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Thread: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    I wouldn't go that far.
    Pero, Conservative used "what if?", and I think he has a logical question, because few things about the ACA makes sense so far. What we were told about it doesn't match up with the reality many people are facing. It may have been some people's perception...there's that word again...based on what they heard, but many thought it would be free. They're learning differently. How are the people, who are going to be subsidiized, expected to meet the co-pays and out of pocket expense, as an example? It doesn't affect me, but I am curious. What plans, other than wellness, or preventive medicine, is going to be the norm?

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    People in D.C. never see beyond the moment or beyond anything that doesn't create votes for their next campaign or job. That is why we are in such a mess today, the live for today mentality
    I couldn't agree more
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    Pero, Conservative used "what if?", and I think he has a logical question, because few things about the ACA makes sense so far. What we were told about it doesn't match up with the reality many people are facing. It may have been some people's perception...there's that word again...based on what they heard, but many thought it would be free. They're learning differently. How are the people, who are going to be subsidiized, expected to meet the co-pays and out of pocket expense, as an example? It doesn't affect me, but I am curious. What plans, other than wellness, or preventive medicine, is going to be the norm?
    To be honest, I don't know. But with every new mandate added, the cost has to be picked up by someone. Sure keeping kids on a parents policy until 26 is very popular, but somewhere, someplace there is someone paying for it. It is not free as most think. Keep hearing reports that a male under 30 can for the most part expect his health insurance to double. Perhaps it is those in that range that is picking up quite a bit of the tab.

    Nothing is free, someone is paying for it or if not, we are borrowing money to pay for it, even so, someone in the future will be paying for it. Subsidies, taxpayers are paying for that or the added taxes on things like home sales with will be charged a 3% fee I hear tell going to help pay for Obamacare. The Medical device tax, what else who knows.

    Now you throw in, what? 20 million more patients in an already overburdened health system where doctors are now retiring or leaving the country to practice elsewhere. Got the Flu, wait 3 days to see you doctor or go to the emergency room. The wife's and me family practice use to be McIntosh Trails, but they stopped accepting walk ins and you now must have an appointment to be seen. We switched doctors because we don't know the day before whether one of us will be sick or not in order to make a timely appointment. Doctors are telling me they don't as of yet know the rate of reimbursement for see a patient either.

    I don't know, perhaps all of this is hick-ups, but I doubt it.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    To be honest, I don't know. But with every new mandate added, the cost has to be picked up by someone. Sure keeping kids on a parents policy until 26 is very popular, but somewhere, someplace there is someone paying for it. It is not free as most think. Keep hearing reports that a male under 30 can for the most part expect his health insurance to double. Perhaps it is those in that range that is picking up quite a bit of the tab.

    Nothing is free, someone is paying for it or if not, we are borrowing money to pay for it, even so, someone in the future will be paying for it. Subsidies, taxpayers are paying for that or the added taxes on things like home sales with will be charged a 3% fee I hear tell going to help pay for Obamacare. The Medical device tax, what else who knows.

    Now you throw in, what? 20 million more patients in an already overburdened health system where doctors are now retiring or leaving the country to practice elsewhere. Got the Flu, wait 3 days to see you doctor or go to the emergency room. The wife's and me family practice use to be McIntosh Trails, but they stopped accepting walk ins and you now must have an appointment to be seen. We switched doctors because we don't know the day before whether one of us will be sick or not in order to make a timely appointment. Doctors are telling me they don't as of yet know the rate of reimbursement for see a patient either.

    I don't know, perhaps all of this is hick-ups, but I doubt it.
    Are we going to go back to the good-old-days of Gunsmoke where crusty old Doc Adams tells the family, "either he is going to get better, or he's going to die, because I've done all I can... it's out of my hands." This is America, not some third world country! If doctors are expected to see X number of patients per hour in order to meet their office payroll, how much time does anyone expect to receive from him? Craziness!

    In this area, and many others I have read about, hospitals are merging in order to stay afloat, and they are laying off staff. When you are sick or injured, the last thing you need is to be seen by tired, overworked, and upset, doctors and nurses. Time will tell, but I hope it turns out okay for those affected, both hospital staff and patients. Stay healthy!

