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Dr. Carson: Obamacare The Worst Thing That Has Happened Since Slavery

rcart76 said:
J-mac

Are we just talking about healthcare or all entitlements?

On the subject of things like welfare and housing, we can have some common ground. But you are dead wrong if believe that Christ is against healthcare access for everyone. And how is making healthcare affordable to people teaching them how to be lazy????

Like I said Getting treatment to live shouldn't be called a entitlement.
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Again, since you went there, and I didn't, all you have to do is show specifically where Christ would have advocated that we take care of each other at the force of Pilot.
 
Rocketman said:
We are not responsible for you, you are.
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I disagree

I think we have a moral responsibility to help those in need.

Don't get me wrong, we can trim a lot of social nets of fat. Same with corporate entitlements.

But healthcare is something that I am not budging on.
 
rcart76 said:
For any black man who grew up in the 50s to say that Obamacare is worse than the Jim Crow laws has no respect for the sacrifices of civil rights movement PERIOD!!!!!

And by the way, because his family was so poor, he grew up on medical assistance. Funny that he bashes a government program that was his family only option back then for medical coverage.
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That's the difficult part. He HAS to know better. There's no way you could grow up living the life he lived and believe that Obamacare was the worst thing since slavery. I mean, he personally experienced a hell of a lot worse than a $700 annual fine for not having insurance.

I think the easiest way to understand Carson is as a psychopath. That doesn't make him crazy or bad, it just means that he's making decisions without considering the effect on others. That's a trait that that's much more attractive in a surgeon than a leader. Look at his childhood, there's a number of instances where he exhibited abnormal reactions to small copfrontations.
Despite his academic successes, Ben Carson still had a raging temper that translated into violent behavior as a child. One time he tried to hit is mother with a hammer because she disagreed with his choice of clothes. Another time, he inflicted a major head injury on a classmate in a dispute over a locker. In a final incident, Ben nearly stabbed to death a friend after arguing over a choice of radio stations.
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Those aren't normal reactions.

In short, I seriously doubt that Carson believes a word of what he's saying. He's playing the part of the "Tea Party" saviour because they're the most gullible. The Tea Party will go nuts for anyone willing to to say a few ridiculous things about the president. There's a long list of people who quickly risen to national prominence that way: Trump, Palin, Bauchman, Cruz, Limbaugh, etc.. Carson's just following their example.
 
rcart76 said:
I disagree

I think we have a moral responsibility to help those in need.

Don't get me wrong, we can trim a lot of social nets of fat. Same with corporate entitlements.

But healthcare is something that I am not budging on.
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Start with that, next thing you know the people running the healthcare will tell you bacon and cheeseburgers are off limits, no more eggs, gone is that summer ice cream cone. Much of that is already happening with this new healthcare rollout.
 
j-mac said:
Again, since you went there, and I didn't, all you have to do is show specifically where Christ would have advocated that we take care of each other at the force of Pilot.
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IF the Romans wanted to make sure that everyone had access to healthcare, I highly doubt that Jesus would have stood before Pilot and told him that this act is not the will of God.

I'm not saying that everything should go through the government, but defense and healthcare should be on their todo list.
 
Rocketman said:
Start with that, next thing you know the people running the healthcare will tell you bacon and cheeseburgers are off limits, no more eggs, gone is that summer ice cream cone. Much of that is already happening with this new healthcare rollout.
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that is not true..


They are offering incentives to companies to lower their premiums by making their employees healthier. It is called healthy pathways and I think it is a great idea.
 
rcart76 said:
that is not true..


They are offering incentives to companies to lower their premiums by making their employees healthier. It is called healthy pathways and I think it is a great idea.
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I think it is bull**** since it is not based on any facts
 
Rocketman said:
the choices one makes in life have more to do with their future than the environment around them
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The aborigine living in a mud hut could have the exact same life as Paris Hilton. They just made the wrong choices.
The child sold as a sex slave could have made something with their life, had they just made better choices.

