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Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143:248]

re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

I refuted your claim that the constitution was devoted to one purpose, and one purpose only (ie to secure liberty)

Oh...come on...you didn't refute anything. You just disagreed.

Looks like you are about ready to slink away.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Oh...come on...you didn't refute anything. You just disagreed.

Looks like you are about ready to slink away.

The Preamble states several reasons why we adopted a constitution. It is more than just securing liberty

You're in denial

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

The Preamble states several reasons why we adopted a constitution. It is more than just securing liberty

You're in denial

shrug...

I guess I'm just going to get the same old blah, blah, blah from you with nothing to back it up.

So it goes.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

We would have loved to be included. Too bad that demo's that had total control over government chose to lock those doors. As for "death panels", we will see won't we? And "offing gramma" really? You want to go there? Remember that ad about Ryan? Who did that? Repubs or demo's?

Like I said, there is plenty of blame to go around. Neither party has to hog it all.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Um, it is the polar opposite of a totalitarian state.

You didn't have to make your argument so false.

Sure. We're forcing you to buy something you don't want to buy, and telling you that it's the opposite of a totalitarian state. War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Keep repeating the lines until you believe them.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Sure. We're forcing you to buy something you don't want to buy, and telling you that it's the opposite of a totalitarian state. War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Keep repeating the lines until you believe them.

and we have no right to tell anyone that they must purchase insurance that they don't want, as long as we're willing to just let them do without.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Straw, i did not say you did More straw, I never claimed you did. more straw.I disagree. I think it is a fundamental mandate for the state to provide for the general welfare of a population, which at base is the right to basic medical care. This does not preclude that caregivers are slaves, anymore than poll workers when providing the operation of a voting site are slaves.

It is a specious argument meant only to derail.

As was bringing up poll workers. The existence of poll workers has nothing to do with your rights. Now you want to discuss the issue?
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Nope

No one is forced to purchase insurance, either

Oh? So then what's all the flap about the mandate then?
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

and we have no right to tell anyone that they must purchase insurance that they don't want, as long as we're willing to just let them do without.

But you see, that's the problem.

Conservatives are perfectly willing to let people make their own choices...knowing they will need to take the responsiblity of actually MAKING choices.

Liberals, on the other hand are perfectly willing to to have the government make the choices and have the government assume the responsibility.

And a whole lot of people don't want to make choices OR take responsibility.

Such is the result in our society of nanny government.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

But you see, that's the problem.

Conservatives are perfectly willing to let people make their own choices...knowing they will need to take the responsiblity of actually MAKING choices.

Liberals, on the other hand are perfectly willing to to have the government make the choices and have the government assume the responsibility.

And a whole lot of people don't want to make choices OR take responsibility.

Such is the result in our society of nanny government.

That is the problem for sure, but nobody is willing to just let people die as a result of their irresponsibility. We wind up paying one way or another, either through taxes or higher rates. Therefore, we should have the right to insist that people provide their own insurance.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

I think it is a fundamental mandate for the state to provide for the general welfare of a population, which at base is the right to basic medical care. This does not preclude that caregivers are slaves, anymore than poll workers when providing the operation of a voting site are slaves.

It is a specious argument meant only to derail.
As was bringing up poll workers. The existence of poll workers has nothing to do with your rights. Now you want to discuss the issue?
FFS, you lost track of your argument, you started this loop I am trying to close by saying:

You can never have a right to a service that someone else provides, unless the providers of the service are slaves. Are you advocating slavery?
Again, the provider of the service DOES not have to be a slave, the state via the citizens PAYS for the service, whether the service is provided by a poll worker or a medical worker.

There is no need for "slaves". Rights are not dependent upon "slaves". It is a specious argument.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Sure. We're forcing you to buy something you don't want to buy, and telling you that it's the opposite of a totalitarian state. War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Keep repeating the lines until you believe them.
The immaturity of a libertarian argument. You don't "want" it.....until you are lying in your own blood, unconscious.

Your next argument will be to leave you lying there.....or that you are immortal.

Try learning sometime before you get yourself in trouble the difference between "want" and "need".

The kicker is....you don't have to buy it, you can remain as irresponsible as you desire. Your desire is not free....but some have such high levels of paranoia and infantilism as to call this "totalitarianism".
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

It's not totalitarianism, but it would be if it was actually effective. The individual mandate is unenforceable and will not actually result in everyone buying insurance, or even most people.

