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'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

if the gop were serious about fixing the healthcare website, they should probably go after the corrupt contractor who fleeced the federal government, and maybe it would help their credibility when their supposed tech expert is not also a ex-fugitive.

It was the Obama White House who selected the foreign based company who designed the Obamacare website.

And as usual Obama always put second rate unqualified people in charge.

The entire administration has been second rate since January of 2009.

Obama has found himself in an embarrassing situation. The right was right again about delaying Obamacare and as history has shown us, the left is wrong again. Blaming Bush has been overused and not even the 52% of the misinformed and uninformed may not go with that one.

Obama should borrow some balls from the GOP because it takes more than a few years to grow a pair and admit he was wrong for closing down the federal government and instead he should have crossed the political aisle and delayed Obamacare.
 
  • Everyone's in it by default.
  • Medicare Part A is bare minimum coverage available at no charge subsidized by taxpayers.
  • Medicare Part B is better than bare minimum, available at very reasonable close and subsidized by taxpayers.
  • The negotiating power of Medicare is unparalleled in US history.
  • You don't need no stinkin' website to enroll. ;)
  • Supplemental coverage is available through the private sector for very reasonable cost.
  • Supplemental insurance is not mandatory.
  • You don't need 10,535 pages to re-invent the wheel.

And doctors are opting more and more not to take Medicare patients because it pays under the cost of doing business, good plan there.
CMS – which has never before released Medicare opt-out figures – reports that 9,539 physicians opted out of the Medicare program in 2012. That is up from 3,700 physicians opting out in 2009. All in all, the number of doctors who opted out of Medicare in 2012 nearly tripled from just three years prior. According to The WSJ, many other doctors who are not opting out of the program are at least limiting the number of Medicare patients that they treat.

Likewise, a study from the American Academy of Family Physicians reports that 81 percent of family doctors accepted new Medicare patients last year, which was down from 83 percent in 2010.

The WSJ quotes Jeffrey Cain, president of the American Academy of Family Physicians. According to Cain, “Family physicians have been fed up for a long time and it’s getting worse.” He told The WSJ that by opting out of Medicare, doctors can focus on patient’s needs rather than what insurers are willing to pay.

California Healthline says that physicians have several reasons for opting out of the program. Most significant, though, are the low reimbursement rates, concerns about patient privacy, and unhappiness with the government’s increasing involvement in medicine. As far as the increased government presence goes, Becker’s Hospital Review cites the penalties for physicians who do not demonstrate Meaningful Use through EHRs as an example. The WSJ also says that doctors recognize that Medicare payment rates have not kept up with inflation, and that there are dangers of more cuts in the future.
Doctors Refuse To Accept Medicare Patients

Gotta love your solution, force the country into a failed system then berate them for not loving it.
 
So they are willing to delay in the interest of fairness to Americans, rather than partisan politics, and this is news?

Bwuahahaha, look at the backpeddling!!! This was precisely proposed by Republicans. Hahahaha, eat crow.
 
if the gop were serious about fixing the healthcare website, they should probably go after the corrupt contractor who fleeced the federal government, and maybe it would help their credibility when their supposed tech expert is not also a ex-fugitive.

Oh I love this, you are scared. Hahaha, I love it.
 
You're confusing me with this data . . . unsourced, I might add. This has nothing to do with whether or not a Medicare model would work. The model would work. It's the taxes collected for it that would have to change.

There is literally no way that we will be able to collect enough taxes to cover Medicare as it is currently structured. Under no tax structure in the history of the United States of America have we ever managed to collect the kinds of taxes that would allow Medicare at its' current structure to survive the 2020s. Expanding Medicare under any tax structure with any rates in the manner that you are describing will only collapse the system immediately instead of in the future.

And not that far in the future, either. Those comments about the 2020s are assuming that Congress basically eventually caves on funding the ACA over Medicare.

Medicare Trustees: Medicare Will Go Broke in 2024. Unless You Discount The ACA's Double-Counting. Then It Goes Broke in 2016.

As we shine a bright light on the cost of treatment and the cost of insurance to cover said treatment, as we increase premiums to accurately reflect projected losses, people will suddenly become outraged that their doctor is charging them $130 for 10 minutes of his time. As their deductibles rise, they will question themselves before running to the ER and wonder whether or not they really need that CT scan for a broken arm. When more money is coming out of their pockets, costs will go down.