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    Are we going to go back to the good-old-days of Gunsmoke where crusty old Doc Adams tells the family, "either he is going to get better, or he's going to die, because I've done all I can... it's out of my hands." This is America, not some third world country! If doctors are expected to see X number of patients per hour in order to meet their office payroll, how much time does anyone expect to receive from him? Craziness!

    In this area, and many others I have read about, hospitals are merging in order to stay afloat, and they are laying off staff. When you are sick or injured, the last thing you need is to be seen by tired, overworked, and upset, doctors and nurses. Time will tell, but I hope it turns out okay for those affected, both hospital staff and patients. Stay healthy!
    Yes, the hospital in Henry county where I live has been sold to Piedmont and is no long a county hospital. My old family practice office now has been sold and belongs to Emory. Northside Hospital instead of cutting back has moved into my county and has taken over several doctors offices. It is sort of like the banking system. I remember when every small town in America had their own privately own bank by a local resident, now what do you have, 5 or 6 huge banks blanketing the country and the town bank is now long gone. A memory along with Root Beer Stands and Drive in Movie Theaters.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    Interesting, questions:
    Did you 'flock to' PPACA prior to its passage?...considering the oft repeated proclamation 'we have to pass it to know what's in it'
    Why would Bush fight for legislation when Congress clearly stated 'dead on arrival'?...especially considering his weakened position after the '06 election.
    Off-the-cuff? It seems pretty well delineated:

    Reforming Health Care for the 21st Century
    Note these specific points:

    The bolded ones are quite similar to some currently in PPACA...what is there to NOT get behind?
    1. It was wrong of the Democrats to not work with Bush on negotiating such a proposal and move it forward. Without studying the details further they appear, at least on the surface of it, to have rejected it to deny Bush political points. Result: we all lost.
    2. Bush did not fight for it. The result is it never became a fraction of the all-out national debate it is now. We all lost because of this.
    3. This is dated on February 2006, before the democrats took back control of both houses. Why didn't Bush make this a greater priority?
    4. More telling is that there is a giant debate on health care reform going on right now and you're reaching back six years. That should tell you something.

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I pointed to a real problem for entrepreneurs. Most of them fail, don't forget. And before Obamacare, many of them didn't even try. You bet I complained about the price of it. How much money would YOU have to make before you could afford $15,400 a year for health insurance? Just for you? Most people would simply have to take their chances. You don't think that's worth complaining about? I do.
    What I make now is more than enough to pay $15,400 for health insurance if that was a big priority for me. But I decided to go the other route and don't have to worry about paying the $15,400. That doesn't mean it came without cost to me though, I made less than I could have because I never worked for my self (full time anyway).

    But with Obamadon'tcare, productive peoples costs are going to go up for many if not most that already had/have health insurance. It's certainly going to be more expensive for employers which means people will be paid less or have to go without or less of a pay raise or lose their health insurance. But that's what happens any time the government gets involved, which is one of the reasons why your price was so high to begin with. Government mandates on what has to be covered will not lower the cost. And if it ever gets to a single payer system that the liars wanted all along that passed Obamadon'tcare, people will receive rationed health care. It's the only way the government can control costs. Health insurance in no way means heath care as many are finding out now that are on Medicare.
    "“If we don’t deepen our ports all along the Gulf — places like Charleston, South Carolina; or Savannah, Georgia; or Jacksonville, Florida…” -Obama

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by ItAin'tFree View Post
    What I make now is more than enough to pay $15,400 for health insurance if that was a big priority for me. But I decided to go the other route and don't have to worry about paying the $15,400. That doesn't mean it came without cost to me though, I made less than I could have because I never worked for my self (full time anyway).

