are actually getting results....This thread so far seems to be long on excuses from the education circles on why our system is failing, and surprisingly not a lot of it has to do with teachers, why, color me shocked that those experiencing scrutiny want to deflect it away from themselves.
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Yes, we need to find an accurate way to measure whether teachers are getting results. The way the federal government wants to mandate we go about it isn't working. No surprise there. I've suggested a system that would work already.

I must have missed the part where teachers are making excuses about our failed system.
 
j-mac said:
We still need to find a way to measure that teachers are actually getting results....This thread so far seems to be long on excuses from the education circles on why our system is failing, and surprisingly not a lot of it has to do with teachers, why, color me shocked that those experiencing scrutiny want to deflect it away from themselves.
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First, spell out "the cause". I provided proof that the US reading and mathematical scores can compete internationally only when taking poverty rates into account and making equal comparisons using that measure. Now people can argue that we haven't been doing enough to get children who live in poverty score's to match those who do not live in poverty. If you would like to blame teachers, feel free. I just need some kind of evidence to back up your accusation that teachers are the cause.
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
First, spell out "the cause". I provided proof that the US reading and mathematical scores can compete internationally only when taking poverty rates into account and making equal comparisons using that measure. Now people can argue that we haven't been doing enough to get children who live in poverty score's to match those who do not live in poverty. If you would like to blame teachers, feel free. I just need some kind of evidence to back up your accusation that teachers are the cause.
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The cause? Well, I have spelled it out earlier in the thread....To me, as a parent that has successfully put two kids through school, and on to college, I would say that among the top of the list is top heavy administration that pulls in six digit salaries, sucking off resource from the schools themselves, then would come teacher apathy, IOW, we all know those teachers that don't keep hours after school, who don't answer their e-mail, who love to tell you how your child is not doing what is necessary, yet they are not invested at all, then there is the problem of tenure. I don't believe that in primary schooling tenure should be available at all. My job is performance based, so should theirs be.
 
j-mac said:
The cause? Well, I have spelled it out earlier in the thread....To me, as a parent that has successfully put two kids through school, and on to college, I would say that among the top of the list is top heavy administration that pulls in six digit salaries, sucking off resource from the schools themselves, then would come teacher apathy, IOW, we all know those teachers that don't keep hours after school, who don't answer their e-mail, who love to tell you how your child is not doing what is necessary, yet they are not invested at all, then there is the problem of tenure. I don't believe that in primary schooling tenure should be available at all. My job is performance based, so should theirs be.
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Having tenure doesn't mean you can't have an evaluation based on performance. Here in MA, I can assure you we have tenure and have always had performance based evaluations. If a bad teacher made it through the system without a bad evaluation, that is something the administration should be accountable for since that is what he/she is paid to do---evaluate the effectiveness of teachers. Like Ditto head not, I've seen teachers get dismissed. Yes, tenure makes it harder because you have to prove there is a reason for that person to lose his/her job, but if that can be proven they are dismissed. An administrator cannot fire you at will which means because he/she feels like it. Most teachers who cannot teach usually clear themselves out within 5 years because teaching is one of the few jobs with that kind of mass exodus. Many walk after just a year. People know when they can't cut it and they learn pretty quick teaching isn't an easy job. I can vouch that I know at least a handful of teachers who did not belong in the profession and are still teaching, but they were not protected by the union. They were protected by a thing called nepotism which exist everywhere in all careers. TG it is a very small minority in teaching.
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
Having tenure doesn't mean you can't have an evaluation based on performance. Here in MA, I can assure you we have tenure and have always had performance based evaluations. If a bad teacher made it through the system without a bad evaluation, that is something the administration should be accountable for since that is what he/she is paid to do---evaluate the effectiveness of teachers. Like Ditto head not, I've seen teachers get dismissed. Yes, tenure makes it harder because you have to prove there is a reason for that person to lose his/her job, but if that can be proven they are dismissed. An administrator cannot fire you at will which means because he/she feels like it. Most teachers who cannot teach usually clear themselves out within 5 years because teaching is one of the few jobs with that kind of mass exodus. Many walk after just a year. People know when they can't cut it and they learn pretty quick teaching isn't an easy job. I can vouch that I know at least a handful of teachers who did not belong in the profession and are still teaching, but they were not protected by the union. They were protected by a thing called nepotism which exist everywhere in all careers. TG it is a very small minority in teaching.
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I don't want to diminish your experience, but we all see teachers in positions they shouldn't hold, and apathy that is rampant. Now that is probably due more to over burdened class rooms, and worsening attitudes of the students these teachers get, but none the less, at least in my eyes there is a problem there.
 
trfjr said:
Common Core lessons blasted for sneaking politics into elementary classrooms | Fox News

And this is how liberalism gained a foot hold in todays politics. with them propagandizing our children over the generations. why do you think most teachers and college professor lean to the left

"Whoever controls youth, controls the future" was the slogan, given the German National club to the Communist thieves' den.
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Those common core books are now teaching kids that "white people wouldn't vote for Obama because he's black."