I really hope you don't actually believe that you are where you are primarily because of your "choices". That's a pretty hefty amount of blind arrogance.
 
Mithros said:
The aborigine living in a mud hut could have the exact same life as Paris Hilton. They just made the wrong choices.
The child sold as a sex slave could have made something with their life, had they just made better choices.

I really hope you don't actually believe that you are where you are primarily because of your "choices". That's a pretty hefty amount of blind arrogance.
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Damn good thing MLK, Julius Erving, Jim Brown, Bill Cosby, Colin Powel, and Obama did not believe as you do.
 
rcart76 said:
Facts

I work for a company that monitors the HRA for health plans. LOL
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false. I don't take in medication and don't need any for BP, sugar, cholesterol, or joint pain, yet I have to suffer this crap because of my size even thought I workout EVERY day.
 
Rocketman said:
We are not responsible for you, you are.
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Say you're in an accident. You have health care, but you're unconscious and don't have any documentation on you. Would you like to be treated? How does the EMT know that you have insurance? Maybe they should check before doing any work?

The only way to ensure that you'll be treated is to mandate that hospitals and EMTs treat EVERYONE, regardless of their ability to pay. That means that we're going to treat people who can't pay their bills. But someone has to pay, so everyone with insurance has to pay an extra $1000 to cover the people who aren't insured.

By choosing to not have insurance, you are placing a burden on the rest of society. What is so godawfully wrong about taxing someone a portion of the average amount they will cost the rest of us, by not having insurance?
 
Mithros said:
Say you're in an accident. You have health care, but you're unconscious and don't have any documentation on you. Would you like to be treated? How does the EMT know that you have insurance? Maybe they should check before doing any work?

The only way to ensure that you'll be treated is to mandate that hospitals and EMTs treat EVERYONE, regardless of their ability to pay. That means that we're going to treat people who can't pay their bills. But someone has to pay, so everyone with insurance has to pay an extra $1000 to cover the people who aren't insured.

By choosing to not have insurance, you are placing a burden on the rest of society. What is so godawfully wrong about taxing someone a portion of the average amount they will cost the rest of us, by not having insurance?
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choices again, again choices, I always have documentation on me, extremism will not prove your point
 
Rocketman said:
Damn good thing MLK, Julius Erving, Jim Brown, Bill Cosby, Colin Powel, and Obama did not believe as you do.
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Uhhhh......Which of them had the arrogance to believe that they were primarily self made men?

Look, if you've been successful, you didn't get there on your own. You didn't get there on your own. I'm always struck by people who think, "Well, it must be because I was just so smart!" There are a lot of smart people out there. "It must be because I worked harder than everybody else." Let me tell you something. There are a whole bunch of hardworkin' people out there! If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help! There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive.
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rcart76 said:
I disagree. I think we have a moral responsibility to help those in need.
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So do most people, but having the government do it instead you is not only abrogating your personal and social responsibilities, you are also allowing the government too much power. Health care in the foreseeable future will no longer be assured but will have to be meted out, largely through money or social status.
 
Grant said:
So do most people, but having the government do it instead you is not only abrogating your personal and social responsibilities, you are also allowing the government too much power. Health care in the foreseeable future will no longer be assured but will have to be meted out, largely through money or social status.
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but is'nt that the case now, except it is the insurance company's meting out insurance based on money or health status?
 
Mithros said:
Say you're in an accident. You have health care, but you're unconscious and don't have any documentation on you. Would you like to be treated? How does the EMT know that you have insurance? Maybe they should check before doing any work?

The only way to ensure that you'll be treated is to mandate that hospitals and EMTs treat EVERYONE, regardless of their ability to pay. That means that we're going to treat people who can't pay their bills. But someone has to pay, so everyone with insurance has to pay an extra $1000 to cover the people who aren't insured.

