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Thread: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Tourists aren't all they're cracked up to be. Even when the park is open they tend not to follow the rules and leave their garbage around and put themselves and others in danger. Every year we hear about some tourist getting lost, or stranded on a cliff ledge or getting too close to the buffalo and the bears. Some tourists are just rude, obnoxious assholes and think the world should revolve around them. I suspect that's the case for most of those tourists complaining the loudest.
    Have you ever even visited Utah's parks or do you just sit in your house and bitch about them?

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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    And the easiest and cheapest way to protect the park and buildings is to keep the park free from people
    "Easiest" and "cheapest" are not requirements and never has been. If they were the facilities would never be open to the public in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    As for slips and falls, it is not a signage issue when the area is not normally a slip or fall area. Grocery stores can and are sued when they do not have tripping/slippery hazard signs up (in cases of recent mopping), in cases of fruit (grapes for instance) being on the floor with no sign present, it can lead to a lawsuit and has.
    Yes it is. You start by denying it and then proving it with your examples.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    Case 2, given there would be no park staff except for a few park rangers, they would have difficultly finding someone to report the problem too. Phone lines could and most likely be down, the lack of staff could be seen as negligent, and leave the government open to being sued
    But there IS park staff there, who exactly do you think is ticketting the people. Who is doing the exempted protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    Case 3. Aunt Abby is a German tourist, who can not read English, and no park guides were around to provide warnings, again negligent in protecting the public from hazards
    And since when was it a requirement for park rangers to speak all the languages of the earth? Indeed it is a signage issue and the German tourist has no case.

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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    So you are changing the subject from national parks to all fed lands or are you saying Utah would turn Arches into a parking lot?.
    I believe she is saying that Utah would 'privatize' the National Parks, though I must say they have had some pretty good Governors in my 40 years going out there.
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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    Under normal circumstances, having janitorial staff would be allowed. Thus the park could be open to the general public. The same would go with the other park staff from security to general admin. This is not normal, and only those which are essential to the protection of the land and building is allowed. Having janitors on the job so the public can see the geyser is not essential and could lead to the manager being arrested
    Hah! Not even by a long shot. Either the staff is there to protect the park or they are not. The staff may be reduced, but once again, signage that already exists can easily be put in place. Those who are doing the ticketting of these runners for example could easily also be ticketting for littering in a national park (huge, huge fines.)

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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Call on me please..
    Just a stroll in on I-70 from Grand Junction leads you through the Great Swale/Dixie Natl Forest, where road signs remind you of driving weary..At close to 8,000, you need a stiff caffeine and some legal speed.
    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Have you ever even visited Utah's parks or do you just sit in your house and bitch about them?
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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    And we still haven't touched on National Forests and National Monuments, which the Black Canyon of the Gunnison used to be, before gaining status to the National Park level.
    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Hah! Not even by a long shot. Either the staff is there to protect the park or they are not. The staff may be reduced, but once again, signage that already exists can easily be put in place. Those who are doing the ticketting of these runners for example could easily also be ticketting for littering in a national park (huge, huge fines.)
    Physics is Phun

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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    [QUOTE=upsideguy;1062419568]
    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post



    The states already get the revenue that national parks bring in.... They may not get park admission fees, but they get ALL of the other revenue generated by tourists (which is 95% of the revenue to be gained by having a national park). The states are anxious to reopen these parks because their closure, particularly in a state like Utah, has a huge negative impact on tourism.

    Moreover, its actually in the states interest to have a national park rather than a state park as 1) the national government picks up the capital expenditure tab, which is huge (yet states benefit) and 2) a national park has much more panache than a state park (how many people go out of their way to go the the Adirondack park, even though it is twice as large as Yelllowstone?)
    I'm talking admission fees, national parks are money making machines.

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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    "Easiest" and "cheapest" are not requirements and never has been. If they were the facilities would never be open to the public in the first place.
    If there is no staff to put up a tripping hazard sign then it is a potential lawsuit. Tripping/ slipping hazard signs can be portable and moved where required.


    Yes it is. You start by denying it and then proving it with your examples.



    But there IS park staff there, who exactly do you think is ticketting the people. Who is doing the exempted protecting?
    They are protecting the land and building, not answering phones. How would the family get ahold of a park ranger, but by calling the park hq, which might not have any staff
    And since when was it a requirement for park rangers to speak all the languages of the earth? Indeed it is a signage issue and the German tourist has no case.
    Again it would depend

    If people can sue from kids drowning in pools

    The family alleges that the child care center's employees should have known that Vicente was "a hyperactive child" and an inexperienced swimmer, and that they failed to provide proper supervision on the day of the incident.

    Michael Carter, an attorney representing the Cardenas family, said his clients suffered tremendous emotional trauma and are seeking damages in excess of $10 million.

    "What happened here is beyond negligence," Carter said. "You don't open a pool to kids unless you provide a safe environment for them."
    Family sues over boy's 2012 drowning - Chicago Tribune

    They can sue for someone being burnt from a geyser
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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Hah! Not even by a long shot. Either the staff is there to protect the park or they are not. The staff may be reduced, but once again, signage that already exists can easily be put in place. Those who are doing the ticketting of these runners for example could easily also be ticketting for littering in a national park (huge, huge fines.)
    if the parks are operating less staff then normal, then the remaining members of the staff have to take up more jobs and tasks then the ones they are normally trained to do.

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    Re: Utah national parks to open Saturday with state aid

    Not nearly as much as they should be..That's just me though..
    Remember when we had this funding problem with NEWT back in the 90's..
    Finally doubled the 13-month pass to $50 from $25, still underpriced..
    Many great Park projects were then completed.
    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post

    I'm talking admission fees, national parks are money making machines.
    Physics is Phun

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