Common cores mission is to brainwash children with progressive 1984ish bull****...
 
j-mac said:
I don't want to diminish your experience, but we all see teachers in positions they shouldn't hold, and apathy that is rampant. Now that is probably due more to over burdened class rooms, and worsening attitudes of the students these teachers get, but none the less, at least in my eyes there is a problem there.
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I do see morale at it's lowest since I've been in the profession. It should be interesting to see if retention rates get worse instead of better.
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
I do see morale at it's lowest since I've been in the profession. It should be interesting to see if retention rates get worse instead of better.
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When the teacher is expected to have 100% of his students pass a difficult and tedious test that most of them could care less about, and when talking about poverty and non English speakers is seen as "making excuses", and when the administrators J-mac talks about are out there "earning" their fancy salaries by running around making sure that the standards are posted on the classroom wall (yes, that really happens!) then no wonder the teacher morale is low.
 
j-mac said:
We still need to find a way to measure that teachers are actually getting results....This thread so far seems to be long on excuses from the education circles on why our system is failing, and surprisingly not a lot of it has to do with teachers, why, color me shocked that those experiencing scrutiny want to deflect it away from themselves.
Click to expand...

Thats my issue. Teachers state they are pro-student, but they oppose competition, and objective testing of both students and teachers-saying the tests are imperfect, its home issues, etc.

Newly added, is an anti-capitalism excuse-something about corporatism. :) I think they see ghosts where there are none.

As a result of lack-luster education-think of the burden on society, the decreased productivity, the lower quality of life, the inability to escape the cycle of poverty. We are truly shooting ourselves in the foot.
 
Mr.Nick said:
Those common core books are now teaching kids that "white people wouldn't vote for Obama because he's black."

Common cores mission is to brainwash children with progressive 1984ish bull****...
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Got a link for that.

The left is killing academia. Ive had it up to here with neo marxist critical theory bull****.
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
I do see morale at it's lowest since I've been in the profession. It should be interesting to see if retention rates get worse instead of better.
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I dont care about retention rates. I care about choice. I care about competition. These are the things that improve the market, education is a commodity like any other. Im not saying its easy, but its fairly straight forward.
 
Dittohead not! said:
When the teacher is expected to have 100% of his students pass a difficult and tedious test that most of them could care less about, and when talking about poverty and non English speakers is seen as "making excuses", and when the administrators J-mac talks about are out there "earning" their fancy salaries by running around making sure that the standards are posted on the classroom wall (yes, that really happens!) then no wonder the teacher morale is low.
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OMG, we were just talking about that yesterday in the faculty room! We have this entire wall plastered with testing results as if its wall paper. It keeps growing like black mold and is a constant reminder of how serious these test are taken during lunch as you sit eat your sandwich and stare at it. Everyone very subdued.
 
US Conservative said:
I dont care about retention rates. I care about choice. I care about competition. These are the things that improve the market, education is a commodity like any other. Im not saying its easy, but its fairly straight forward.
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Churn and burn is NOT a good model in the teaching profession. It takes an inexperienced teacher approximately 3 years to master many skills (give or take a few years) including classroom management, testing, intervention, adaptation, IEP and 504 law, planning lesson which need to be modified and/or accommodations made, and also take care of mounds of endless paperwork (each with its own rubric). If you keep turning them every 3 to 5 years, schools have to re-train from scratch. Schools with high retention rates, are usually the ones everyone wants to work for because they have less difficult students. That is where our system breaks down. Our wealthy schools are doing just fine. The less advantage schools where high rates of disadvantage students attend are not making the grade. It is no wonder with so many teachers walking before that 5 year mark.
 
US Conservative said:
Thats my issue. Teachers state they are pro-student, but they oppose competition, and objective testing of both students and teachers-saying the tests are imperfect, its home issues, etc.

Newly added, is an anti-capitalism excuse-something about corporatism. :) I think they see ghosts where there are none.

As a result of lack-luster education-think of the burden on society, the decreased productivity, the lower quality of life, the inability to escape the cycle of poverty. We are truly shooting ourselves in the foot.
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If you don't believe that schools are following a business model installed by corporate reformers then you have your eyes and ears shut. This business model is not working for those that it purports to help the most.
 
US Conservative said:
Thats my issue. Teachers state they are pro-student, but they oppose competition, and objective testing of both students and teachers-saying the tests are imperfect, its home issues, etc.

Newly added, is an anti-capitalism excuse-something about corporatism. :) I think they see ghosts where there are none.

As a result of lack-luster education-think of the burden on society, the decreased productivity, the lower quality of life, the inability to escape the cycle of poverty. We are truly shooting ourselves in the foot.
Click to expand...

We actually see that today. In my day every kid knew their multiplication tables by heart by the 5th grade, today? We need pictures on cash registers so that kids now how to make change.
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
OMG, we were just talking about that yesterday in the faculty room! We have this entire wall plastered with testing results as if its wall paper. It keeps growing like black mold and is a constant reminder of how serious these test are taken during lunch as you sit eat your sandwich and stare at it. Everyone very subdued.
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How seriously do the students take the test?

Do they "finish" a 45 minute timed test in less than ten minutes? That's a clue.
 
j-mac said:
We actually see that today. In my day every kid knew their multiplication tables by heart by the 5th grade, today? We need pictures on cash registers so that kids now how to make change.
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WOW! By fifth grade, really?
California state standards (the goals and objectives the test is based on) are that all students memorize the times tables by third grade. I guess your class was a couple of years behind.
 
US Conservative said:
I dont care about retention rates. I care about choice. I care about competition. These are the things that improve the market, education is a commodity like any other. Im not saying its easy, but its fairly straight forward.
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ok, so you care about choice and competition
now share with us how a focus on choice and competition could substantially elevate our public school system
 
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