Higher deductibles will absolutely re-introduce cost sensitivity and have the effect of putting downward pressure on prices.

Problem: Higher Deductibles are "mean", and "some care should be 'free'". Telling people that they need to suck up the cost of their healthcare when the political rewards go to the folks who promise free preventative, free birth control, free for the old, free for the poor, free for the young, is going to be a losing proposition.

But if we were to put America on a high-deductible, catastrophic care only market, that would indeed go far towards reducing the prices we pay for healthcare. It's just that (at current) the government cannot afford to do that itself.

Medicare's "unfunded liability" is $24 trillion. Social Security $21 trillion. (Based on 2010 numbers) PolitiFact Florida | Romney says debt plus unfunded liabilities equals $520,000 per household

I goofed this - the 64 figure in my head was the combined unfunded liability for our entitlements, not Medicare.

Medicare's Unfunded Liability, as of April 2012, was $38.6 Trillion. And, (again) is currently scheduled to go broke in either three or eleven years, depending on whether or not we keep the ACA as it is currently structured.

These numbers are misleading because they make the assumption that everything will remain exactly as it is -- expenditures, benefits and premiums. That's not going to happen.

That is precisely what I am saying - unless we are willing to basically tell old people who cannot afford care to go home and die, we aren't going to be able to expand Medicare as you envision. We aren't willing to do that (old people vote).

People making $100,000+ in retirement should be paying a great deal more for their Medicare insurance. Not just a few hundred dollars . . . the correct actuarial amount to cover their care. There needs to be a progressive premium that depends upon their income...pension benefits...investment...everything. Perhaps even taking assets into account.

Yeah. Paul Ryan suggested something like that, and Mitt Romney ran on it. How'd that go over?

We're so screwed up it's pathetic. I personally know two people who are milking a system that allows them to do so. One has over $1 million in assets and is on Medicare's Advantage Plan. He pays $104 a month -- and no more. That's ridiculous. Another who has over a half-million dollars in assets who gets his medication without having to buy Part D for $5 a prescription through a subsidized plan. He pays nothing for the plan itself. Both of these examples are ridiculous. The system needs drastic repair; but the MODEL itself works.

The model is parasitic, and it "works" because it is so. Medicare's reimbursement schedule underpays providers, who then increase the costs they charge to private plans. It also contains massive amounts of fraud, waste, and abuse. It "works" in the sense that "hey, we successfully invaded Afghanistan, so the policy there has 'worked'". Force Medicare into a constrained budget as you are suggesting, and watch what happens every time a government attempts to prove it can operate like a business.
 
Bwuahahaha, look at the backpeddling!!! This was precisely proposed by Republicans. Hahahaha, eat crow.
No, it wasn't. The Republicans proposed a one year delay for partisan reasons.

It amazes me how desperate Republicans are at this point. There's a difference between delaying the individual requirement for political reasons and delaying it for reasons of fairness. And what exactly am I supposed to eat crow about? The website sucks, but the website is not the law. The website is one way (and the easiest and most promoted way) to comply with the law.

The fact you're so giddy about website problems says quite a bit about the level of partisanship involving this situation.
 
No, it wasn't. The Republicans proposed a one year delay for partisan reasons.

It amazes me how desperate Republicans are at this point. There's a difference between delaying the individual requirement for political reasons and delaying it for reasons of fairness. And what exactly am I supposed to eat crow about? The website sucks, but the website is not the law. The website is one way (and the easiest and most promoted way) to comply with the law.

The fact you're so giddy about website problems says quite a bit about the level of partisanship involving this situation.

No they proposed a delay because they think it's a POS, and it is.
 
No, it wasn't. The Republicans proposed a one year delay for partisan reasons.

:doh the impugning of evil motives to your opposition and pure ones to your preferred set of politicians is usually a sign of a political acumen significantly beneath that which you have demonstrated before on this site.
 
:doh the impugning of evil motives to your opposition and pure ones to your preferred set of politicians is usually a sign of a political acumen significantly beneath that which you have demonstrated before on this site.
I'm not "impugning" or having a preferred set of politicians, I'm simply stating the facts. The delay the Republicans proposed was part of the large opposition Republicans have to Obamacare as a whole. It was never truly sold as a temporary delay to make sure the website was working (you heard far more often about how businesses get exemption but individuals don't). Republicans don't want Obamacare, everyone knows that. Republicans had no interest in delaying Obamacare to improve it, they wanted to delay it as a means to be rid of it. This is simply the facts of the matter.