    But with Obamadon'tcare, productive peoples costs are going to go up for many if not most that already had/have health insurance. It's certainly going to be more expensive for employers which means people will be paid less or have to go without or less of a pay raise or lose their health insurance. But that's what happens any time the government gets involved, which is one of the reasons why your price was so high to begin with. Government mandates on what has to be covered will not lower the cost. And if it ever gets to a single payer system that the liars wanted all along that passed Obamadon'tcare, people will receive rationed health care. It's the only way the government can control costs. Health insurance in no way means heath care as many are finding out now that are on Medicare.
    You and I are so far apart, we're never going to get even close. If you don't find $15,400 ludicrous as a yearly healthcare cost for someone self-employed, I don't know what to tell you. As for Medicare? My mom is on Medicare. She is treated by doctors through Loyola University Hospital in Maywood, Illinois. She gets the finest care anyone would ever expect from doctors. She has Medicare and a standard Blue Cross Blue Shield supplement.

    As for what health insurance is going to cost pre-post-Obamacare? The verdict isn't in. And as for rationing care? That's up to you as a patient to see that your care isn't rationed. Malpractice lawsuits are pretty effective deterrents against improper medical care.

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Isn't typical of liberal arrogance that now is calling for the best and brightest minds of America coming in to fix a program whose implementation has been a disaster.
    John mcafee got a call to be amongst those best and brightest, he called the coding amateur, and said the entire thing should be scrapped and then to have a whole new team start from scratch, that's how bad the code was.

    To paraphrase, what was said was that it was like a high school kid just filling in pages and hoping that the teacher wouldn't really read the homework...

    That's what 600 million bought.

    Shouldn't have been done prior to attempting the role out and creation of the website?
    Well, the way it usually works is that you write the code, then you have "alpha" testing where you simulate a user using the code, then move to beta testing where you simulate actual usage, and even then there are bound to be some glitches that get corrected... But it's a complete myth that the site fails from massive interest, it fails from bad programming... The development adds a few possibilities:
    A) the team hired was incompetent and screwed up the coding not worried since it was tax payers expense
    B) Obama knowingly hired an incompetent group knowing that the results would mostly fail
    C) the coders were competent but told to fail

    I suppose it's also possible that the coders were competent, but just could not handle the task.

    Here we are hundreds of millions of dollars spent, a website that is a disaster, and supporters still giving Obama credibility?
    It's worse, this is the Nigerian scam; Obama is prince offering his golden ideal, but it's going to have a cost "upfront" in order to get the prize... Now that the first investment is put in, the people refuse to accept when inevitably the prize fails to appear, and Obama asks for more he can even tug
    On the previous investment to pull a larger sun to get the promise....

    Look at the people who do fall for these scams.... They will fight you if you talk bad about the scam artists... Even though they lost their homes in the process.

    Rather frustrating for thinking people to see the failures of Obama being ignored all because of the rhetoric he speaks.
    Ya... That's what makes him so dangerous...

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    Re: 'Delay’ suddenly not a dirty word at White House

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    John mcafee got a call to be amongst those best and brightest, he called the coding amateur, and said the entire thing should be scrapped and then to have a whole new team start from scratch, that's how bad the code was.

    To paraphrase, what was said was that it was like a high school kid just filling in pages and hoping that the teacher wouldn't really read the homework...

    That's what 600 million bought.



    Well, the way it usually works is that you write the code, then you have "alpha" testing where you simulate a user using the code, then move to beta testing where you simulate actual usage, and even then there are bound to be some glitches that get corrected... But it's a complete myth that the site fails from massive interest, it fails from bad programming... The development adds a few possibilities:
    A) the team hired was incompetent and screwed up the coding not worried since it was tax payers expense
    B) Obama knowingly hired an incompetent group knowing that the results would mostly fail
    C) the coders were competent but told to fail

    I suppose it's also possible that the coders were competent, but just could not handle the task.



    It's worse, this is the Nigerian scam; Obama is prince offering his golden ideal, but it's going to have a cost "upfront" in order to get the prize... Now that the first investment is put in, the people refuse to accept when inevitably the prize fails to appear, and Obama asks for more he can even tug
    On the previous investment to pull a larger sun to get the promise....

    Look at the people who do fall for these scams.... They will fight you if you talk bad about the scam artists... Even though they lost their homes in the process.



    Ya... That's what makes him so dangerous...
    Macfee, was he the guy who became a fugitve after supposedly killing his neighbor in south america?

    GOP asked tech founder, ex-fugitive McAfee to diagnose Obamacare - NBC News.com

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