By choosing to not have insurance, you are placing a burden on the rest of society. What is so godawfully wrong about taxing someone a portion of the average amount they will cost the rest of us, by not having insurance?
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when has it become someone's civic duty to pay the price for others bad decisions and life styles. when has it become my job to pay for the health cost of the fat asses with heart dieses and diabetes when has it become my responsibility to pay for the bad health of a smoker who has lung cancer. the alcoholic with a bad liver or the drug addict with hepatitis or the whore with aids
 
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trfjr said:
when has it become someone's civic duty to pay the price for others bad decisions and life styles. when has it become my job to pay for the health cost of the fat asses with heart dieses and diabetes when has it become my responsibility to pay for the bad health of a smoker who has lung cancer. the alcoholic with a bad liver or the drug addict with hepatitis or the whore with aids
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Since 1986, because of the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act signed by... oh no... dear god.. signed by Ronald Reagan.

Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Unitedwestand13 said:
but is'nt that the case now, except it is the insurance company's meting out insurance based on money or health status?
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Right. But you are exchanging one third party involvement with a fourth party involvement and a fifth if we include employers. People still don't understand it and it was passed along party lines with no one having read it. And even if they tried they couldn't get passed the begats.

I think many forget how much people cared about the health of each other at one time, supporting the war effort through bonds, contributing to the March of Dimes, how everyone helped with polio victims, people sacrificing much of their lives to help others. Now we expect the government to act for us rather than our family and neighbors. Perhaps this lack of communication between people, with the government in the middle, is what is contributing to the deterioration of many neighborhoods, and relationships.
 
Grant said:
So do most people, but having the government do it instead you is not only abrogating your personal and social responsibilities, you are also allowing the government too much power. Health care in the foreseeable future will no longer be assured but will have to be meted out, largely through money or social status.
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Grant

Maybe that is the difference between our thinking.

I don't trust government a lot, but I trust corporation even less. They are in the business to make profits and the only way they can do that is to retain as much revenue as they possibly can. I know too many people who have to consistently fight these bastards to cover a treatment including myself. I have a co-worker who had to put off a surgery for three months because she couldn't afford the deductible she had to pay up front. she would walk around in pain and I felt so bad for her.

The reason she waited is because her benefits would have kick in after 90 days. But what if she didn't have a job? what could she have done?
 
rcart76 said:
Grant

Maybe that is the difference between our thinking.

I don't trust government a lot, but I trust corporation even less. They are in the business to make profits and the only way they can do that is to retain as much revenue as they possibly can. I know too many people who have to consistently fight these bastards to cover a treatment including myself. I have a co-worker who had to put off a surgery for three months because she couldn't afford the deductible she had to pay up front. she would walk around in pain and I felt so bad for her.

The reason she waited is because her benefits would have kick in after 90 days. But what if she didn't have a job? what could she have done?
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you can always decide what cooperation you will or will not spend your money with. you don't have that choice with government
 
Grant said:
Right. But you are exchanging one third party involvement with a fourth party involvement and a fifth if we include employers. People still don't understand it and it was passed along party lines with no one having read it. And even if they tried they couldn't get passed the begats.

I think many forget how much people cared about the health of each other at one time, supporting the war effort through bonds, contributing to the March of Dimes, how everyone helped with polio victims, people sacrificing much of their lives to help others. Now we expect the government to act for us rather than our family and neighbors. Perhaps this lack of communication between people, with the government in the middle, is what is contributing to the deterioration of many neighborhoods, and relationships.
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Grant

Base on population growth as well as healthcare cost, those days are done. If the government wasn't even involved, we would still be staring at overwhelming heathcare cost.
 
trfjr said:
you can always decide what cooperation you will or will not spend your money with. you don't have that choice with government
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Actually you do. If you look at the plans online, they are the same healthcare providers that we commonly use.

Blue Cross
Aetna
Humana
etc...
 
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