On the other hand, the Democrats believe in the law. They passed the law, defended the law and fought to retain funding for the law. It's clear they do not want the law to go anywhere. However, if the website is making it very difficult for people to comply with the law, it would be unfair to not delay the date in order to give people the opportunity to comply with the law.


There is nothing partisan at all about my comments. It's simply stating undeniable truths, unless you somehow believe Republicans wanted to delay the individual mandate for reasons they rarely mentioned to ensure a better experience for citizens to comply with the law and/or Democrats want to delay the law because they don't like it.
 
On a partisan note, I am thrilled at the idea that this boondoggle, this trainwreck called Obamacare might be delayed. There are some very interesting cases making their way to the Supreme Court that have a very good chance of ending this nightmare. This delay buys some more time. It also buys more time to change the face of Congress allowing a majority that believes in free markets to start working on legislation that will create competition in the insurance industry resulting in bringing down premium rates naturally.
 
I'm not "impugning" or having a preferred set of politicians, I'm simply stating the facts. The delay the Republicans proposed was part of the large opposition Republicans have to Obamacare as a whole.

Yes. Because they believe it is bad for Americans. That is the portion you seem to be missing here. Both groups, when they propose delaying the mandate, are making the argument that doing so would be better for Americans.

On the other hand, the Democrats believe in the law. They passed the law, defended the law and fought to retain funding for the law. It's clear they do not want the law to go anywhere. However, if the website is making it very difficult for people to comply with the law, it would be unfair to not delay the date in order to give people the opportunity to comply with the law.

Yes. And the continued massive, public, boondoggle would be a partisan disaster for them. They are equally as motivated as Republicans by partisan as well as decent motivations.

There is nothing partisan at all about my comments.

There is, actually, inasmuch as "partisan" means "the willingness to subvert truth to group gain". You are fully intelligent enough to figure out the above, yet you choose instead to paint those with whom you disagree in denigrating terms, while presenting those with whom you agree with the best of assumptions.
 
No they proposed a delay because they think it's a POS, and it is.


Democrats are just pissed that the Republican bill didn't come with spoiler tags.
 
There is nothing partisan at all about my comments. It's simply stating undeniable truths, unless you somehow believe Republicans wanted to delay the individual mandate for reasons they rarely mentioned to ensure a better experience for citizens to comply with the law and/or Democrats want to delay the law because they don't like it.

OMG, that is just pathetically laughable! Terrorist tactics, a gun to their heads. Holding the country hostage. Umm... okay, we now want to do that to. But we are only doing it because WE are as pure as the driven snow, and you guys are TERRORISTS!

My God, is there no limit to what the lefty voters will bend over for from their elected dummies?
 
Yes. Because they believe it is bad for Americans. That is the portion you seem to be missing here. Both groups, when they propose delaying the mandate, are making the argument that doing so would be better for Americans.
Agreed. But the Republicans desire to delay was to achieve their political position of repealing it. The Democrat desire for delay (which I just saw on TV the Obama Administration has given citizens an extra 6 weeks to sign up) is to be fair to citizens who are required to sign up.

Yes. And the continued massive, public, boondoggle would be a partisan disaster for them. They are equally as motivated as Republicans by partisan as well as decent motivations.
It would only be a political disaster for them if citizens were trying to sign up, couldn't and then were taxed/penalized for it. Thus, it would be a matter of fairness to delay the date when citizens have to sign up.

Make no mistake about it, the Democrats perfect world would see the site working perfectly and no delay would be needed. The delay is only to ensure the fairness under the law, because creating an environment of unfairness would be very hard on them politically.

There is, actually, inasmuch as "partisan" means "the willingness to subvert truth to group gain". You are fully intelligent enough to figure out the above, yet you choose instead to paint those with whom you disagree in denigrating terms, while presenting those with whom you agree with the best of assumptions.
Not at all. I simply stated the facts as they were, noting the difference in the reasons for why each side wanted to delay.
OMG, that is just pathetically laughable! Terrorist tactics, a gun to their heads. Holding the country hostage. Umm... okay, we now want to do that to. But we are only doing it because WE are as pure as the driven snow, and you guys are TERRORISTS!
What a remarkably du...