At some point, there is going to be a choice to make: abandon the project or impose draconian penalties for failure to acquire insurance.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

It's not totalitarianism, but it would be if it was actually effective. The individual mandate is unenforceable and will not actually result in everyone buying insurance, or even most people.

At some point, there is going to be a choice to make: abandon the project or impose draconian penalties for failure to acquire insurance.

Like the rest of that law, Obamacare's penalties are bizarre and ill-thought out...but draconian, I suppose, is a relative term and some would probably consider the penalties a few years down the road to be draconian. Of course, Democrats will probably just say that we can always "tweak" the penalties to make them better or worse if we have to.

 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

You know . . . when you contrive a new system you're supposed to TEST IT first. Test - fix - test - fix - and so on, so forth, until it's within a margin of accuracy.

I gather that they didn't consider this at all.

This is what happens when a system is built by people who have never had a real job and stand on political theory.
 
re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Moderator's Warning:
Attacking other posters instead of addressing the OP is likely to get you thread banned. Be careful.
 
Re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

It's not totalitarianism, but it would be if it was actually effective. The individual mandate is unenforceable and will not actually result in everyone buying insurance, or even most people.

At some point, there is going to be a choice to make: abandon the project or impose draconian penalties for failure to acquire insurance.

Sensible people will sign up for insurance. The rest will continue to rely on the largess of government when lying there in the pool of blood, but, at least, they will have paid a tax that partially offsets the costs incurred by the more responsible among us.
 
Re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

It's not a matter of responsibility. Should people be required to insure against every possible fate that could befall them? Should they also prioritize these products over their everyday needs?

It's stupid to insure yourself against medical costs when you can't feed yourself or keep a roof over your head. It's even stupider for the government to tell you what to prioritize.
 
Re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

Sensible people will sign up for insurance. The rest will continue to rely on the largess of government when lying there in the pool of blood, but, at least, they will have paid a tax that partially offsets the costs incurred by the more responsible among us.

I've seen reports that the administration needs up to 7 million healthy young adults to be registered, and signed up by January 2014, or this thing collapses....Then what? Delay? Start over? What? And how much money will be wasted in the mean time? So far we have a web site that reported costs total out at over $600 million, and doesn't work, plus they had 3 damned years to get it right!!!! I mean they can't even get the damned web site running, how the hell are they going to actually oversee the system? It's Bull!

And the arrogance of all of this...Pelosi, and others out there saying that it's a success? Touting "unique visits" what the hell is that? They are even going as far as to try and pull a slight of hand and say that it's rolling out just fine because 500K people have filled out the application? Look, people know when they are being conned, I hope anyway...The way this website is set up, you must fill out the application just to look at the plans....So, how many have filled out the application, means NOTHING!

Then speaking of arrogance, with all these problems, congress wants to talk with Sebilus, and what is her response? A big fat "No, I don't have time for you".... "I have a Gala in Boston to attend"....What the hell?
 
Re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

That's pretty much where I am, Mycroft. Someone who has a dog in the fight (that would be a licensed insurance salesperson) is well trained and very much into customer service. His motivation is quite different from that of a customer service rep sitting in a bullpen taking one call after another ad infinitum.

Yeah, Maggie, but they're out for profit, which means their goal is to screw you! ;)
 
Re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

and we have no right to tell anyone that they must purchase insurance that they don't want, as long as we're willing to just let them do without.

I don't have a right to tell you how to live your life, as long as I'm willing to let you live with the consequences of your decisions. Are politicians supposed to work for us, or are they supposed to be our parents?
 
Re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

That is the problem for sure, but nobody is willing to just let people die as a result of their irresponsibility. We wind up paying one way or another, either through taxes or higher rates. Therefore, we should have the right to insist that people provide their own insurance.

So progressives create a problem, and then bring us the solution to the problem they've created. That's how it works.
 
Re: Insurers reportedly receiving faulty data from ObamaCare exchanges [W:143]

FFS, you lost track of your argument, you started this loop I am trying to close by saying:

Again, the provider of the service DOES not have to be a slave, the state via the citizens PAYS for the service, whether the service is provided by a poll worker or a medical worker.

There is no need for "slaves". Rights are not dependent upon "slaves". It is a specious argument.

If I have a right to the product of your labor, then you are my slave. You equate paying for a service and being forced to provide service to someone. That is a specious argument.
 
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