Nevermind. The comments about terrorist tactics were related to shutting down the government and defaulting on debt unless Republicans got their way on everything they wanted. Oh, and I'm not a "lefty". I'm someone who prefers facts and common sense.
 
What a remarkably du...

Nevermind. The comments about terrorist tactics were related to shutting down the government and defaulting on debt unless Republicans got their way on everything they wanted. Oh, and I'm not a "lefty". I'm someone who prefers facts and common sense.

Well, you are treading dangerously close to being one, don't let that common sense slip away. Example... there was almost no chance of us defaulting on our debt, unless Obama took action to do so. I'm sure you've heard bye now that the debt requires around $20 billion a month, compared to $220 billion coming in. Use your common sense.
 
And the greatest part of all, is that the go-along republicans and the democrats are now saying, without having the guts to actually say it, that Ted Cruz is right!
 
one would think that making a functional website would have been by far the easiest part of ACA......what should we expect when the "hard part" goes into affect?
 
No, it wasn't. The Republicans proposed a one year delay for partisan reasons.

It amazes me how desperate Republicans are at this point. There's a difference between delaying the individual requirement for political reasons and delaying it for reasons of fairness. And what exactly am I supposed to eat crow about? The website sucks, but the website is not the law. The website is one way (and the easiest and most promoted way) to comply with the law.

The fact you're so giddy about website problems says quite a bit about the level of partisanship involving this situation.

LOL. You really need to consider a different spin because the one you are trying, has fallen flat on it's face. Or just fess up and say what is obvious to everyone except hard core Dems, Cruz was right.
 
No, it wasn't. The Republicans proposed a one year delay for partisan reasons.

It amazes me how desperate Republicans are at this point. There's a difference between delaying the individual requirement for political reasons and delaying it for reasons of fairness. And what exactly am I supposed to eat crow about? The website sucks, but the website is not the law. The website is one way (and the easiest and most promoted way) to comply with the law.

The fact you're so giddy about website problems says quite a bit about the level of partisanship involving this situation.
Its ever and always the way with people like you. We see it right here on this site. Conservatives disagree with Obama policies and people like you rage on that it is only because they are partisan or...more commonly...racist. But when the liberals on this site disagree with Obama...well...that is because it is a well thought out and conscious 'honest' disagreement.
 
Its ever and always the way with people like you. We see it right here on this site. Conservatives disagree with Obama policies and people like you rage on that it is only because they are partisan or...more commonly...racist. But when the liberals on this site disagree with Obama...well...that is because it is a well thought out and conscious 'honest' disagreement.
Touche!
 
one would think that making a functional website would have been by far the easiest part of ACA......what should we expect when the "hard part" goes into affect?

This is correct.

Building a website like this is kindergarten for IT folks. Could they not just take the model that banks and investment companies use and build from there? Does that sound like a $300 million job in the first place?

This is the rudimentary math part of Obamacare. The rest is going to be Quantum Physics in comparison.
 
Its ever and always the way with people like you. We see it right here on this site. Conservatives disagree with Obama policies and people like you rage on that it is only because they are partisan or...more commonly...racist. But when the liberals on this site disagree with Obama...well...that is because it is a well thought out and conscious 'honest' disagreement.
Nah, it's because you're giddy over the problems. Nobody, not even Obama knew there would be problems. Nobody but Max Baucus knew. He was the only-est one. And the software engineers. They knew. And Sebelius. And the insurance providers. But other than that, nobody knew.
 
This is correct.

Building a website like this is kindergarten for IT folks. Could they not just take the model that banks and investment companies use and build from there? Does that sound like a $300 million job in the first place?

This is the rudimentary math part of Obamacare. The rest is going to be Quantum Physics in comparison.

I've read it was $640 million for this disaster web site the Dems built and wasted the taxpayers money on.
 
Nah, it's because you're giddy over the problems. Nobody, not even Obama knew there would be problems. Nobody but Max Baucus knew. He was the only-est one. And the software engineers. They knew. And Sebelius. And the insurance providers. But other than that, nobody knew.

I don't feel so alone any more! You can't imagine my relief! :mrgreen:
 
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